Time to get a gun? Time to get advice.

dartfrogger said:
My head is almost literally spinning after logging on this morning and seeing all the responses to my question. I know this is an emotional issue, and it's a very serious one. I'm not even sure I could actually fire a gun at someone, and as one poster said, if I don't think I can, don't get a gun.

But I think the best advice is to take a course in basic firearms. I'll drop by the gun range and see what they offer.

It's true, my mindset is definitely in a different place than most of you. I was thinking that I could get a gun and hide it away, just in case. But what good is a gun that takes 10 minutes to get to, in an emergency? I obviously need to get familiar with handguns -- I should say get comfortable. Then I'll know what course I should follow. At this point, though, I can't imagine myself walking around the house with a gun on my belt, and for sure I can't imagine having a shotgun. That attitude may have a lot to do with my complete ignorance of guns.

Many thanks to all of you who took the time to respond. I'll let you know what happens.
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If you have a shot gun, you can use less lethal rounds (bean bag rounds), also there is the Taser, which can down a single assailant. Look into a Taser or less lethal ammo, bean bag shot gun loads, can you shoot some one w/ a bean bag at a distance, and hurt them as a deterrent. The whole idea is something you should research and think about. But remember, while your thinking and planning, so is the bad guy.
 
I would recommend a .38 Special revolver with a four inch barrel. Revolvers are easier to understand and, some say, more reliable, than automatics. You just pull the trigger and they go bang. .38 Special ammo is relatively inexpensive for practice, and can be had in decent self-defense loadings. Once you have your gun, I would recommend formal training and practice, practice, practice. If you're married, same goes for your spouse.

Obviously, if you have young ones around, you have to keep your weapon secure.

I know what you mean about danger in safe neighborhoods. I lived in one of the best suburbs in the Chicago area. One morning, my next door neighbor awakened to an armed intruder in her bedroom. A few months later, my neighbor on the other side and one across the street were burglarized, while they were home asleep.

My own family was victimized by a home invader who kicked in the door and proceeded with an attempt to rape my mother. I was just a toddler at the time but I watched this happening. Fortunately, my dad beat the shit out of the guy and he fled.

I think you're wise to consider protecting yourself. 911 is a great concept but response takes time and the police can only be in so many places at the same time.

Good luck.
 
Willieboy said:
I would recommend a .38 Special revolver with a four inch barrel. Revolvers are easier to understand and, some say, more reliable, than automatics. You just pull the trigger and they go bang. .38 Special ammo is relatively inexpensive for practice, and can be had in decent self-defense loadings.
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Big +1 on starting with a revolver - tough, reliable and safe.

Just building on the above post - you could also consider a .357 revolver like the S&W 686 or less expensive Ruger GP100 - you get the awesome power of .357 BUT they can also take the .38 Special round to save some $$$...

I use a shotgun for home defense - good old Remington 870.
 
Dizwolf said:
One thing I realize we've glossed over/ missed.

Even with the best firearms and training, there is no replacement for a simple alarm system, warning motion lights, and best of all a good dog. Doesn't even have to be a large breed. I used to laugh at little dogs. Moved in with a girlfriend who had two doxxies. No good in an attack, but they were the best early warning dogs I'd seen. Loud barking didn't hurt either
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I second this. I live in a rural area and if the SHTF I am on my own for some time even if I get a chance to call 911. We get at least 1 broken down or low on gas vehicle a month stopping by the house or coming up to the door. I hate being taken by surprise when someone knocks on the door, or is in the yard, even if their intentions are benign. But our dogs would have to be really tired to not make noise when someone is in the yard, or even pulled over on the road. And I would have to be really tired (and negligent) not to at least look out the window.

One other thought - lots of good discussion on hardware but unless you are in law enforcement you may never have had the opportunity to witness the behavior of really violent people. I have had only a few encounters (I'm just the average mind-my-own business civilian) but they have scared the crap out of me - as in, how do I get out of this? They did not lead to (much) violence and were resolved by law enforcement, but I do not want to be the unarmed party in such encounters. Some people are just not right in the head (for whatever reason).
 
Well we have just confirmed what is probably the 3rd most popular topic of discussion for the RAT Pack; guns. Knives and beautiful women are #1 and #2 but I am not sure of the order of preference some days.

