The Bears' Den--Shirogorov Showcase

[CPP]

I sharpen my NeOn in M390 to 20 degrees using a Wicked Sharp system. The absence of a sharpening choil just means I pay more attention to where the sharpening paddle lands on the blade so as not to mar the plunge line/ricosso which I cover with masking tape

 

[slopoke7]

how are other Shiro owners here handling sharpening? From what I can tell, Shiro's come with a fairly obtuse edge angle, ~25-30dps. However the heat treat and geometry can sustain a much more acute angle, but then the plunge/choil starts to become difficult to work with. I'm surprised they come with such a high angle, I thought it was pretty well established at this point that 15-20 is more ideal, performs better, and actually lasts longer. Especially when you have high quality ht and good cutting geo. It seems to me that Shiro's are basically the ideal knife for an acute 15-17.5dps edge. Shiro owners that have alot of sharpening experience, are you matching the factory angle? If you are dropping the angle back, how are you handling the plunge/choil area? I want to lay the edge back but I don't want to smile or damage the plunge/choil

Definitely watching this thread. I would love to have my daily users sharpened so they are super slicy. I absolutely love my shiros, but do find myself picking up other makers that put a crazy edge on their knives. I do not sharpen my own blades (I know my limitations).

 

[SACBALLZ]

Definitely watching this thread. I would love to have my daily users sharpened so they are super slicy. I absolutely love my shiros, but do find myself picking up other makers that put a crazy edge on their knives. I do not sharpen my own blades (I know my limitations).

I had Klingenwerk put 20dps mirror on my Shiros but he left the heel untouched, because of the smile issue. I'm going to be sending them off for a choil mod at some point, I have a guy that does really incredible work that I fully trust with them. But I'm not super stoked about having to do that, so I'm curious what others are doing. I will definitely be going 15-17.5dps in the future, if larrin is to be believed those angles actually last longer than a 25-30 so it seems silly that Shiros come that way. Especially since they have high quality ht and thin bte cutting geometry. They are basically the perfect candidate for an acute edge, yet they come more obtuse than most and the plunge prevents acute edges. I put 17.5 on everything, unless it's super fat like a spanto hinderer then I go 20, it seems silly to have to sharpen my Shiros more obtuse.

 

[SACBALLZ]

In other Shiro adventures, I took apart my f3 for the first time. My first full Shiro disassembly. Very impressed with how easily everything came apart, nothing stuck, no prying, everything just comes apart very smoothly. However there is a ball missing, I guess the previous owner didn't anticipate I would take it apart? It probably doesnt matter but it's going to bug the heck out of me. I ordered grade 25 440c balls from McMaster Carr and will see how they go. I also ordered grade 10 ceramic from Amazon but you know how that goes. Dubious claims at best. I am going to try the steel g25 first and see how they feel, rather not risk denting the blade from over tightening the pivot. I'll attempt to take some decent pics before I put it back together. Wish I had some nice dept 13 denim micarta scales to install!

 

[Pompous]

In other Shiro adventures, I took apart my f3 for the first time. My first full Shiro disassembly. Very impressed with how easily everything came apart, nothing stuck, no prying, everything just comes apart very smoothly. However there is a ball missing, I guess the previous owner didn't anticipate I would take it apart? It probably doesnt matter but it's going to bug the heck out of me. I ordered grade 25 440c balls from McMaster Carr and will see how they go. I also ordered grade 10 ceramic from Amazon but you know how that goes. Dubious claims at best. I am going to try the steel g25 first and see how they feel, rather not risk denting the blade from over tightening the pivot. I'll attempt to take some decent pics before I put it back together. Wish I had some nice dept 13 denim micarta scales to install!

I believe I've seen on the FB group that Shiro runs the equivalent of G10 or G5 bearings - so the G25 may give some trouble as far as finding a good fit. I think you'd still be able to, just might take a bit of cycling to make it work? I'm a bit shaky on the grades in general but my understanding is that its a tolerance range for exact sizing for the bearings. I could be wrong, though.

 

[SACBALLZ]

I believe I've seen on the FB group that Shiro runs the equivalent of G10 or G5 bearings - so the G25 may give some trouble as far as finding a good fit. I think you'd still be able to, just might take a bit of cycling to make it work? I'm a bit shaky on the grades in general but my understanding is that its a tolerance range for exact sizing for the bearings. I could be wrong, though.

interesting, i would think given the prices of the repair kits, that they are using ~g25 or similar, as g10 and lower steel bearings start to get really expensive. id love some confirmation on that, i've not been able to find it. i'll keep digging.

i think in my case it shouldn't matter much, since it's only one bearings out of 40+, but it's going to drive me absolutely insane knowing i have a mismatched bearing in there. i might just swap them all out in order to satiate my ocd, and see how the action feels with g25 bearings(if there is even a perceptible change).

