Those Chinese Knives...

cchu518 said:
Here here. This subject always seems to derail. More knife discussion less politics. If you don't like or won't buy a Chinese manufactured knife that's OK too. It's irrespective of a lot of quality pieces that are coming out there. I did a double take the first time I got a Kizer in a trade. If you didn't know the brand you would swear it was a quality knife.

The first week I was expecting the sky to fall trying to figure out what the catch was. I ultimately accepted that it was a great knife. The grind on the s35v blade was incredible.
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The problem with these topics (as it seems to me) is that there is no non-political reason to avoid buying from China. EDIT: At least buying from higher quality companies like Kizer, Reate, etc.

That's why these topics always devolve into people screaming from their soapboxes.
 
nick21 said:
The problem with these topics (as it seems to me) is that there is no non-political reason to avoid buying from China. EDIT: At least buying from higher quality companies like Kizer, Reate, etc.

That's why these topics always devolve into people screaming from their soapboxes.
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I think you've nailed it. If not the only reason, it's at least a big one.
 
China used to represent lower quality manufacturing, like Korea did and Japan before that. Now China runs the gamut, being known for both extremely technical, quality goods and shoddy, unsafe products.

I would contrast that with someplace like Pakistan, which is a cheap place to make things, but not one yet associated with high degrees of precision and quality.



So a discussion of Chinese knives is always going to be based on the massive breadth of quality and ethical standards the goods were made under, and whether (considering the politics of aiding a foreign aggressor nation) it is worth it in larger context to buy their goods when there isn't even an economic advantage in doing so.

I don't see how you can keep politics out of a thread whose title isn't a brand but a nation.
 
I just can't trust when they say s35vn,that it's really 8cr13mov-I mean the prc lets/encourages child labor any group or government that exploits so wantonly those so vulnerable in their society it pretty much negates any other accomplishments they may do,just seems like a disrespect for humanity.
 
You can trust it... I mean Crucible has even said that they sell S35VN to Kizer... And Kizer has records of it as well. I love when people use USA made as the pinnacle for quality. Have you seen the Taiwan offerings to the US offerings by Spyderco? I got a Reate made knife in hand and have just been blown away by the quality.
 
To all who don't like the Chinese brands...please don't buy them. I'd rather have first pick hahaha
 
Hackenslash said:
Hey, no fair using "U.S. Post Office" and "success" in the same sentence without warning me to swallow my coffee first.

This has nothing to do with postal rates or tariffs. It has to do with manufacturing costs, government regulation, labor cost and the common dilemma that is facing all brick and mortar stores in the internet era.
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Sure, that's what the USPS wants you to think. DangCat nailed it. The USPS and the Chinese government are in cahoots to control the global economy.
 
DangCat said:
Good point. Just remember where you got your widget when the fur flies.
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And where you got the device you are using to post in this thread!

If you believe the Chinese are using slave labor or something, and buy nothing that is in any way, shape, or form manufactured using Chinese materials, labor, technology, support structure etc etc etc, then I guess good for you.

But otherwise, basically you are boycotting Walmart for selling cheese from France because it undecuts the Wisconsin cheese industry.

Economy is global, and China is just another capitalist country.
 
I'm more concerned about the company I'm buying the knife from.
They're the ones who ensure quality control.

Spyderco checked and found out what steel was really being used, so now we have accurate labeling of steel. :)

The Chinese can make stuff as good or as crappy as you (and the company) want, so make sure you're buying from a company that wants it good.
 
I'm starting to reverse my avoidance of knives coming out of China. Like many of you, for the longest time I equated the products coming from there as cheap crap. $2 gas station folders or shameless knockoffs.

However, once I saw what companies like Spyderco and Kershaw can have produced there, I started looking harder. The Byrd line of knives are some of my favorite users. Not because I can beat on them but because I can beat on them AND they work. The fit and finish of them is fantastic for sub 30 dollars.

Rough Rider folders are great user slip joints. Once again not because they are cheap but because they work and they are inexpensive enough that you'll use them.

I recently have decided to give Boker's new SAK style knife a try. It's made in China. However all of the reviews I have read talk about the premium steel and the extraordinary walk and talk of the tools. More than one review has chimed in how it actually feels like an upgraded Victorinox. That, to me, is saying something when Vic is basically synonymous with high quality mass produced pocket tools. The Boker should be here Thursday, so hopefully it lives up to the reviews.

I understand that some folks have a hard time buying from China. I too find a lot of their goods lackluster. However, there are some products made out there that are quality and an absolute value at twice their cost. It's just gravy to be able to get them so affordability.
 
marcinek said:
And where you got the device you are using to post in this thread!

If you believe the Chinese are using slave labor or something, and buy nothing that is in any way, shape, or form manufactured using Chinese materials, labor, technology, support structure etc etc etc, then I guess good for you.

