TK Magazine "Wilderness Knife"

I would rather have more than not enough. I have hiked all over the country and have tried the ultra light thing. It was not a bad way to go, but I really did miss having a stout knife. Can We get by with a SAK, sure. Do I prefer a large blade, absolutely. A large blade can do anything that a small blade can do, but it don't work the other way around. I will leave a backpacking stove for cooking home before I hear out without a big knife. This is just my opinion and what I feel comfortable with.
 
Zaner01 said:
I recently flipped through a book on backpacking that said that carrying anything more than a 2-1/2 inch folder is a sure sign of "a greenhorn."
Click to expand...

LOL.

Here's my quote: "Someone thinking they can judge another's skill level by the size of their knife is a sure sign of a greenhorn."

Seriously, I don't even own a knife that's 2.5 inches. Even my SAKs are 3 1/8.
I've been hiking/camping/woodsbumming for 30 years or so.

I think it's funny how often people quote Nessmuk's "smoothing it" comment (NOT picking on Hollowdweller, I'm picking on the "internet ultralighters" that quote it, but don't "get it"), but forget his most prized, and by his admission, most used woods tool was his hatchet (which they'd have an infarction if you told them you carry one), followed by his pen knife.

Some tools are simply worth their weight due to their convenience.

Of course, I'm one of those guys that carries a huge hunk of steel around with him (20" HI CAK, or CGFBM). But. . .
1.) I don't pry with them (other than the recommended HI testing procedure).
2.) They don't drag my pants down -- I use a baldric :p

Can you do most chores without a big knife? Sure. Can you do all of them? No. Are some doable, but a real pain without a big blade? Yes.

Examples:
Firewood. Most times I go out, I also camp. When I camp I like a fire, so sue me. I use mostly deadfall. If I want the fire to burn for several hours while we sit around and try to shove our faces down the drunk, pretty girls' pants, you really want something bigger than a twig. Batoning a 4" branch with a 4.5" knife is a pain in the balls. With a chopper? Easy.

One kind of unique to the south. You want to cut off saw palmetto fronds to make a quick debris lean-to, and then get the base of the plant and cut it's tender little heart out and eat it in front of its compadres (palmetto hearts are pretty good eatin'), is much easier with a big chopper.

Oh, and big choppers don't have to be heavy. Machetes are pretty big and pretty light.

To keep this somewhat on track, I don't see anything wrong with that Dozier, so long as it works for him.
 
Id like to introduce a term...

Packsniffers: One whose judgement of others gear, whilst out in the woods, gives them a superiority complex. Characterized by constant critisizms of others gear, and satisfaction that they are more of a "woodsman" upon the discovery that some "ultralighter" dosnt carry______ or carries too much _____. This behavior is strangely much easier to find on internet forums than out in the ACTUAL woods.:D


Different strokes guys. Plenty of folks spend 5-6 months in the outdoors every year all over the country with not much more than a SAK. They cant all be idiots.


Why is it of all the things you could carry in the backcountry, bladeware has so much stigma attached to it? Would a person be critisized in there choice of tent or sleeping bag or pack, given theyve found a way to make it work for them?

On this forum I think its fair to say that we admire folks who can go into the woods with a minimum of gear, but that stops and turns to disdain at the mention of "ultralighter". Weird.:confused:

All that being said cool thread.;)
 
Runsalone said:
On this forum I think its fair to say that we admire folks who can go into the woods with a minimum of gear, but that stops and turns to disdain at the mention of "ultralighter". Weird.:confused:

All that being said cool thread.;)
Click to expand...

Noticed that too. But to weave the survival aspect in there;) not carrying heavy stuff when you are planning to go a long way and that resulting in less wear and tear to your body rather than gearing up for even a 1 in a million circumstance and hurting your body is a survival issue also.
 
There is a lot of good common sense in this post. Although there is a lot to the saying that the more skill you have the less you need, some of the ultralighters may go a little too far. You do have to provide for when things go wrong.

Someone once told me to find a knife I'm comfortable with and stick with it. I think that was good advice and is good advice for just about any tool. There is always going to be better quality tools out there than what you have at the moment. But, when you're skilled and comfortable with a decent one, you're going to be in good shape, and you're going to enjoy the outing.
 
From the book "Lighten Up"
Describing Don Ladigan:

When Don arrived I was suprised to see he had with him a tiny pack, barely big enough for a day hike, yet only partially full. Apparently he had either forgotten his real pack, or thought we were intending only a very short day hike.

Always the mother hen, I inquired and was astonished to hear the small pack was indeed his full pack. I was skeptical to say the least but it was midsummer, the weather conditions were mild and stable, the intended hike was on non technical terrain and not far from the road, and my assistant leader agreed that we would be able to provide whatever Don needed.

