The Rule of Fours

Originally Posted by koyote
Environment can make a huge difference.

I remember back in 80s, one of our desert survival classes had a list of things you had to prioritze. This was classic "what's in your car after the wreck in the middle of the desert"

The top three items, in order, from the list-

Mirror
London Fog Trenchcoat
Shovel.

The gallon of water was number 4.

Any guesses why?


desert survival really sucks :/ this post brings back alot of memories. when I'm backpacking around here in the summer I consume about 3 liters of water an hour to stay on my feet and I'm usually feeling dizzy by the time I get back home. It's not so much the dehydration in and of itself, it's just a total mind$%@. Nothing within sight, just endless miles of emptyness, no materials to use to do anything bushcraft or survival wise, total boredom and you start to go crazy real fast just due to dehydration. Combine all these together and you are totally out of your mind, let alone having any hope of making it out alive. The desert will try your will to survive more than anywhere else, IMO. I'll take cold windy peaks in wintertime over cross country desert survival anyday. It's the only place I ever felt the grip of hopelessness. I've come close to death countless times but dieing due to lack of human essentials... My guess is the trenchcoat to wrap your body, the shovel to dig your grave and the mirror to get one last glimpse of your miserable self before you croak
 
It's a long time since I did desert survival, but if I can have a go:

1. Mirror - signaling in bright sunlight is very effective. You need to get rescued, 'cos your time is running out!

2. Trenchcoat - protection from sunlight and slow down dehydration from sweating. The coat slows down evaporation by preventing it being carried off by the air. Also good for cold desert nights.

3. Shovel - dig a pit to create a shaded area to sit. Don't lie down in the sun as it increases your surface area exposed. Maybe the sand will be cooler a few feet down as well; if you are really lucky, even moist. Just don't exert yourself too much and sweat all your water out.

4. Water - obviously useful, but the above three will allow you to survive as long or longer than the extra water will without them. Water won't get you rescued.
 
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Doc-Canada, and othes,
Thanks for your supoort. I started to reply to the numerous adverse comments this post inspired, but then I said, 'why?' So, to hell with it! Some idiot even wanted pictures! Hell! I walked out of north Iran, Chad, India, etc. So screw all of you day hikers and book readers! If/when the SHTF, let's see how you do? I may be waiting at the far end to greet you and...maybe not. My last post to this sort of thread! I'm truly sorry I started it. I won't do it again....
 
Old CW4 said:
Doc-Canada, and othes,
Thanks for your supoort. I started to reply to the numerous adverse comments this post inspired, but then I said, 'why?' So, to hell with it! Some idiot even wanted pictures! Hell! I walked out of north Iran, Chad, India, etc. So screw all of you day hikers and book readers! If/when the SHTF, let's see how you do? I may be waiting at the far end to greet you and...maybe not. My last post to this sort of thread! I'm truly sorry I started it. I won't do it again....
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I'm sorry you feel that way. I hope that the posters with woods/survival experience feel appreciated for sharing their knowledge. I started reading this forum when I was looking for some knife advice, but stayed for the info being shared. Thanks for bringing up a topic that we should all keep in mind.

I think an apology was posted, if that makes a difference.
 
Old CW4, I can't say I blame you.

BTW, as a result of this thread a forum member, who will remain nameless, contacted me inquiring about the other forum I mentioned being invited to. He's had enough, and I might not be too far behind him, and that would be a real shame because of the number of members, hell, not just members, friends that I would be leaving behind.

I really hope it doesn't come to that.

Doc
 
Doc-Canada,
Yeah, thanks. PM me and tell me where you're going and I'll follow you. I've about had it with the juveniles and witless nit pickers on this forum. Unfortunately, I paid for a so-called 'platinum membership' a while back and now I'm now becoming sorry I did. Oh well. you win some, you lose some..
 
G'day Doc

DOC-CANADA said:
Old CW4, I can't say I blame you.

BTW, as a result of this thread a forum member, who will remain nameless, contacted me inquiring about the other forum I mentioned being invited to. He's had enough, and I might not be too far behind him, and that would be a real shame because of the number of members, hell, not just members, friends that I would be leaving behind.

I really hope it doesn't come to that.

Doc
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Bear in mind right from the word go that the following comments are my personal opinion.

Can I suggest it is up to these "regulars" to make a stand for the standards they expect on any forum they participate in, rather than run away :thumbup:

I am the first to acknowledge it is not the most pleasant experience to have a confrontation with another poster, but when has running away from a problem ever changed things for the better?

Remember it is the responsibility of those with knowledge & experience to share it for the benefit of others who haven't aquired it yet.

How will those looking for the benefit of advice that comes from real first hand experience gain it, if all those with it leave?

You have probably guessed that my posts reflect the fact that I refuse to participate in a popularity contest when I participate in these type of forums, but rather that I acutely feel the responsibilty mentioned above.

Can I say in my defense, you'll never die not knowing what I honestly think :D

What ever your final decision turns out to be, take care mate.

You are one of the good ones :thumbup:




Kind regards
Mick
 
G'day Bushman

I tried to leave a "visitor message" with the links I spoke of, but was unable to :confused:

Instead I tried to email them to you.

If you don't get them via the forums email facility, leave me a visitor message with your email address & I'll re-send them. If you don't want your email address displayed on the forum, send me an email at mickh@ihug.com.au and I'll send them privately.

I really don't expect anyone to take my word for things until proven otherwise (which is part of the reason I include pics & videos in my posts :D ) :thumbup:




Kind regards
Mick
 
As a complete outsider with only a very few post on this board but with some read time on this board may I offer this. Most people that go into the bush whether it's the dense forests or the deserts of the southwest go in with a game plan. Your friends and loved ones will have a general idea of where you are going. Those that go off trail will have the know how to deal with a night that you didn't expect. Most people that take the road less travelled in the bush can handle a night or two.

