Spine Whacks and Lock Strength

I'm not "calling other companies out". I just thought it was really interesting.
We do a great deal of testing here at Cold Steel. Much of it is never released to the public.
It's interesting to see a member of the knife buying public making his own tests (I try to watch every review and test that I can) and I was intrigued by the results.

Our PROOF videos have always been available for anyone to see. They show extreme use and abuse of our product and we are very proud of them.
Many of the feats shown in our videos were initially inspired by tests conducted by the American Bladesmith's Society. Lynn had a lot of admiration for the tests that they performed and the amazing knives that they produced.
You may remember that in the 80's our tantos had to pass the tests created by the Bladesmith's Society. We took great pride in that.
PROOF was essentially a continuation of those tests.
Remember, we were asking for over $100 for a knife - that was a lot of money! - and we wanted to prove to everyone why we believed that our product was worth that expense.
Every time we make PROOF we try to invent new and interesting ways to test our stuff. Over the years these tests have varied but some things have remained a constant.
We believe that a sharp knife should be a strong knife - and that we shouldn't just make a knife for the every day tasks but for the extraordinary situations too. We want to make knives that can not only open your mail or slice your apple but that can be there for you and save your life in a pinch.
It's a big ask for a folding knife and it's something we feel very strongly about.
Shock and over strike tests aren't there for the day-to-day use of a knife (I still carry my Grandfather's old slipjoint that serves admirably in many of those chores), they are there for the SHTF moments that you never expect and I pray you never experience.
Sadly though, these things happen and I take comfort in knowing that I have a knife in my pocket that is equal to those challenges.

Now, this is worth clarifying - PROOF is also made to entertain as well as educate. We have fun making these videos and though we are very serious about our products we don't take ourselves too seriously.
We've actively been involved in multiple "spoofs" of what we do (meat bike anyone?) and some of the things in our official videos are actually in-jokes.
For example the "pose" with the knife after cutting came from back in the day when we only had one camera. Lynn, Robert and the rest of the guys had to stand still while we filmed a close up of the edge of the knife.
Now we have multiple cameras and they still strike those poses :rolleyes:
Maybe we should start including a blooper reel where people can see how often they laugh making these videos? There is much more of a sense of humor here than the haters may realize.
By making our own company President and his crew the "faces" of these videos we have of course opened them up to ridicule from armchair critics and trolls, but when we began this journey it was a small team testing their own products in their parking lot. Beating on their knives to see what would happen - Not very different from the user videos on youtube today...

I hope that helps explain a few things and it wasn't too much of a rant :)

Also, regarding your warranty question - well, it's hard to say. It would be judged entirely on the situation. It's rare that any of our products fail, but if it did we would do everything we could to try and help.
 
I received the proof series on dvd in the mail not too long ago, and of course my little guy wanted to watch them.
I admit they were entertaining and impressive, the only thing is that of course he wanted to test his mini ak-47 for himself, and I had to keep reminding him just how unsafe that could be.
He ended doing a few tests under my supervision and we had a great time doing them, I just hope that all of the other kids have a responsible adult with them.

Btw, I was impressed with the results. He cut up a 2x4 and some rope, and then destroyed a couple of old cell phones.
No blade movement or chipping.
 
dear cold steel, hello im the poor sap that sent in a tri ad ak47 in the plastic bag in pieces :) it took a ten pound sledge full swing at the overstrike location with the knife suspended on two bricks to get it to fail, which was simply the blade breaking. benchmade is now destructive testing their knives on youtube with a constant force addative machine that measures the constant force for the point and lock. you should get one theyre shiny :)
 
Constant force is interesting (we've done it with weight hangs for years now) but I am very interested in shock and over-strikes.
Something you can't plan for and is incredibly tough on a folder...
 
I only destroyed one CS folder.

I had used a Vaquero Grande for years in the woods, cutting back thorn bushes from the trail and vines off trees. Total success. It was like a pocket machete. I decided to try the very similar Voyager XL clip point. Didn't take long before I saw huge chunks broken out of the edge. I am sure the difference was the Voyager hollow grind vs. the Vaquero flat grind.

I replaced the XL with a large to go with my large tanto. Slice, don't chop! :D
 
One last thing: If I bought a Cold Steel knife from another member here on Blade Forums and it failed, would Cold Steel warranty my knife?

For the answer to these questions, we must read the OP/Moderators signature line.
 
Constant force is interesting (we've done it with weight hangs for years now) but I am very interested in shock and over-strikes.
Something you can't plan for and is incredibly tough on a folder...


Over strikes will destroy most regular lock backs in a real hurry from what I have seen over the years, broke my 1st knife back in the late 70's doing over strikes and it didn't take very long either.
 
Most of the people posting here about CS folders are just the haters, & dont know what they are talking about. I have had locks fail in my 51 years visiting this planet. And i was using them for what a knife is supposed to be used for, not anything but cutting. CS locks are the best on the market.
 
Shock and over strike tests aren't there for the day-to-day use of a knife (I still carry my Grandfather's old slipjoint that serves admirably in many of those chores), they are there for the SHTF moments that you never expect and I pray you never experience.
Sadly though, these things happen and I take comfort in knowing that I have a knife in my pocket that is equal to those challenges.

That's exactly how I see it too. I find these tests valuable for just this reason. :thumbup:
 
I have had locks fail in my 51 years visiting this planet. And i was using them for what a knife is supposed to be used for, not anything but cutting.