As it turned out, I've been learning from Don ever since. Instead of having to assist him, we spent much of the trip envying his light kit as we slogged under out heavy loads of "essentials" and did our best to keep up his pace. We had asumed the small size of Dons pack meant that he might be ill-equipped, yet he had everything he needed, and, adding to our chagrin, he was the only one in our group having the tools to fix a participants broken pack frame.
Click to expand...

If you read the book, which is really good, a LOT of the stuff he reccomends to bring is stuff also mentioned here, including a knife, paracord, compass, first aid. Most of it is very well thought out.

Worth reading before you knock people who are lightweight.
 
Zaner01 said:
I recently flipped through a book on backpacking that said that carrying anything more than a 2-1/2 inch folder is a sure sign of "a greenhorn."
Click to expand...
That sort of sentiment is due to a number of factors, I think.

  1. The elitist mindset of the ultralight backpacking fraternity, who think that their way (absolute minimum weight for everything) is the only/best way. They think ultralight is the natural evolution of any backpacker as they gain experience and don't recognize that there are other paths in the wilderness.
  2. The rejection of larger blades as being good for nothing but weapons of violence common among the more liberal elements of society.
  3. The areas many of these ultralight mavens do their backpacking in. Honestly, if you are hiking the AT during the summer season, you don't really need a knife for much. You are using a stove, carrying prepared food, will generally not be far from a road crossing, and probably pass a dozen or more people every day you can go for days or even weeks without touching your blade. Drop them into the high western mountains, the remote northwoods, or the subarctic tundra and see how quick they change their tune.
Now, I try to keep my pack light, too (as I get older, the back and knees are not happy with the 45-50 pound packs I carried when I first started backpacking!), but I would never step into the woods without at least a good, strong, medium sized (3.5+ inch) locking folder. For that matter, a medium sized (4-5 inch) fixed blade finds its way into my pack quite often, too.

Sure a tiny slip joint for opening envelopes of dehydrated food or cutting loose threads off my pants may be all I need 99% of the time, but I'm willing to carry a few more ounces for that 1% of the time a little-bitty knife just won't do the job. :cool:
 
Last edited:
Since nessmuk has come up enough in this thread.. it should be mentioned that while the Nessmul pattern knife has gained some novel popularity among woodsfolk, that he used this knife primarily for game and food prep.. bot wood craft, his wood craft knife was his moose pattern slipjoint, however he did always have an axe with him and was undoubtedly skilled enough with it to make this a possibilty.... if you are out crafting and all you have is a slipjoint or small folder you will be severely limited, however if coupled with an axe are large machete than maybe not.... in a one knife in the wilderness scenario than it all depends on usage... if you are an ultra light guy than you won;t be making traps or bowdrill sets or battoning fire wood... a got a buddy who hiked the whole at with only a vic classic....for me I like to get my hands dirty..but din't over knife myself either....I guess largely folks my friend who ultralight are largely not concerned with longterm wilderness survival or mastering bushcraft skill the truth is one can go into the woods there whole life and never "have" to practice these things...I don't practice these things on the off chance that I may one day need them I just love to do it...
 
Last edited:
hollowdweller said:
Worth reading before you knock people who are lightweight.
Click to expand...

In my experience there are two types of 'lightweight' people- those who, through experience and reason, can justify not bringing things; they are motivated by "what they need".

Then there are those who spend $100 on a titanium pot set in order to save 10 ounces on an overnight trip totaling 3 miles from the head; they are motivated by "what can I make lighter".

I'm happiest when I can accomplish both at the same time.
 
mdauben said:
That sort of sentiment is due to a number of factors, I think.

  1. The elitist mindset of the ultralight backpacking fraternity, who think that their way (absolute minimum weight for everything) is the only/best way. They think ultralight is the natural evolution of any backpacker as they gain experience and don't recognize that there are other paths in the wilderness.
  2. The rejection of larger blades as being good for nothing but weapons of violence common among the more liberal elements of society.
  3. The areas many of these ultralight mavens do their backpacking in. Honestly, if you are hiking the AT during the summer season, you don't really need a knife for much. You are using a stove, carrying prepared food, will generally not be far from a road crossing, and probably pass a dozen or more people every day you can go for days or even weeks without touching your blade. Drop them into the high western mountains, the remote northwoods, or the subarctic tundra and see how quick they change their tune.
Now, I try to keep my pack light, too (as I get older, the back and knees are not happy with the 45-50 pound packs I carried when I first started backpacking!), but I would never step into the woods without at least a good, strong, medium sized (3.5+ inch) locking folder. For that matter, a medium sized (4-5 inch) fixed blade finds its way into my pack quite often, too.

Sure a tiny slip joint for opening envelopes of dehydrated food or cutting loose threads off my pants may be all I need 99% of the time, but I'm willing to carry a few more ounces for that 1% of the time a little-bitty knife just won't do the job. :cool:
Click to expand...


As I said before, disdain.
 