Dartfrogger, you have gotten so much excellent advice already that I won't even through in my thoughts but I would offer to take you to the range if you happen to live in the Delaware Valley region; SE PA, DE or NJ. I would be happy to let you try a nice cross section of handguns. You could buy yourself some range ammo but I would furnish the handguns. I didn't see you answer where exactly you were located.

Another issue to educate yourself on would be the particular laws related to purchasing, ownership, transporting, carrying a handgun in your state.

Best of luck.
 
Dartfrogger, Take a good safety class, then a 12 Ga. and a 9mm . and a great Hawk is Great too.
 
I own a remington 870, and I'm in the process of getting a springfield xd 9mm for conceiled carry. As everyone said take a class, or a few classes, and really get to know your firearms so that you can load them under high pressure situations. Also you should know whether or not you are comfortable shooting somebody and taking a life. If you won't pull the trigger, don't get the gun.
 
Lots of good points made here. Definitely take a course if you arent familiar with guns at all. I had several guys buy guns from me this summer who said "I've never shot a gun before so this will be interesting" and I just wanted to deny the sale.

For home defense a Shotgun is a good idea (preferably a 6-8 shot pump). Most of the time you can scare away the bad guys by shucking that pump. If not, you've got lots of power and when its dark, and your adrenaline is pumping, you dont necessarily always get to aim as well as you like so a scattergun is not a bad tool.

I recently bought a Ruger police Service Six .357 magnum revolver for less that $300 used. It was made in 1983 and still shoots every time and is more accurate than my SIG P220 .45, and my HK USPC 9mm. Right now it's my top choice for HD. NO handgun is simpler than a revolver (I agree with whoever asked how a revolver is more maintenance required than an auto). If you dont know anything about guns, a Revolver is a great gun to start with. You put the bullets in, push the cylinder back into the chamber, and either pull back the hammer then pull the trigger, or just pull the trigger. If it doesnt shoot, pull again.. repeat as necessary. At first I was worried about only having 6 shots, but like I said, it's so accurate I'm confident that 6 is plenty. You can shoot .38 specials for practice (lighter kicking, less expensive) and then use the .357mag for the real deal. I shot both .38s and .357s in my first outing with my revolver (never shot either caliber) and I was very surprised with how well I shot both calibers. There was no difference in my groupings. The kick and noise is worse with the .357, but so is the damage it causes. You can find a cheap used Ruger or Smith and Wesson revolver online at www.gunbroker.com. I highly recommend The Ruger Six Series (Service six, security six, Speed six). They are SOLID revolvers for a low cost (they are no longer produced).

Good luck!
 
i would shy away from less lethal rounds... criminals can sue you for pain and suffering. they can call you a sadist, and say you have violent tendancies...
 
dartfrogger said:
Thanks for your advice.

Dennis
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This is alot of information and there is alot of back and forth about which is the best route for home defense. This is because there are so many different routes you can take that are equally effective. Here is how I have my 1 bedroom apartment set up. I spend most of my time inside my house while on my computer. I have my revolver strapped under the drawer so if someone comes in while I am home chances are it will be right at hand. I have my S&W handgun hidden securely but easily accessible at my door, so if someone comes to the door and I respond it will be there. My shotgun is loaded with birdshot, so it won't penetrate walls but still drop an intruder, next to where I sleep. There are so many ways you can securely and safely store a firearm at the ready inside of your home. I'd go on a limb and say there are more gun forums out there than anything right now, and all of them are chalked full of information and ideas that you can use at your disposal. Home defense does not have to be risky, involved or expensive. The research may take a bit but you can find something out there that works for you.
 
If you want to own a gun and think that you may want to use it as a crime deterrent. You MUST shoot often. I would start out going at least once a month until you are more than proficient. If you ever need it you'll be in a high stress situation and may be a little panicked.

Let's remember,
If you need a gun for self defense
Then you need to use it
If so, your life must be in danger
Therefore, you fail you die.

