Strider Knives, Game Over!

[LukeMacGillie]

The other comments/attempted whitty quibs aren't even worth a comment or response about scanning my docs, sissy CONTRACTOR work, not in military, NO DD214 etc...That's like a piece of Dog Feces on my shoe. Wash it off and go about my day...

Tamishigiri,

From what Ive been able to gather you were a good troop when in the military, and I can understand why you want to put so much emphasis on 214's. But you opened up the the whole can of worms regarding BW when you posted the Jackson letter.

It carries about as much weight as a letter from Lee Iacoca about the work done by a guy on the assembly line in a plant in Toledo Ohio.

What would BW's WPPS managers or your Team Leaders have to say about you, what would the RSO have to say about you?

 

[Ed T]

Lance,
You came here to challenge credibility. You refuse to meet the same standard you hold others to. Why?

 

[Ed T]

The other comments/attempted whitty quibs aren't even worth a comment or response about scanning my docs, sissy CONTRACTOR work, not in military, NO DD214 etc...That's like a piece of Dog Feces on my shoe. Wash it off and go about my day...

Odd. Now you sound like the Strider folks. Weird. I guess we have come full circle.

 

[roughedges]

Lance,
You came here to challenge credibility. You refuse to meet the same standard you hold others to. Why?

Call some of those numbers he posted, Ed T. Kinda hard to attack a man's credibility when he has made at least some effort (unlike others) to offer up proof. Additionally, the proof he has offered negates the claim that he was fired from Blackwater; a DD214 wouldn't negate that claim, would it?

And if he had posted his 214 instead of the letters, I imagine you'd be telling him the exact same thing.

 

[Tamishigiri]

Luke,

I generally would not comment BUT because I respect you and HONOR and acknowledge your service I will address you in these responses.


FTR, THERE is NO place anywhere where I EVER represent that I was in the military. I'm what is reffered to as "NME". Some, have attempted to take CHEAP shots about that. I again, could care less. Does that alone make someone NOT a PATRIOT, NOT capable of Tactics, not capable of defending anyone, NOT capable of ?


I submit it does NOT if a person has the TRAINING of aforementioned MILITARY TACTICS, protocols, TT&P's, specialty skill sets etc...

I have been fortunate enought to have STUDIED, TRAINED, LEARNED those necessary skill sets to QUALIFY me for COMBAT service as a PSD CONTRACTOR. In fact I SHOT and QUALIFIED as good as both of the COMBAT RE-CON MARINE and COMBAT ARMY RANGER I went in with. They will tell you the same. We were all on par as we qualified at BlackWater's ranges. NO ONE made excuses, NO ONE Babyied anyone we all shot equally well.


What SOME people don't know (and it ONLY demnonstrates their IGNORANCE) is that there are people in our country who do serve (and I did SERVE in a UNIFORM FTR) as a CIVILIAN ADVISOR for OGA et alia NUFF SAID. The fact that THEY FAIL to acknowledge that, make ERRONEOUS statements ONLY shows their IGNORANCE and lack of knowledge. In fact the VERY FACT that I was able to obtain a TS/SCI clearance really says it all If your SWITCHED on and know how it works.


If Rob Leatham, Jerry Barnhart, Todd Jarret who are ALL civilian shooters and the Military PAYS BIG BUCKS for them to teach these highly perishable skill sets to the BEST WARRIORS our country has to offer does that make them NOT capable to KILL in COMBAT or not serve and know what they are doing. Of course it doesn't.


The LOGIC is flawed and the perception is wrong for those people who think that. I have been to Blackwater when these SPECIAL COURSES were given. So I do know what I'm articulating here. I too have some of those skill sets with Edged Weapons. If I did not why would BlackWater request/invite me into a Combat Theatre. My VETTING letter does not have ONE DEFICENCY ANNOTATED.


Many guys I served with @ BlackWater had skill sets that the military does not teach. The Edged Weapons COI's are FAR more complicated that the standard "AIT" or Edged Weapon COI's that the Military units offer. There are "Black Courses" that I cannot elaborate/elucidate on due to OPSEC on that are almost entirely taught by Civilain Martial Artists because of their Special Skills etc...THINK the movie THE HUNTED etc...

I have seen "the Elephant" and been to the "BIG SHOW" and just because I was not military does not PRECLUDE me from knowing Military protocol TT&P's, RSO's, serving "OGA" or having served in a COMBAT THEATRE or NOT being a PATRIOT or having RESPECT for my BROTHERS in ARMS or being a COMBAT VET.




It is CHILDISH, INCORRECT and SIMPLY NOT TRUE to state that because someone did not serve in the military that does make him qualified to serve our country, BE A TRUE PATRIOT (in fact I believe our countries freedom was fought by MANY men who were members of the Militia and not members of the Colonial Armed forces. In fact IIRC, I believe the SYMBOL of the CROSSED ARROWS for our very own Army's SPECIAL FORCES which were done PURPOSELY to SYMBOLIZE UNCONVENTIONAL WARFARE which our country was founded upon in reality)

Actually many Battles of our nation's FREEDOM were WON by BRAVE and COUAGEOUS MILITIA MEN who HELD the LINE while returning VOLLEY's from Britain's Forces and in FACT were TURNING points in our 1776 epic Battles.


