"Tactical" Is Not a Purpose of Use and Represents an Undesirable Design Feature

Part 6


In an era where we are already faced with laws against simple locking blades or fixed blades, which for some non-tactical applications are an incredibly useful safety feature. It isn't a big stretch to foresee (and fear) a future where a bunch of well-meaning elected officials and bureaucrats, who seem to believe in the idea that an unarmed society would be a cultural paradise, would use a list of "tactical" features to define knives that should be outlawed or restricted. In an effort to de-weaponize our tools, they could regulate practical features and safety advancements out of existence. Its pretty hard to tell people that they can't have the tools they use to slice bread, meat, and veggies. Its considerably easier to tell them the new rules won't impact them, the only change is to make everyone safer by removing "dangerous tactical features" they don't really need (they'll just be sending a truck into your neighborhood so you can have that nasty tip ground right off your chef's knife for you, so that it isn't so "stabby").

Erik
 
And finally part 7


In the long run, I fear that "tactical" marketing will do a great disservice to the knife using and buying public. Words do have an effect on culture, and what something is called and how its marketed does matter. If you honestly don't believe words matter, you should spend a little time studying both history and current events. Remember, there are entire highly paid professions devoted to word crafting and spinning messaging to the pubic in order to influence public opinion.

Its not that features that are labeled as tactical are undesirable, what is undesirable is that useful features are being labeled as tactical, thereby setting a public perception that said features only have a tactical purpose.

Erik
 
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FreebornErik said:
And finally part 7


In the long run, I fear that "tactical" marketing will do a great disservice to the knife using and buying public. Words do have an effect on culture, and what something is called and how its marketed does matter. If you honestly don't believe words matter, you should spend a little time studying both history and current events. Remember, there are entire highly paid professions devoted to word crafting and spinning messaging to the pubic in order to influence public opinion.

Its not that features that are labeled as tactical are undesirable, what is undesirable is that useful features are being labeled as tactical, thereby setting a public perception that said features only have a tactical purpose.

Erik
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The problem with your reasoning is that we have already seen in many countries including Britain that it doesn't matter what type of knife you have it will be banned if people keep electing politicians who want to turn you into a subject. We have also seen that if the public is too ignorant to figure out the bullshit that these politicians try and sell them on then it doesn't matter what you called your knife because the politicians will just make up a name even if it doesn't fit. The goal isn't to be timid and hope that your knives never come under political fire but instead to be willing to fight the lies and to never stand down. We have seen how ignorance has damaged Britain and we can see the pattern of lies that the Democrats would try and use against knives because they are using them against guns right now.
 
FreebornErik said:
I'd hate to take this out of context, is this really what you meant to say?

Erik
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Yeah, I guess. What I mean is that if a knife is really 'tactical', then that ought to mean something other than aesthetics. I can tart up a 10/22 with all the black furniture, extended mags, collapsible stock, shrouded barrel, piccatiny rails, red dot sight, tac light, blah, blah, blah, and it still shoots a 22LR. It is still not going to be a top choice for combat because it fires a very light, not very fast projectile with lackluster reliability from the rimfire priming system. But if you make it look a certain way, it will be banned under an AWB. Same for an airsoft gun. Stick a laser on it, hang it from a two point sling, it still launches pieces of plastic. How it looks does not determine how it works.

All knives cut, that doesn't make them all great weapons. There are not a whole ton of features that can be added or altered to make it so, either. There are some, but they aren't always present in all knives, so I don't think all knives are suitably 'tactical'. My personal opinion is that there should not be a distinction between traditional and tactical, but traditional and modern. There are traditional weapons, and modern non-weapons, so it is a false dichotomy. In fact the farther you go back, the more important a bladed weapon was, since at first there were no firearms, then there were slow and unreliable firearms. But the more modern the features in a knife does not always mean the better a fighting tool.

I have knives with locks, one hand opening, clips, and black scales... that have blades under two and three inches. So are these tacticals? Why would I choose to defend myself with such? That's not tactical, that's handy, imo. Those are not features for fighting, those are features for convenience. Is my Bladetech Mouse Lite a sentry deanimator? Is my Spyderco Walker a dueling blade? I've got the synthetic handles, the fast deployment, the ability to 'index', but I'm pretty sure it takes more than that. I could use them for defense in some way, but I could use a wood chisel, tack hammer, or a decent sized pin shackle for the same thing.
 
killgar said:
So it's alright for you to own tactical-style knives, but it's not alright for anyone else because they are just a bunch of mall-ninja-Navy-SEAL-wanabes, is that it?
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Never said it wasn't alright for people to own them...