Seriously?
I'm only 36 years on this planet, but I have never had a lock fail from regular use.
Hell, I've never had even a cheap Pakistani lock-back fail when doing stupid crap like stabbing trees and other pointless stuff.
Also, I like the Tri-Ad lock, but better than the AXIS and compression lock?
That remains to be proven.
Equal? Sure, I'll buy that. Better? Nah.
 
"Better" is what works for you. Mechanics of the lock are secondary.
The only Tri-ad I have takes real effort to release. I don't like locks as loose as the axis lock.
Compression is great -- but backwards. The only compression lock I could release one-handed was on the Gunting.
 
Also, I like the Tri-Ad lock, but better than the AXIS and compression lock?
That remains to be proven.

We are very proud of it. We've been showing our tests and proving the Tri-Ads capabilities for quite some time.
We make this information available for everyone and they can make their own choices.
I believe more companies should do the same.

My day to day cutting chores usually don't extend much more than opening boxes, cutting cable ties, cutting cardboard etc. but even then I appreciate the confidence that a Tri-Ad lock gives me.
Pressure on a lock can come from a lot more than just combative, survival, hard-use or life-and-death situations that we frequently talk about here at Cold Steel. Sometimes it can be nothing more than a weird angle on a bad day.
I've seen lock failures and cut fingers. It's not pretty.
To those people who say "well, it's never happened to me" all I can say is "good". I wouldn't wish that on anyone
 
Chiinnature, man.....how much sheetrock repair work have you done in that room?! Swinging all those blades around HAD to result in a "few" accidents
:D
 
Chiinnature, man.....how much sheetrock repair work have you done in that room?! Swinging all those blades around HAD to result in a "few" accidents
:D

um.. maybe you replied the wrong thread? You are trying to reply the butterfly swords thread right? hahaha.. well no, I don't make any accident happen in that room even I swing a staff or kwandao around.

[video=youtube;tDJyFlSQZA4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDJyFlSQZA4[/video]

[video=youtube;nrqmNKvkfjg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrqmNKvkfjg[/video]

see? I told ya, those small butterfly swords are way too easy, hahaahah!
 
I have a few folders and the locks I trust the most are the Triad and Axis locks, I am just an old fool but I believe those are the strongest locks you can buy no matter how much you pay for a knife.
 
TriAd lock is stronger then Axis lock..

Benchmade Adamas with Axis-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWz_JLXgIL0&list=PLY9D3AYsrgroHCmnTqjeiSphI_-726zhE&index=14

Cold Steel Recon 1 all G10 the same tests.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARqrMkbSdCA&list=PLY9D3AYsrgroHCmnTqjeiSphI_-726zhE&index=23

Cold Steel Spartan vs Pohl Force Alpha 2 the same tests
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9PomOMYt9o&list=PLY9D3AYsrgroHCmnTqjeiSphI_-726zhE&index=26

Cold Steel Voyager: Hard Use. Batoning. Not any of fixed knives can survive this..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SO9e-fx-oA


TriAd is the monster of locks. AUS8 from Cold Steel... hm..on some knives it chips relatively easily. Though on some knives it does well.
Where aus8 on Recon 1(on both old and new version) was brittle (even CRKT M16 with AUS 8 did better at same tests), on Spartan AUS8 was good.

CRKT M16 with AUS8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfVBSW7tO9k&list=PLY9D3AYsrgroHCmnTqjeiSphI_-726zhE&index=25


Anyway I like Cold Steel knives much. Have 7 different knives. Talwar 5.5" , 4" and Code 4 are already in my wish list :)
 
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I was always under the impression that with the Tri-Ad lock the size of the knife was relative to it's strength?

For instance the 3.5" American Lawman will not hold as much weight as the 4" Recon 1, and the Recon 1 won't hold as much as the 4.5" Spartan and so forth going forward. The strongest models being the 5.5"- 6" blade models and the strongest overall being the XL Espada.

With the AXIS lock it would seem that 4" and below knives hold more weight then the Cold Steel knives of comparatively the same size? At least that's been my impression from the test video's I've seen from both companies and independent testing. The sub 4" Adamas vs. the 4" Recon 1 as the best example. But the 4" plus AXIS models strength doesn't increase with size. The Onslaught vs.The Spartan for example. I readily admit I could be wrong but that has been my observation to date.

I also agree that there's more to overall strength then how much weight you can hang off the back or how many spine whacks it can take before failure. It's just one of many indicators.

Anyway you "cut it" though we're talking about some amazingly strong locks. Although you may never need the full strength offered by these locks it sure is nice to know what they are capable of. I have complete confidence in both.

I have had a lock fail on me and broken a couple of blades but I will admit I was using my knife in a manner it wasn't exactly designed for. However, at the time I really didn't have a choice. Like I said, you may never need the full strength afforded by these locks but it's nice to know what they are capable of just in case.

I think Cold Steel deserves a lot of credit for the Tri-Ad lock. No question when you have one you have a lot of confidence in your knife. I know I do.
 
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My 4" Recon 1 surprised me. It's opening action is very smooth and flips right open buttery smooth. My Spartan was another story. The lock was so tight there was no way to flip it open using thumb plate and my thumb. But I loved knowing and feeling the blade lock up like a vault. I left the blade half open for a few days and oiled it again now its perfect but did I weaken the locks ability? Is the smooth opening of my Recon brand new out of the box a sign of a weaker lock up compared to the very stiff action of my Spartan as it came out of the box.
 
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