I'm not sure if this post is meant for those that don't leave the comfort of home for more than a day, but there is still sage advice in this thread for those people that don't. Techniques and priorities will vary by situation and location and that is the truth. Knowledge and skill will help no matter the place. Take it for what it's worth. Proper planning helps prevent piss poor performance. So many acronyms for covering your rear. ;)
 
Okay, The answers pretty much sum it up.

The mirror is for signaling- the specific desert environment in question was the SW US desert, and there's almost zero chance in a "normal" survival situation that you won't see aircraft every hour or so.

The coat is for shade, and warmth if it goes that long.

The shovel is for getting down to the <95 degrees dirt. (not that far down)
 
arcana

deep beneath the soothing dirt
of barren lands, the lizard sleeps
and far from green and noisy strands
his quiet, lonely vigil keeps

he knows the silence of the dust
and how the heat drives men to drink
and why the wind said that we must
and what the passing beetles think

so while we shuffle through the sand
arriving where we'd rather not
the lizard understands
the sun is hot

-- EB
 
DOC-CANADA said:
Old CW4, I can't say I blame you.

BTW, as a result of this thread a forum member, who will remain nameless, contacted me inquiring about the other forum I mentioned being invited to. He's had enough, and I might not be too far behind him, and that would be a real shame because of the number of members, hell, not just members, friends that I would be leaving behind.

I really hope it doesn't come to that.

Doc
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That would be real shame indeed, Doc.
 
DOC-CANADA said:
Old CW4, I can't say I blame you.

BTW, as a result of this thread a forum member, who will remain nameless, contacted me inquiring about the other forum I mentioned being invited to. He's had enough, and I might not be too far behind him, and that would be a real shame because of the number of members, hell, not just members, friends that I would be leaving behind.

I really hope it doesn't come to that.

Doc
Click to expand...

Old CW4 said:
Doc-Canada,
Yeah, thanks. PM me and tell me where you're going and I'll follow you. I've about had it with the juveniles and witless nit pickers on this forum. Unfortunately, I paid for a so-called 'platinum membership' a while back and now I'm now becoming sorry I did. Oh well. you win some, you lose some..
Click to expand...


Gentleman,

I assure you, your input here is more than welcome. You're noble contributers and many would be sad to have you leave. This is a forum, and unfortunately some bad comes with the good. The internet is unfortunately a place where many come to unleash the negativity that they brew and steep within themselves. We all take the good with the bad in life, as well as here. We'll see this through and come out better.

This place is so dynamic that it's hard to really understand the nuances taking place all at once. You can really feel the mood of some change from day to day. Despite our change in moods it is important to moderate our attitude towards others here. I had a horrible day but despite that, look forward to reading this board. I think the most important thing is that we all remain polite and gracious. That is the glue which binds us. This is essentially a place to share opinions and argue with reason, in a polite fashion.

Whatever turn this thread took, we can let it go, if we choose to.
 
PayetteRucker said:
Originally Posted by koyote
Environment can make a huge difference.

I remember back in 80s, one of our desert survival classes had a list of things you had to prioritze. This was classic "what's in your car after the wreck in the middle of the desert"
Click to expand...

Well, Mr. PayetteRucker, considering that in the post below you claim to be 21:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8157999&postcount=2

It is hard to imagine how you took a survival course 30 years ago.
 
It was Koyote's reminiscence, Knarfeng :)

koyote said:
[...]
I remember back in 80s, one of our desert survival classes had a list of things you had to prioritze. This was classic "what's in your car after the wreck in the middle of the desert" [...]
Click to expand...
 
Before any contributing members consider jumping ship for greener grass, please consider using the ignore button on those whom you find unpalatable. It is a breeze of fresh mountain air.

If you have never done so, give it a shot. First remember the spelling of the offender. Second scroll to the top of the screen and hit the "User CP" button (put mouse arrow on words "user cp" then hit your left mouse button. Your user control panel will come up. On the left side of the screen is several options. Half way down is an "edit ignore list" button. Left mouse button click that. Next type in the PayetteRucker's name and hit enter, as an example. Then enjoy the silence.

You can also report bad posts. There is an exclamation point next to the post number. Hit that and type reason for the report (example attacking another member, foul language, etc.).
 
wow you can last 40 days with out food....? i fasted for a full 8 days once and i thought i was going to die, i cant belive you can actually go 40..................
 
The idea is not to tell you an exact amount of time you can survive each of these conditions! The idea is to scale the conditions from one to another. In other words, minutes without air, days without water, weeks without food as an estimate. Each of these can vary depending on environment and personal condition. This does tell you to think about what needs dealing with first, and what can be taken care of much later.
 
Iboschi said:
Gentleman,

I assure you, your input here is more than welcome. You're noble contributers and many would be sad to have you leave. This is a forum, and unfortunately some bad comes with the good. The internet is unfortunately a place where many come to unleash the negativity that they brew and steep within themselves. We all take the good with the bad in life, as well as here. We'll see this through and come out better.

This place is so dynamic that it's hard to really understand the nuances taking place all at once. You can really feel the mood of some change from day to day. Despite our change in moods it is important to moderate our attitude towards others here. I had a horrible day but despite that, look forward to reading this board. I think the most important thing is that we all remain polite and gracious. That is the glue which binds us. This is essentially a place to share opinions and argue with reason, in a polite fashion.

Whatever turn this thread took, we can let it go, if we choose to.
Click to expand...

I just thought that was worth repeating. Well said!
 
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