Thinking about a Randall. Are they up to serious use?

The carbon steel Randalls are made from O1 that is, if you believe their website (get it cherry red and dunk it) probably not even close to being optimally heat treated as far as soak time, etc, but the blades are left pretty soft, so toughness is not going to be an issue.
 
The carbon steel Randalls are made from O1 that is, if you believe their website (get it cherry red and dunk it) probably not even close to being optimally heat treated as far as soak time, etc, but the blades are left pretty soft, so toughness is not going to be an issue.

I am guessing that they do this on purpose. There is always a tradeoff between edge-holding and toughness, for the intended use they probably want more toughness. You can always resharpen it but if the blade breaks you won't be able to put it back together.

But it is also likely that they have been doing it this way for very many years, the knives work, so they see no need to change it. They don't seem to have any problem selling their knives and I doubt if they have customers complaining about them.

I'm not a Busse expert or even a Busse fan, but their knives might be one example of what Randalls could be if they evolved to keep up more with the latest state of the art.
 
If you are prepared to wait on an order from RMK then they will customise the blade grind to some degree. I ordered a 1-7 and a 5-6 from them a few years back with a dull top edge to avoid some importation and ownership issues re definitions of 'daggers'. There was no additional cost.

Wow! Who are you, a senator? Who did you talk to? They will not listen to a customer request a blade change. Forget it, you will be laughed at, and then reminded that they serve a collectors market. It was a sad day for me as a knife user. I tie knots and a ton of stuff when I use my knives. Choils are the devil's best weapon against me, the line almost always gets pulled back into the choil where there is not cutting edge. I still have the Email from Gary Randall, telling me there was no way they would modify the blade for my intended use.

However their knives are pretty much the same they have always been. Very respectable in practical use and each one hand made. There has to be a little something special in handmade knives. In production it is about numbers, not the finished product. I suspect, though I have never been to the shop, that each knife is done by hand, and at various steps it either passes or fails, and the failures get sent back down the production schedule for repair. I doubt they would risk their reputation on a bad knife hitting a user and in turn letting the whole world know via the Internet. Do you think a company can maintain a reputation for so long, with a manufactured item like a knife and not have everyone find out they are slacking in a relatively short time?

I only have one or two knives from Randall I would baby. The rest have either been rehandled, or used. in taking the handle away I saw the guts if you will, like an MRI I saw what was beneath the material. It was not fluff and material saving cuts in the steel, no hidden gussets to strengthen the length, just forged steel and good materials.

So for those pic's.
My first and most used Randall, I even cut off half of the brass guard off because it was annoying the hell out of me while camping.
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I forced the patina many years later, and the knife has been beat to hell.

I have carried and used Randall's for quite awhile now. I never thought of the Randall as a collectors knife, because that was never my experience with them. Randall's were the notable knife I saw when someone used a knife. Everything else was a Buck knife or a scout pattern of sorts. The industry has exploded with world-wide options in the last 15 years or so.

This Randall, besides having a handle just like the one above from the shop, was ground down to a CDT and I personally saw what lied hidden underneath the Randall handles in regards to tangs. It is unlike any other production blade made now. Full, thick, complete, and often tapered to be thicker not thinner.
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The Randall knives are no more collectors items now than they were back when W.D. Randall started the company.
 
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If you like the style of Randall knives take a good look at the Blackjack line from Bark River. No wait, lower price, and better steel.
 
Blackjack knives are not cheaper (they are only faster, and have a flat not convex grind, and have no options to customize them), where did this misconception take root gents?
 
The Randall knives are no more collectors items now than they were back when W.D. Randall started the company.
Dude, are you high?:eek::D They are primarily collectors items and have been for years. People who collect Randalls are not knife collectors.....they are Randall collectors and would rarely, if ever consider buying any other type of knife.;)
 
Blackjack knives are not cheaper (they are only faster, and have a flat not convex grind, and have no options to customize them), where did this misconception take root gents?
Are you sure about that? All of the Blackjacks that I have ever seen are convex ground and the Randalls are flat or a VERY shallow "big wheel" hollow grind. And they are a LOT cheaper than Randalls.
 
No I am not, and now I recall. JDM is correct Blackjacks are Convex not flat, and Randall's are reportedly hollow, though the wheel's they used were HUGE.
 
Blackjack knives are not cheaper (they are only faster, and have a flat not convex grind, and have no options to customize them), where did this misconception take root gents?

I said they were lower priced, which is true. I can't get a Randall #1 for under $200 without a time machine. Also all Blackjack Classic Blades have convex edges grinds.
 
Dude, are you high?:eek::D They are primarily collectors items and have been for years. People who collect Randalls are not knife collectors.....they are Randall collectors and would rarely, if ever consider buying any other type of knife.;)

I didn't seer this post when I hit reply on the other. I LOL'd

Common use, and intended purpose are not the same thing.
 