I think SOME people need to read the HISTORY of our NATION and then make observations regarding their perceptions....


NUFF said.

FTR, I EXCEED the STANDARD of PROOF offered by those in question relevant to this THREAD.
==========================================================

 

[Spark]

It carries about as much weight as a letter from Lee Iacoca about the work done by a guy on the assembly line in a plant in Toledo Ohio.

What would BW's WPPS managers or your Team Leaders have to say about you, what would the RSO have to say about you?

Odd. Now you sound like the Strider folks. Weird. I guess we have come full circle.

What does Lance's job history have to do with other people lying about their military careers? Is this the "shoot the messenger" tactic coming up again, or is this the "throw enough mud up, something will stick" this time?

Has Lance claimed to be a special operations veteran with years of experience or something?

Are you two going to apply the same standards to the people who've had problems with producing ANY evidence?

Or is this just another smokescreen, trying to desperately divert attention?

EDIT: Apparently Lance posted his thing while I was typing mine. Lance says he was employed by Blackwater, and provides a letter showing this, along with a contact phone number. What's next? Someone going to say he can't call out a liar because he didn't serve in the military?

 

[Ed T]

It is CHILDISH, INCORRECT and SIMPLY NOT TRUE to state that because someone dis not serve in the military that does make him qualified to serve our country, BE A TRUE PATRIOT (in fact I believe our countries freedom was fought by MANY men who were members of the Militia and not members of the Colonial Armed forces. In fact IIRC, I believe the SYMBOL of the Crossed Arrows for our very own Army wee done PURPOSELY to SYMBOLIZE UNCONVENTIONAL WARFARE which our country was founded upon in reality)


Well.
I never challenged your patriotism.
I challenge your expectations for others.

I was a linguist in the Army. Not a superduper death killer like yourself. Am I supposed to be in awe of you know because of the things you claim? Isn't this the very thing you are against?

You push an agenda that you validate with your claims of superwarriordom.
I don't know you or Dwyer or Strider. I have never made it to a blade show.

You wanted validation that you had been treated shabbily. I can't do that.
You come across as a braggert that didn't get let in the club.

 

[Spark]

I challenge your expectations for others.

I never thought I'd see the day where telling the truth would be an unreasonable expectation.

I do find it interesting you want to crucify Lance while not saying one thing about the people who have stories that don't add up. What agenda are you pushing?

 

[roughedges]

You come across as a braggert that didn't get let in the club.

He comes across to me as a man who has had his abilities, dedication, service and honor challenged and, like any honest man would do, he has offered proof. Again, unlike others.


Is there an echo in here?


His claims of "superwarriordom", as you call it, would have never been part of this discussion had the Strider loyalists not dragged him into it in an obvious attempt to divert the focus of attention away from Strider and Dwyer's obvious inconsistencies and highly questionable claims.

 

[Ed T]

Spark,
I am not throwing mud.

Both sides have behaved poorly in my opinion.

As I said before. I don't think this thread will sway opinion that much.

I don't really know any people involved. I mean in real life. It miight make a difference if I did. Without knowing people personally, what I see here is inconsistency in standards.

Do I think MS and DD misrepresented their past or allowed others to do so? Yes, I think that has occurred.

What I am frustrasted with is the never ending nature of this crap. I tried to ignore it, but somethings just don't seem right. In the end, I have ended up posting as if I had an interest. That is the crazy part. I really do not. I owned Strider knives in the past, liked them. but did not use them Couldn't bring myself to keep them as expensive paperweights. (Instead I have more slipjoint paperweights, lol)

I need to just walk away and ignore this thread.

 

[Ed T]

He comes across to me as a man who has had his abilities, dedication, service and honor challenged and, like any honest man would do, he has offered proof. Again, unlike others.


Is there an echo in here?


His claims of "superwarriordom", as you call it, would have never been part of this discussion had the Strider loyalists not dragged him into it in an obvious attempt to divert the focus of attention away from Strider and Dwyer's obvious inconsistencies and highly questionable claims.

No you are missing the point.
He does not honor the same standard of evidence.

 

[Tony C2]

So Lance, is it correct to say that you have never served in the military? This is really confusing. Either you never served or you served. Or are you saying you served in a civilian capacity, but that still means you served. I am not questioning your patriotism, just trying to straighten out the facts. Most of your posts at best are a little confusing.

Spark, in a court of public opinion would the accusers integrity and background not be brought into question??

You say you want the truth but you seem to side with the anti-Strider crowd.

 

[Ed T]

I never thought I'd see the day where telling the truth would be an unreasonable expectation.

I do find it interesting you want to crucify Lance while not saying one thing about the people who have stories that don't add up. What agenda are you pushing?

I did not say the truth is unreasonable expectation. You are trying to twist my words. I am saying the standard of truth should be consistent.

I am unwilling to post my personal documents on the Web. Lance is unwilling. I suspect you are unwilling. People say that the only way to dispell this is to post it publically. Yet,I do no think anyone is willing to do that themselves.

