Survival, "Bushcraft," and "Primitive Living Skills..." your ideas on differences...

Don, I love this thread ... thankyou.
I think you have said a lot of what I feel and I too am passionate about primitive technology. Flintknapping, fire making, tools etc
I enjoy learning from as many different cultures as possible.
To me survival and bushcraft have a lot in common although survival to me means "to stay alive" where bushcraft means "to live in harmony with your surroundings (includes surviving)".
We adapt, assimilate, associate ... survive
I will use whatever I can with the resources available to survive and also use my bushcraft skills, whether sticks and stones ... or equipment I have chosen for my specific needs.
Thanks again Don ... regards, Dave
 
G'day Don

Don Rearic said:
Mick,

I am not saying you are wrong but Wikipedia has been infested with people with ulterior motives and agendas and it's nothing to really go on there and say whatever you want to. It's not necessarily the proof I would go by. Snopes and the other sites are like that as well.
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I agree. Just because it appears on the internet doesn't guarantee that the information is correct :thumbup:

However, having read two of the Australian books cited, "My brilliant career" and "We of the never never" I can confirm the in-context use of the term bushcraft in both books. Since both were published pre 1910, the use of the term here in Australia does indeed predate Mr Korchanski's use of the term.

BTW, if your interested, the 10 Bushcraft books written by Richard Harry Graves (who is also mentioned in the Wikipedia article) can be found here: http://tions.net/CA256EA900408BD5/vwWWW/outdoor~03~000



Kind regards
Mick
 
They are all the same terms, just viewed differently and learned to different degrees.

People tend to complicate things.
 
Zaner01 said:
So here's my quibble with Cpl Punishment -- modern survival isn't a limited skill set, but a different skill set. Modern survival skills include things that I never see discussed much: signalling methods, wilderness first aid, emergency repairs (highly specific to your situation, of course), as well as all those crossover things like firelighting and shelter building.
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I guess I was a bit ambiguous. I didn't mean that "survival" has fewer skills than any other activity. I meant that the skills required to survive the given scenario are limited.
For instance, surviving a 12 car pileup, my fire starting skills are not part of the skillset, however, my fire stopping skills may very well be.

Making a snow shelter skills probably won't help me much when a 26-point quake hits in downtown L.A.

Survival isn't just an in-the-woods thing.

As a side effect, most survivalists I know limit their skill set to using the gear they have stocked up.

Whereas most bushcrafters/primitive living gurus/outdoorsmen/backwoodsmen, whatever you want to call them, will learn every skill they can, regardless if they have an immediate or even forseeable use for it.
 
Knives are a tool to get me home to my comfy bed. Its all about the quick survival plan. I wont spend one second longer then nessesary in the cold, wet, dark,lost, etc. I dont romantisize my skills in any field, and they are just a means to a end.
 
Bushcraft: Minamalist camping done because you like it.

Primitive living skills: A hobby you enjoy learning and practicing but
really wouldn't want to live that way for any extended period of time.

Survival: What you are forced to do using the skills learned practicing Buschcraft, Primitve Living Skills and anything else you can think of to save your BUTT.

Urban Survival: All of the above with a little Escape & Evasion thrown in.
 
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Dartanyon,

You're welcome!

Mick,

Thanks for the info on the Bushcraft-Aussie angle.

Cpl. Punishment & Bentblade:

You opened the can of worms that I waited patiently for - urban survival. Especially the E & E angle which I am sure most a lot of people would certainly POO POO as being fantasy B.S.

Perhaps that angle, more than any other, is what defines a survivalist. The ability to also survive and basically be a homeless bum, a refugee, if need be...until they can get out to the places where the other skills can come into play.
 
Great thread!

I practice primitive skills and bushcraft. I define the former as those used before iron was commonly available, the latter afterward. After that, they are virtually the same. I enjoy both equally, but I like to find the usefulness in the various local, native plants, animals and minerals. I generally feel skills & knowledge trump the latest cutlery. But I like the eye candy:)

Survival skills to me encompass everything you possess to get home safely to your loved ones. It may be shelter building or simply staying put or not giving up.
 
Ok! this is what I was trying to say, You start out Basic "Modern Survival" You depend more on specific items "Kit" or Survival Kit. Items in the Kit help you survive the 72 Hours until help arrives with just Basic skills.

A Few Examples 1. Knife, 2. Signal Mirror, 3. Mag Fire Starter 4. First Aid Kit 5. Emergency Bivy 6. Basic Food Items 7. Water 8. Water Purification

As you advance or grow you learn Bushcraft skills that will enhance your ability to Survive, especially long term. Advanced Survival Ability!!!!!!!!!!!1

Examples 1. make your own knife 2. Natural signals 3. fire by Friction 4. Trap and Hunt with what nature provides 5. Get to know and be one with the natural world. My idea of bushcraft/primitive living.

The Evolution of Survival, the goal is to get to the Advanced Camp! then if you loose everything well you just got lighter. I for one still have things I want to practice and learn I will admitt that I am between the Basic and what I call Semi Advanced so I have a way to go. You can never stop learning, and someone will always know a better way.