I said they were lower priced, which is true. I can't get a Randall #1 for under $200 without a time machine.

You are correct as well. I was wrong.

Blackjack knives are cheaper than Randall in just about every way. But the cost of the Blackjack is lower.
 
Let's put it in this way; I just ordered 2 Randalls....!!! I am not sure if I will use both but at least one will be meeting the field.
 
Thank you, my education is fine, and even though I have masters deg. in Math and comp science, I did get pretty good education on US Space program, mainly because I was interested in all things space related. Having said that, I have never seen any accounts of knife testing for space program, which would be very interesting.

I am unaware of any TESTING that was done. However, NASA apparently did have a direct hand in DESIGNING the Model 17. Quoted from Randall Made Knives: The History of the Man and the Blades by Robert L. Gaddis, pp. 171-185:
Quote:
For Bo, this all began on 25 November 1959 when two well-groomed men in casual attire showed up at the knifeshop beside his home. Later, when questioned about the visit, Bo remembered that the two were interested in a special knife with about a 5-inch, or at most 6-inch, blade. It had to be very strong, which wasn't any problem at this knifeshop, but it also had to be capable of storing a few itmes in a compartment of the handle. "Nobody's ever seen a knife like that!" Bo replied.

Then the men introduced themselves as Capt. Leroy Gordon Cooper, Jr., and Dr. William K. "Bill" Douglas from the National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) Space Task Group. Suddenly realizing that he was talking to one of the well-publicized American astronauts and their team doctor, Bo "liked to have dropped dead!"

After regaining his composure, Bo brought out one of his Model 15 Airmen knives and related the story about its development for the Marine Corps as a pilot's survival knife. It was readily apparent to the NASA men that this design already came very close to meeting their requirements and that Bo was exactly the knifemaker they sought....

Besides looking over a finished Model 15 knife, Cooper and Douglas inspected some Solingen blades, without hilts or handles. At this point, all assumed the final knife would be carried on the space suits, so size and weight were major considerations. They discussed thinning the entire blade and probably the idea of a hiltless design also. Cutting out the center part of the tang would both reduce weight and creaet a cavity for matches and/or other small survival items. They ruled out the Model 15's green Tenite handle and considered the concept of a handleless style, with the blade tang wrapped in tape and fishing line....

This November 1959 visit was the first of numerous trips to the Randall knifeshop and residence. Between trips, they exchanged ideas and some experimental hardware by mail, and considered many alternatives before making their final decision. During this time, the Randall family hosted a number of the astronauts and became real friends in the process.

...By then, the guardless style was out, and the requirements for an extra-strong double hilt appeared to be in force. The sketch showed a relatively short 2 1/4-inch double hilt with reinforcing bolsters behind it. There was even a short bolt and nut through the bolsters and blade tang for added strength. A metal clip, 1 1/4 inches long, was shown over the blade point, extending back to cover the upper part of the blade tip. Pointing to this, a note, in writing not Bo's, stated: "Some type of clip that will clip over point for cutting suit after making hole with point." This one was sketched without handle slabs, and another handwriting added: "Could put small hacksaw blade under tape on handle." This effort was just another step along the path to their final knives....

On 25 May, Bo thought of something they all had missed and wrote to Cooper the next day. "Why not," asked Bo, "use stainless steel for the hilt to be certain of strength, then have it electrically welded in place? This will be sure of the hilt; also will have that much more room behind hilt for packing in items. O.K.?" He then drew a rough sketch of his idea on the following page of this letter. Later on that same day, he must have become convinced that this was the way to solve their hilt problems because he made a full-scale drawing of the hilt and tang portion of the Astro Knife, titling it "Astro Knife Handle Layout."

...On 6 December 1963, Cooper, accompanied by a Gemini Program astronaut, Tom Stafford, paid a surprise visit to the Randall residence. Bo was outside in the yard attending to some bit of business when they drove up unexpectedly. The two men stood talking for a few minutes by the front porch, when suddenly, and with any fanfare, Cooper reached into his pocket and brought out his Astro knife, the one that had been with him on his historic flight. He handed it to Bo, saying something to the effect that Bo had done so much for him and the other astronauts that he wished him to have this "space knife" as a personal thank you.

Bo said that he wasn't quite sure of Cooper's exact words because at the time he was overcome by emotion. Of all the knives in his extensive collection, this always was the one as far as Bo Randall was concerned. It was not placed in the museum until after his death. Bo kept it at home, in a specially made glass case.

Unfortunately, that is not always the case. Still, I'd rather know some facts vs. generic "rigorous tests". Especially that a knife is not astronauts primary working tool. At least in their "astronauty" work, they try to stay away from all things sharp, because the gloves on space suits are the most vulnerable parts, small tear could be potentially lethal.