 

[Ed T]

So Lance, is it correct to say that you have never served in the military? This is really confusing. Either you never served or you served. Or are you saying you served in a civilian capacity, but that still means you served. I am not questioning your patriotism, just trying to straighten out the facts. Most of your posts at best are a little confusing.

Spark, in a court of public opinion would the accusers integrity and background not be brought into question??

You say you want the truth but you seem to side with the anti-Strider crowd.

Tony,
This, I think is a key difference. You and I represent public opinion. But others have had real life interaction with the parties involved. We are not on the same playing field. I doubt we have a fraction of the emotional investment of the real life actors.

That is why I need to walk away. It is easier said than done.

 

[Cougar Allen]

Well, I am getting more confused by the minute. Has Lance Harris contributed anything to this thread that could be invalidated by examining his personal credentials? Suppose you prove he's really a 12-year-old boy using his grandmother's computer without her permission. Would that have any bearing on this thread?

 

[roughedges]

No you are missing the point.
He does not honor the same standard of evidence.

With respect, it is not me who is missing the point. Read his last post. He does not have a DD214. In place of that, and in the face of false accusations, he offered up the proof that he is able to- just as most any honest man who gives more than a crap about his reputation would do when publicly attacked. IMO, hiding behind obfuscation, dedicated friends and the ever present catch-all, "our lawyers are handling it." are not the actions of an honest person, or of one with nothing to hide.

 

[Cougar Allen]

I did not say the truth is unreasonable expectation. You are trying to twist my words. I am saying the standard of truth should be consistent.

I am unwilling to post my personal documents on the Web. Lance is unwilling. I suspect you are unwilling. People say that the only way to dispell this is to post it publically. Yet,I do no think anyone is willing to do that themselves.

This is even more confusing. Lance has not tried to sell us knives based on claims about his combat experience, yet he has posted his record anyway. Spark has not tried to sell us knives based on claims about his combat experience, yet he has posted his record anyway. Duane Dwyer has tried to sell us knives based on claims about his combat experience, yet he has posted nothing. What is this consistent standard of truth you're asking for? Who are you asking to be consistent about what?

 

[Spark]

Do I think MS and DD misrepresented their past or allowed others to do so? Yes, I think that has occurred.

Fair enough

What I am frustrasted with is the never ending nature of this crap. I tried to ignore it, but somethings just don't seem right

Unfortunately there doesn't really seem to be a solution. Even when completely backed into a corner, some people will swear that the sky is green and grass is red / plaid, and won't let anyone tell them otherwise. This crap has gone on for years primarily because of such people rabidly defending such beliefs, without proof.

Spark, in a court of public opinion would the accusers integrity and background not be brought into question??

You say you want the truth but you seem to side with the anti-Strider crowd.

Two separate issues. As far as I know, the "court of public opinion" doesn't require the accuser to be fully vetted before their questions are answered. I've certainly noticed a blatant double standard in that regard with certain people. Personally, I don't care if Lance served in the military if he isn't making any claims that he has. He said he's worked for Blackwater and provided a number to back that up. Other people claimed they served as special operations folks for years, and strangely, the documentation doesn't back that up at all. Why is Lance's background more important that the folks who've apparently been caught lying?

As for what "side" I'm on, I'm sorry if the truth seems doesn't seem to jibe with the claims other people make. I'm pretty careful to source my statements. If those statements wind up being "anti-Strider" in your perception, by all means, feel free to provide documentation that proves the statements they made actually have factual basis, and mine are wrong; I welcome factual corrections.

Of course, if you can't, then I guess the documents themselves are "anti-Strider"?

 

[Ed T]

I never thought I'd see the day where telling the truth would be an unreasonable expectation.

I do find it interesting you want to crucify Lance while not saying one thing about the people who have stories that don't add up. What agenda are you pushing?

I don't want to crucify Lance. I don't think I am capable of that, to be quite honest.

What agenda? Maybe that is the problem. I don't really have one.


GB&U usually has an outcome. Theives get banned. Problems get resolved.

This one doesn't. It just goes on. I think most members formed their opinions and moved on.

There was a thread a while back that lept getting bumped because the member had stolen from a lot of people. People got tired of that one to, but Keith M. was vary clear. He thought it needed to keep coming up to the top as a warning. (I can not remember who it was. Keith Mongomery might be able to help) Same thing happeded with Eichner (I believe).

So if the intent here is to warn against doing business, why not do it openly?

Fear of litigation? Now we are right back to the issue of standards of evidence and truth.

It is a crazy making circle.

 

[teacher]

I never challenged your patriotism.
I challenge your expectations for others.
.

I never thought I'd see the day where telling the truth would be an unreasonable expectation.

I do find it interesting you want to crucify Lance while not saying one thing about the people who have stories that don't add up. What agenda are you pushing?

I didn't either.. the expectation of truth challenged by Ed T....
.............that just about takes the cake in all this crap........ ????

Just what is your agenda Ed T ?

It is all too obvious now, after that "glowing" statement..... that you have one...

I am sure I am not the only one who would like to know what it really is........