And did anyone in this thread, or anywhere else on this forum that you can quote, suggest that they were fantasizing about using knives as weapons or that they "dress up all tactical"? Did anyone who has expressed an interest in tactical-style knives say anything to indicate that they weren't living in "the real world"? Who exactly are you talking about? Or is this just a prejudice you have against other people who own tactical-style knives?

And as far as this being a "family oriented forum" where knives are not talked about as weapons, there is an entire sub-forum here at Bladeforums specifically created by the owner of Bladeforums to talk about such topics, it's called Practical Tactical, and there are no restrictions on who can visit that forum.
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What we were talking about... If you read the whole thread..... Was the Attitude and or the selling of such attitude, fantasies etc that is called marketing....


It's interesting, I've had the pleasure to know many veterans in my life, including some in my own family, and something I've noticed about them is that they don't feel the need to go around telling people that they are veterans. I guess they just don't feel the need to use their military service to try and impress people, or win arguments, or posture themselves as superior to others. But I'm so glad that you brought up your military service in this thread where it had no bearing whatsoever. It clearly indicates that you have nothing to prove.
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I have met and seen tons of the types of people that are the result of said marketing over the years, so it works both ways.. ;)

I mentioned my background to point out why I think the way that I do about the general subject, nothing more other than to point out an opinion from a different perspective and viewpoint.

And no I don't go around in real life advertising that I was in the Military because from my experience it causes a more negative reaction than positive MOST of the time.... ;)

Why that is, I really don't understand, but I learned from bitter experiences that I should just keep it to myself.....
 
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Ankerson I sit here drinking coffee and am wondering why? Let them live their delusion of preppers or tactical master assassins. Do you really think you can change a delusional mind with reasoning and logic?

Anyways enjoyed your posts they are usually informative.
 
killgar said:
Yeah, like the sterotypical arrogant internet-forum know-it-all who presumes to pass judgement on others based on the knives they like. Of course, if a person doesn't want to be perceived as an arrogant internet-forum know-it-all, then they shouldn't act like one.
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I think you need to step back with this type of talk a bit. Not the first thread I've seen you act like this in either.

Someone made a sticky up top about being nice to new members. Maybe you need to apply that way of thinking to all here, and not just the new guys.

This is the General forum guys. Lets please try to keep the discussion civil.
 
Luis G. said:
Ankerson I sit here drinking coffee and am wondering why? Let them live their delusion of preppers or tactical master assassins. Do you really think you can change a delusional mind with reasoning and logic?

Anyways enjoyed your posts they are usually informative.
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Hey Man,


No, I really don't think I can change anything with my posts. :D

My posts are just from the viewpoint of someone who sees it from a different background and offered my opinion on the subject based on what I think about it. :)

Hope they don't change anything really because as long as they keep buying that stuff we all will keep having a very broad variety of knives to choose from. :thumbup:

It's more the attitude that is disturbing to me personally along with those fantasies..... :eek:
 
Ken44 said:
I think you need to step back with this type of talk a bit. Not the first thread I've seen you act like this in either.

Someone made a sticky up top about being nice to new members. Maybe you need to apply that way of thinking to all here, and not just the new guys.

This is the General forum guys. Lets please try to keep the discussion civil.
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Are you saying that there are no arrogant know-it-alls here on Bladeforums? Because I've often seen people judge and criticize others based on their choice or interest in particular knives. And in my opinion, some of that has been going on in this thread.

And if you have any problem with anything I post on this forum, you can either refute it, or ignore it, or report me to a moderator. But don't waste your time complaining to me about it because I don't care what you think about what I say or how I "act".

As far as the discussion at hand, I believe I was being quite civilized, like when I said that people should be free to buy, own, and carry any knife they want without being judged or criticized for it, especially on this forum.
 
^ Calm down. I wasn't complaining, just a suggestion.

I haven't seen anyone tell someone what they should buy, own, and carry.
Carry on.
 