This was supposed to be a survival knife, not a tool for use in a pressure suit.

Cut themselves out of space capsule? As in through ceramic plates, titanium alloys and such? I doubt that :) As for the survival of the astronauts using aforementioned knife, that would be on earth, and probably in the conditions other knives and humans would face as well. O1 at 56GRC is still O1, in space or on earth, same for 440B.

Yeah, that sounded wrong to me too. The only thing I can think of is that the poster conflated this with the design for the Model 15, which needed to support cutting through the fuselage and/or canopy of an aircraft, not a space capsule.
 
Question is what did they do with them. Were they actually used? How long and for what? Just the fact that they went up there doesn't tell much.

People recovered a Randall made knife from a space capsule that had been soaked in the ocean for 40 years, and found it still serviceable after some cleaning.
 
Here is one that has been a user for right at 30 years. Its my fathers. O1 and has been all you can ask for in a hunting knife, and worth much more than was paid for it 30 years ago.

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I have not pulled the trigger on a RMK yet, but when I do, I want one like that. Perhaps not that model, but one that has lots of use on it.

To answer the OP, I will say (in the absence of any first hand experience) that they are absolutely up to the task of "serious knife use". Are they up to "stupid knife use"? I am not sure, and I do not care.

I will suggest that many have used them well and hard for decades without issue, and I expect that when I get one, it will serve as expected. Modern super steel? No, but plenty good enough for anyone that ACTUALLY knows how to use a knife!
 
Nope, sorry. Forging doesn't make steel any tougher, although its a commonly held belief in the knife world. Its all in the heat treatment, whether the knife is made through stock removal or forging. A selectively tempered blade will be tougher, yes, but that isn't exclusive to the forging process either.

Randalls are old school. They are designed and made to be used and hold up to whatever you need to use them for. Beyond the use of O1, my understanding is that they use FORGED O1 which should take the toughness one step higher.
 
This 01 Model 3 has been in the family since 1945. It was retired after four decades of use and is still as serviceable as the day it was bought:

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a soldier in Somalia in 93 was carrying a Airman 15 when a bullet from an AK47 hit it and saved his life.

Here's a pic of the Model 15 that saved Navy Seal John Gay's life during "Blackhawk Down" and a note from John on the incident:

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Best,
 
People recovered a Randall made knife from a space capsule that had been soaked in the ocean for 40 years, and found it still serviceable after some cleaning.
Yeah, I read that piece on wikipedia too. However, think about it, what does that really tell you? Just the fact that the knife was highly stainless steel, and probably well packed/oiled too. If Randall used AISI 420 in their knives instead of 440B, then that same knife from the bottom of the ocean would've been even in a better shape, and would require less cleaning. 316 would've required very little and so on.
All you can learn form that fact is that stainless steel knife hasn't been completely destroyed in salt water. So? And if it was Randalls or anyone else's non stainless steel in there for 40 years it'd be totally ruined, but that doesn't mean the knife was bad, simply not stainless.

Same for the whole space thing. Yes, it was honor and achievement/recognition of Randalls to have their knife selected, but they were not the only one and it was 50 years ago. And those knives were not and are not made out of some mystical/hitech materials or poses some specific qualities making them SPACE worthy. Just a survival knife, designed to used on land, not in space. It is no more of a space knife, than any kitchen knife is a diving knife because it was on a submerged submarine.

I guess it wouldn't sound so impressive, just another survival knife :) But if it went to space!!! Then it's something special. Even though that knife was just siting in some compartment all the time, somehow that's supposed to mean the knife is a benchmark for other knives, when in fact today O1 steel at 56HRC is hardly a benchmark for anything. Theoretically it was "rigorously" tested, but nobody is ever asking how it was tested, or what were the test results. And unlike us, NASA might've had their ideas what they wanted from a land survival knife 50 years ago. After all NASA is a space agency and their primary goal was to avoid putting astronauts in the situation when they'd have to use that knife.
 
One thing I thought there would be more of and that is "user pic's" from guys who have them.

Most of the used ones shown here were being used "back in the day" ... has anyone bought a recent Randall and used it ? If so what do you think ?
 
We dont see as many user pics of Randall knives because 90% of them are safe queens. And the ones that are used are generally older knives because that's what people bought them for long ago.
I get excited to see new pics of used Randalls because I have searched high and low for pics and user reviews and have damn near seen them all.
I also don't consider opening mail as being "used".
And I agree, the history behind the brand is neat, and O1 steel works just fine, but there are much better knives for the $ if you plan to actually use it.
And I can barely wait a few months for a custom, much less 5 years.
No doubt, they're classic, and beautiful knives, but I cant justify buying one from a user perspective.
 
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