My usual gear consists of a multi tool (usually a swisstool or a Leatherman Charge) and a fixed blade with a 4-5" blade (BRKT Aurora or NWA forum knife).I also for now carry an axe because we're still in deep snow this time of year and I hike well off the beaten path.
I'll be leaving on my annual 4 day hiking trip through the Fundy Footpath in may so I'm going to be traveling lighter.Clark hammock,Snugpak sleeping bag,ultralight stove but I'll still have my Multi and my fixed blade with me.Both have come in handy many times.
 
gravydan said:
Then there are those who spend $100 on a titanium pot set in order to save 10 ounces on an overnight trip totaling 3 miles from the head; they are motivated by "what can I make lighter".

I'm happiest when I can accomplish both at the same time.
Click to expand...


Buy aluminum then. Cheaper and lighter.:thumbup:
 
My "ultralight hiking gear" from the mid-80's (a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away!):

Randall Model 1 with 6" balde
2 gallons of water
poncho liner
GAU-5 (CAR-15)
330 rounds of 5.56mm ammunition

My "ultralight gear" in 2009:

Victorinox Farmer
Breeden 4" Pathfinder
Water
Firestarter/matches
Other "stuff" as needed

I guess either one of these would drive the "ultralight" crowd crazy!!!!!:eek:

Ron:D
 
Runsalone said:
As I said before, disdain.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure I understand something Runsalone. How is that statement laced with any more disdain, by what you said (below)?

Packsniffers: One whose judgement of others gear, whilst out in the woods, gives them a superiority complex. Characterized by constant critisizms of others gear, and satisfaction that they are more of a "woodsman" upon the discovery that some "ultralighter" dosnt carry______ or carries too much _____. This behavior is strangely much easier to find on internet forums than out in the ACTUAL woods.

The superiority complex can happen on both sides.

It's better to keep the criticism on knives and gear instead of people. All of us have plenty to learn, and we all have our own ways of doing things.
 
G-man said:
I'm not sure I understand something Runsalone. How is that statement laced with any more disdain, by what you said (below)?

Packsniffers: One whose judgement of others gear, whilst out in the woods, gives them a superiority complex. Characterized by constant critisizms of others gear, and satisfaction that they are more of a "woodsman" upon the discovery that some "ultralighter" dosnt carry______ or carries too much _____. This behavior is strangely much easier to find on internet forums than out in the ACTUAL woods.

The superiority complex can happen on both sides.

It's better to keep the criticism on knives and gear instead of people. All of us have plenty to learn, and we all have our own ways of doing things.
Click to expand...

That statement was meant to interject a little humor more than meant as any kind of acusation.;) Any scolding is intended for the behavior not the good folks who may or may not commit it.

I personaly dont care what anybody carries, in the context of how experienced they are, except I want to see what kind of cool gear everyone has. I think the man makes the tool adapt, not the other way around. If someones wants to know how to lighten thier load I may be the guy to ask. Similarily If I ever get to go somewhere where an ax is a requirement I know a place to ask what I need to know.:thumbup:

No superiority here.:o I just dont understand why if you like to carry a light pack your supposed to be some kind of liberal elitest snob:confused: I personally just enjoy my time hiking more without the heavy burden. I never have imposed on anyone that if you dont do it "this way" your an idiot but I see alot that attitude the other way around. I just dont get it.

Im not trying to make waves so much as share a little of my perspective..no harm intended.

Maybe theres some snobbery among the UL crowd that Im just not aware of. I tend to Run...............alone:p

Like Magnussen mentioned I fear Im helping stear this thread the wrong direction:foot:
 
Probably so...my input was in jest, for sure! I agree wholeheartedly with what Steve Dick wrote in his column. There are many who will denigrate others for choosinig a specific type of knife...I'm not one of them. If you feel you can get by with a SAK, so be it. And if you want to carry an 8" Bowie knife (as I do at times), that's alright as well!

Ron
 
HD, I just bought that book yesterday! Great stuff in there and I love the illustrations.
hollowdweller said:
From the book "Lighten Up"
Describing Don Ladigan:


If you read the book, which is really good, a LOT of the stuff he reccomends to bring is stuff also mentioned here, including a knife, paracord, compass, first aid. Most of it is very well thought out.

Worth reading before you knock people who are lightweight.
Click to expand...
 
Ron53 said:
Probably so...my input was in jest, for sure! I agree wholeheartedly with what Steve Dick wrote in his column. There are many who will denigrate others for choosinig a specific type of knife...I'm not one of them. If you feel you can get by with a SAK, so be it. And if you want to carry an 8" Bowie knife (as I do at times), that's alright as well!

Ron
Click to expand...

Hear hear! :):thumbup:
 
Last edited:
Ron53 said:
Probably so...my input was in jest, for sure! I agree wholeheartedly with what Steve Dick wrote in his column. There are many who will denigrate others for choosinig a specific type of knife...I'm not one of them. If you feel you can get by with a SAK, so be it. And if you want to carry an 8" Bowie knife (as I do at times), that's alright as well!

Ron
Click to expand...

Agreed!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top