You can't count on just having a gun to prevent people from hurting or robbing you and your loved ones.
If you are serious about a gun for self defense you MUST train. Otherwise you will more than likely hurt yourself or some innocent.
One thing you need to do is to change your perceptions. Self defense is a state of mine.
Good luck and hope you never need a gun.
-Chris
 
I would suggest going to a range and taking a firearms safty course first with that you will get a brief instruction on the basics of each type of firearm that you will probably encounter, from there rent many different types of firearms till you find one or many that you want to keep around for defense. I believe a handgun is best for home defence but there are others that disagree. Make sure you go to the range once a month to practice..(at least)
 
I could load my shotgun with 3'' blanks and in the 10 feet from me to the door, knock anyone flat on their ass. Anyone that has been hit by a shotgun blank will agree, just the force of the blast is enough to stun. I'm not using it as a combat shotgun for shots up to 50 yards, I'm using it to incapacitate someone that isn't supposed to be in my home. And the followup buttstroke will make sure if he didn't go down in the blast, he won't be getting up anytime soon.
 
otis williams said:
i would shy away from less lethal rounds... criminals can sue you for pain and suffering. they can call you a sadist, and say you have violent tendancies...
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You do have a valid point and most likely criminals would file a civil suit for pain & suffering. I only made the suggestion based on comments made against using lethal rounds. I would not use anything other than buckshot. Again I mention the Bernhard Goetz subway shooting, where 4 criminals attempted to mug/rob Goetz on the subway (1984). He shot them, with an unregistered weapon, was acquitted of murder/assault , but convicted of unregistered weapons possession, AND a civil case ensued 11 years after. The criminals were awarded MILLIONS ( 20-40 million) for pain & suffering. Aint that some crap!
 
Dorkhedeos said:
A shotgun would be useless in this case, but if someone ever broke in, it would be useful seeing that you would have time to draw it. If you are really worried about somebody breaking in, get an axe or a baton. Your intruder doesnt know your house so you can just wait around a corner. When you go seeking your intruder, you have a chance of getting hurt.
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IMO a shotgun with a pistle grip would work well for house protection. You can fill it with runbber bullets,bird shot ,OO, Slugs whatever. You can hit the person with the gun barrel. IMO it would be easier to shoot someone than to axe or stab someone. It takes guts to stab or axe someone. PPL freeze up.
 
PayetteRucker said:
I could load my shotgun with 3'' blanks and in the 10 feet from me to the door, knock anyone flat on their ass. Anyone that has been hit by a shotgun blank will agree, just the force of the blast is enough to stun. I'm not using it as a combat shotgun for shots up to 50 yards, I'm using it to incapacitate someone that isn't supposed to be in my home. And the followup buttstroke will make sure if he didn't go down in the blast, he won't be getting up anytime soon.
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Yup I didn't even read all the post but shot gun is easy when your tired just waking up and can't aim. You can use rubber/bag bullets for the first 2. Then 00 for the next 3. My auto shotgunn holds 12. I have 3 rubbers and 00 with slugs. First ones aren't lethal that's my excuse if that doesn't stop them. Not to mention my 1911 and 40 caliber Glocks :eek:
 
Tripton said:
Not too familiar with guns...are ya?

An axe? Really?
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Im assuming youve never been broken into. An untrained person with a gun is extremely dangerous especially when they are under stress and on edge. What if that intruder wasnt really an intruder and he fires because he was spooked? Nobody wants to be responsible for somebodys death, especially when they didnt really need to die.

If you go seeking your intruder and he knows you have a gun, he knows to either avoid you or wait for you to come round the corner. If he wasnt alone and you end up firing a round, that just alerted his partner that something is going on and he will know your location and that you are armed. A baton or an axe on the other hand will be quiet, it might even make it sound like the guy you hit tripped and fell. Who wants to mess around with a maniac with an axe? :D

The choice of defense also depends on local laws. As far as i know, where im from in CA, it is really hard to get away with shooting somebody. If you shoot somebody that was unarmed or didnt cause an immediate threat to you or anybody in your house, you will go to jail for a very long time as well as get sued.

Im not going to get into an argument over this because there are just too many what ifs.
 
otis williams said:
i would shy away from less lethal rounds... criminals can sue you for pain and suffering. they can call you a sadist, and say you have violent tendancies...
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More importantly, they cAn get back up. Oh they'll be injured, but it's not some college kid at a protest rally. I've had multiple rib breaks before. I got up and was VERY not happy. Bean bags have their place, but it's not for me. Someone intends me harm in my home, they're going down. I feel it's the only safe thing to do for me. The intruders safety is not my concern
 
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