GMAHN said:
The problem with your reasoning is that we have already seen in many countries including Britain that it doesn't matter what type of knife you have [...]
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F0lP2f2.png
 
If this wasn't so sad, I would LMAO. But i guess this is what the future holds for us :( :barf:
 
There's a CNN blog/editorial/rant about the TSA allowing 2.6", non-locking, straight handled, 1/2" wide knives on flights. In the comments people are scared witless that there will be a slew of murders. Anyone saying that 9/11 changed the expectations and reactions of passengers, and that cabin doors cannot be breached with a knife are responded to with the guaranteed fact that at least one person will have their throat deftly slit wide open instantaneously before the murderer can be brought down. When I quit reading the comments, it was at the point that it was going to be a baby murdered, and they hoped it was the child of someone who did not have an issue with pen knives on planes.

But I see where the issue lies. The Swiss Army Knife is literally the Swiss Army Knife, it is probably the most tactical knife on the planet with over 125 years in service.
 
hardheart said:
There's a CNN blog/editorial/rant about the TSA allowing 2.6", non-locking, straight handled, 1/2" wide knives on flights. In the comments people are scared witless that there will be a slew of murders. Anyone saying that 9/11 changed the expectations and reactions of passengers, and that cabin doors cannot be breached with a knife are responded to with the guaranteed fact that at least one person will have their throat deftly slit wide open instantaneously before the murderer can be brought down. When I quit reading the comments, it was at the point that it was going to be a baby murdered, and they hoped it was the child of someone who did not have an issue with pen knives on planes.

But I see where the issue lies. The Swiss Army Knife is literally the Swiss Army Knife, it is probably the most tactical knife on the planet with over 125 years in service.
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That's really funny and sad all at the same time...

Before 911 and after 911 makes no difference in reality other than the fear tactics of our wonderful Government and the imagination of people that have been manipulated into being scared of basically nothing.

I would be more worried about the plane having some kind of mechanical issue and crashing personally..
 
steff27 said:
I would absolutely love to buy modern high quality folders with blades that are actually designed to cut stuff.

An Opinel blade has a geometry that cuts great and is still strong enough for light
prying. And for the SD obsessed, the chance a blade like that will break
in SD use is just too low to matter.

And that's the sad part: Where are the high quality (150$+) locking folders with
screw togheter construction, thin ground blades with a stock below 3 mm?
I'd buy them by the dozen.
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benchmade 860, 741
 
Self-defense features are a bit over-marketed, but I'm still happy to have knives I know I could count on in the unfortunate event that I found myself in a severe self-defense situation. Unlikely . . . yes. Impossible . . . no. Great points, though. I understand your argument that the Rambo appeal has started to prevail over practicality.

I'm not disappointed with any of my knives that have tactical features, but I'm still learning. Thanks for discussion.
 
duro said:
I'm pretty sure people like Al Mar, and Robert Terzuola coined the design/term. It seems perfectly acceptable to me, coming from this aspect.

--Once you've understood the roots of this design, you might go ahead and change your post.
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+1 for this post!

As Emerson said in the below link:

http://www.humanevents.com/2011/02/01/10-things-that-make-a-tactical-knife/

I’ve heard some people (Knifemakers/Knife Companies) say the following, that there’s no difference between a “regular” knife and a “Tactical Knife.” I ask them this question: Is there a difference between a “Combat Handgun” and a “regular” hand gun? Damn right there is. But unless you know what those differences are, you probably can’t tell the difference.
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The word "tactical" is first and foremost a term meaning "of or occurring at the battlefront" (Merriam-Webster). Such a term defines a range of environments and uses, with the further understanding that ANYTHING designed to cover a range of purposes will be more of a compromise than something with a narrower focus. The unfortunate abuse of marketing aside, it is not difficult to understand what a real "tactical" knife would be.
 
Oakengroves said:
This post may generate a proverbial crap storm. If so, hold on to your umbrellas.

"Tactical" is not a philosophy or purpose of use. It is not a desirable design feature in a knife. What is "tactical?" It is the outdated, unrealistic concept of using a knife in a "self-defense" situation against another human being. This is an unrealistic concept given the proliferation of firearms, severe legal consequences of using a knife in self-defense, and rarity of situations where use a knife in self defense is even plausible. Let's be honest here: how many of you have ever, in any way, used a knife in a self-defense situation? Ten-percent of forum goers, perhaps?
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Ten per cent??? I'd be surprised if a tenth of per cent have made legitimate use of a knife for self defense.
 
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