But otherwise, basically you are boycotting Walmart for selling cheese from France because it undecuts the Wisconsin cheese industry.

Economy is global, and China is just another capitalist country.
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I agree with your post, however the Chinese government is still hard line communist. I'm not sure how they reconcile that with capitalism.
 
josephrogers said:
You can trust it... I mean Crucible has even said that they sell S35VN to Kizer... And Kizer has records of it as well. I love when people use USA made as the pinnacle for quality. Have you seen the Taiwan offerings to the US offerings by Spyderco? I got a Reate made knife in hand and have just been blown away by the quality.
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I'm on the forums quite a bit and have not run across Crucible's statement concerning steel sale to China,and if they are good for them and the jobs they are creating...but China has serious credibility issues(the fact that we need a statement from a U.S. manuf. to reinforce our trust is pretty telling) and it is going to take a while for me to get to the point where I spend 300.00 on a Chinese made knife.
I was not talking about Taiwan ,Taiwan does not have the Human rights issues that China has..and I totally agree that they put out some very nice work,as far as that goes some Chinese knives are over the top nice.
There are too many nice USA made knives that I like ,for me to start buying expensive Chinese made knives.
 
BITEME said:
I'm on the forums quite a bit and have not run across Crucible's statement concerning steel sale to China,and if they are good for them and the jobs they are creating...but China has serious credibility issues(the fact that we need a statement from a U.S. manuf. to reinforce our trust is pretty telling) and it is going to take a while for me to get to the point where I spend 300.00 on a Chinese made knife.
I was not talking about Taiwan ,Taiwan does not have the Human rights issues that China has..and I totally agree that they put out some very nice work,as far as that goes some Chinese knives are over the top nice.
There are too many nice USA made knives that I like ,for me to start buying expensive Chinese made knives.
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I do remember seeing a thread hear on BF showing shipping invoices from Crucible to Kizer, or Reate.

Don't take my word for it, search for it.
 
Not try to stir things up but just for the sake of argument, that company A verifies company B bought from it material C is not the same as company B uses material C in all its knives that are claimed to use material C. A more reliable way to tell the truth is a random sample of B's knives are tested by a third party for the use of material C.
 
BITEME said:
I'm on the forums quite a bit and have not run across Crucible's statement concerning steel sale to China,and if they are good for them and the jobs they are creating...but China has serious credibility issues(the fact that we need a statement from a U.S. manuf. to reinforce our trust is pretty telling) and it is going to take a while for me to get to the point where I spend 300.00 on a Chinese made knife.
I was not talking about Taiwan ,Taiwan does not have the Human rights issues that China has..and I totally agree that they put out some very nice work,as far as that goes some Chinese knives are over the top nice.
There are too many nice USA made knives that I like ,for me to start buying expensive Chinese made knives.
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so how does kizer/reate knife relate to china human right or even policy set by CCP? i mean you buy iphone or samsung dont you?
 
BITEME said:
I'm on the forums quite a bit and have not run across Crucible's statement concerning steel sale to China,and if they are good for them and the jobs they are creating...but China has serious credibility issues(the fact that we need a statement from a U.S. manuf. to reinforce our trust is pretty telling) and it is going to take a while for me to get to the point where I spend 300.00 on a Chinese made knife.
I was not talking about Taiwan ,Taiwan does not have the Human rights issues that China has..and I totally agree that they put out some very nice work,as far as that goes some Chinese knives are over the top nice.
There are too many nice USA made knives that I like ,for me to start buying expensive Chinese made knives.
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I'll try to answer the steel question to the best of my memory. I don't have time to search links and the various sources, but I've been the OKFB (Original Kizer Fan Boy) for a long time. Please don't take this as rock-solid, gospel, word for word exact truth, but this is basically how it all played out. You can google Tim Britton vs. Kizer if you want to find more.

This came out during the Tim Britton Tango vs. the Kizer Ki401B1 dispute. During the course of Tim Britton being discredited as the originator of the Ki401B1 (only this particular knife, I've heard some of his other work is excellent), Kizer and CPM revealed invoices proving that CPM S35VN was purchased in the appropriate quantities and at the appropriate times. Kizer also shared third party assay testing that indicated that the steel in the Ki401B1 met the typical tolerances of S35VN. This was just one in a series of small validations on the part of Kizer that eventually led up to the general understanding that Kizer was legit and Tim was being less than honest. When I first saw the Tango, I thought it was cool as heck and emotionally I immediately sided with the American designer. The evidence for me, and most other impartial viewers, was conclusive in the favor of Kizer when all was said and done. One of the first Kizers I bought was a Ki401B1 and it's been a slow burn for my wallet since then :D

Edit: OK, I found this...http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1265239-Tim-Britton-The-Full-Story
 
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If you havn't read or heard about the knifegate episode ^ above you gotta read it. Terribly entertaining! Also showed the true colors of an American trying to get one over on his fellow American!
 
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