RickJ
 
survival, bushcraft, primitive living?
Don't think so hard and just get outside, cut and make something, and get dirty!
 
The "survivalist" - racist connection still eludes me, even after having read this thread in its entirety. That's a new one on me!

Like others here, I've always seen survival as the first priority tier, no matter what tools you have at your disposal, modern or otherwise; the emphasis being self-preservation with the intent to escape the circumstances. I guess the term "survivalist" eludes me also, as I've always thought of survival as a situation you were thrown into against your will. While it does not seem like a lot of fun to me, I suppose it would be one way of promoting self-reliance.

The next tier to me would be bushcraft/primitive living, which personally I do not discern a difference between; the emphasis being living comfortably and indefinitely in the very same natural surroundings that the survivor seeks to escape.

Either way, having attended TB's Standard Class and learned the principle of fire by friction, trap building, etc., and applied the Bruce Lee concept of absorbing what was useful to me and discarding what was not, gimme a Kellam Puukko and a firesteel, a day or two without rain, and a big bag of M&M's and you won't see me for at least a week!

Just my meager .02 on the matter FWIW, if anything. Thanks again for a great thread.

Professor.
 
RickJ said:
As you advance or grow you learn Bushcraft skills that will enhance your ability to Survive, especially long term. Advanced Survival Ability!!!!!!!!!!!1

Examples 1. make your own knife 2. Natural signals 3. fire by Friction 4. Trap and Hunt with what nature provides 5. Get to know and be one with the natural world. My idea of bushcraft/primitive living.

The Evolution of Survival, the goal is to get to the Advanced Camp!
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Rick,

I don't necessarily consider the more primitive skills to be the more "advanced any more than I would consider an expertly made chert knife to be superior to anything other than an inferior chert knife.


Joezilla said:
survival, bushcraft, primitive living?
Don't think so hard and just get outside, cut and make something, and get dirty!
Click to expand...

There is certainly something to be said for that! However, if we all really did this, no one would be thinking and posting on a forum about their experiences, etc.


Professor said:
The "survivalist" - racist connection still eludes me, even after having read this thread in its entirety. That's a new one on me!
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Some people who share our interests run like hell from the words "survivalist" and "survivalism" because various racist groups and individuals in the past have utilized those terms. Then, the media, politicians and certain liberal organizations have lumped all of the racists and nuts in with the rest of us.

I think it is a mistake to run from those words, but that's just me.
 
Like others here, I've always seen survival as the first priority tier, no matter what tools you have at your disposal, modern or otherwise; the emphasis being self-preservation with the intent to escape the circumstances. I guess the term "survivalist" eludes me also, as I've always thought of survival as a situation you were thrown into against your will. While it does not seem like a lot of fun to me, I suppose it would be one way of promoting self-reliance.

The next tier to me would be bushcraft/primitive living, which personally I do not discern a difference between; the emphasis being living comfortably and indefinitely in the very same natural surroundings that the survivor seeks to escape.
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:thumbup:

I hope the Professor will allow me the liberty to pursue his mode of thought with a slight addendum.
I.E Bushcraft/Primitive Living are to me (as others have already stated as well) more hobby related excercises that I use/study on for purely the love of the study; and the intent that I can pick up info that would help me prepare for a potential future need, be it just a craft/camping, or ultimately a survival situation.
 
Well said bentblade. I think urban survival will be more important in the future. Ferfal has an interesting blog about surviving in Argentina. What is really interesting is his edc is much the same as a lot of members of this forum. The mind sets of participants practicing bushcrafting and primitive living skills are applicable to urban settings.
 
I don`t consider myself a survivalist, But I hunt a lot, and spend a lot of time in the woods. Knowing how to take care of yourself if somthing goes wrong is real important to me.
 
It would seem that opinions do vary.

I like what Elen had to say.

Survival to me is an attitude, a hobby and or a life style that is not related to any particular place or time, city/woods/desert.(think insurance)

Bushcraft is a skillset to be comfortable out of the city for the most part that does not have any time period restrictions on gear.(think recreation)

Primitive living skills are time period related having to do with what gear you can use to start with, more of a what gear you can make sort of thing.(think art)

Edited to add:

Making fire.

Survival, we need a fire right now, start with a road flare or underwater flare and add to that.

Bushcraft, build a tinder/twig/small stick/big stick fire pile and light it with your Bic lighter.

Primitive living skills same as bushcraft cept you start with a spark or a friction coal or a coal that you carry around.

With bushcraft or primitive skills it is casual, with survival it is important.

You can spend a lot of time and $$ on any and or all of the above.

All of it can be a hobby or a life style choice.

I spent maybe 20 years serious about the survival prep thing and 13 years more as a hobby.

Now, while I am handy in a wide variety of emergency situations, socially I am rather abrupt, given to strong opinions and the need to tell those opinions to people that it would seem, really do not want to hear them.
 
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Dang, what a cool thread. :thumbup:

Just to add, when I think "survival," I think debris hut.

When I think "bushcraft," I think of the fine accommodations adorned with coconuts used by Mr. and Mrs. Howell on Gilligan's Island.

:)

Professor.
 
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