 

[SACBALLZ]

Installed the Amazon bearing balls first. They are advertised as 304 stainless grade 25. I have no idea whether that is true or not, I don't have any reason to believe otherwise. Feels good, same as before. But now the centering is better, and for whatever reason the pivot doesn't try to work it's way loose anymore. The previous owner had Teflon tape on the threads to prevent the pivot backing out and it didn't work unless it was perfect. Now there is no Teflon on the threads, and it hadn't budged. I have 440 stainless g25 coming today from McMaster carr(not enough caffeine when I typed harbor freight this morning), and I also have grade 10 ceramic from Amazon. It feels good enough that I don't think I'm bothered enough to change them, at least not immediately.

 

[BP Green]

In other Shiro adventures, I took apart my f3 for the first time. My first full Shiro disassembly. Very impressed with how easily everything came apart, nothing stuck, no prying, everything just comes apart very smoothly. However there is a ball missing, I guess the previous owner didn't anticipate I would take it apart? It probably doesnt matter but it's going to bug the heck out of me. I ordered grade 25 440c balls from McMaster Carr and will see how they go. I also ordered grade 10 ceramic from Amazon but you know how that goes. Dubious claims at best. I am going to try the steel g25 first and see how they feel, rather not risk denting the blade from over tightening the pivot. I'll attempt to take some decent pics before I put it back together. Wish I had some nice dept 13 denim micarta scales to install!

View attachment 3235765

Installed the Amazon bearing balls first. They are advertised as 304 stainless grade 25. I have no idea whether that is true or not, I don't have any reason to believe otherwise. Feels good, same as before. But now the centering is better, and for whatever reason the pivot doesn't try to work its way loose anymore. The previous owner had Teflon tape on the threads to prevent the pivot backing out and it didn't work unless it was perfect. Now there is no Teflon on the threads, and it hadn't budged. I have 440 stainless g25 coming today from harbor freight, and I also have grade 10 ceramic from Amazon. It feels good enough that I don't think I'm bothered enough to change them, at least not immediately.

This right here is an example of why I love this site so much. BF is a wellspring of knowledge. I had no idea we could order them directly so easily. Thank you. . .

 

[SACBALLZ]

This right here is an example of why I love this site so much. BF is a wellspring of knowledge. I had no idea we could order them directly so easily. Thank you. . .

Glad i could provide some helpful info. I believe all MRBS Shiro's use 1.5mm bearings but don't quote me, you should research your model and confirm. What I found is that 1.5mm bearing diameter appears to be an uncommon size for knives. Skiff doesn't even have any bearings in this size. They sell individual bearing balls and I went to see if they had 1.5mm, because I figured they source high quality bearings, but no dice. If you are in the US, I think your two primary sources are McMaster and Amazon. McMaster is the safe bet, they have grade 25 440 stainless. Amazon has a bunch of options but quality is going to be unpredictable, but so far its worked out for me.

 

[marrenmiller]

how are other Shiro owners here handling sharpening? From what I can tell, Shiro's come with a fairly obtuse edge angle, ~25-30dps. However the heat treat and geometry can sustain a much more acute angle, but then the plunge/choil starts to become difficult to work with. I'm surprised they come with such a high angle, I thought it was pretty well established at this point that 15-20 is more ideal, performs better, and actually lasts longer. Especially when you have high quality ht and good cutting geo. It seems to me that Shiro's are basically the ideal knife for an acute 15-17.5dps edge. Shiro owners that have alot of sharpening experience, are you matching the factory angle? If you are dropping the angle back, how are you handling the plunge/choil area? I want to lay the edge back but I don't want to smile or damage the plunge/choil

I've sharpened a couple of mine. You can wrap a zip tie around the choil to keep stones from nicking the plunge grind. That seems to work very well, but obviously you should be careful applying and removing the zip tie next to a blade's edge.

 

[SACBALLZ]

I've sharpened a couple of mine. You can wrap a zip tie around the choil to keep stones from nicking the plunge grind. That seems to work very well, but obviously you should be careful applying and removing the zip tie next to a blade's edge.

Would you happen to have a picture demonstrating this technique? And do you have any idea what angle you have been able to achieve using this method?

 

[marrenmiller]

Would you happen to have a picture demonstrating this technique? And do you have any idea what angle you have been able to achieve using this method?

I sharpened a 111 with a pretty small choil to 17 DPS. I can try to take an example picture later today.