To baton or not to baton

moosez45 said:
I do it. I've done it to a BK5 too. Several times. I agree you shouldn't bet trying to split 6" logs in half, when you can take off from the outside in. I beat my BKT knives like they stole my cookie in Kindergarten. Never thought once about the knife breaking. Never has.

I have broken knives batoning firewood, oh yessiree, I have. I have never been in a survival situation, and I hope I never am, but I been in some tough spots before, and my mind, coupled with the tools I had, were what made it a tough spot, and not a survival situation.

Good luck, and enjoy that BK5, she's tougher than she looks, promise.

Moose
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Hi Moose! I'm honored to have you chime in here! I think I remember reading your impressions of the BK5 in the passaround thread. She does look a little less than tough - I guess that's why Ethan called it a "sleeper".
 
sharpandsafe said:
Hi Moose! I'm honored to have you chime in here! I think I remember reading your impressions of the BK5 in the passaround thread. She does look a little less than tough - I guess that's why Ethan called it a "sleeper".
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Yeah, Ethan and Jerry got a good thing goin' in that knife.

I'm just a dumb, hillbilly, no honor needed, but is most appreciated. Keep us posted on how batoning it works out for you.

Moose
 
moosez45 said:
Yeah, Ethan and Jerry got a good thing goin' in that knife.
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It looks to me like a food prep/slicing knife that can also hack, chop and baton. It seems it was conceived as a rugged, outdoor kitchen knife, and I love that idea. I have an avid interest in both culinary arts/wildland foods and outdoor/survival skills. It seems like the kind of knife only Ethan would conceive, given his similar interests, and the perfect knife for me :)
 
I've not read all the other replies but to answer the question I feel your technique ( which I sometimes use ) will only work on smaller sized straight grained wood. If you are splitting a larger tough knotty piece then you have to beat the snot out of it with a batton...just ask my poor Chopweiler !
 
I will NEVER tire of this debate!

Batoning is a valid technique to get to dry wood in the event that you need to. Now, these guys that take an 8” log and beat their knife through the center of it to split the wood in halves and quarters, that’s not my cup of tea. Pretty much anything over 4” isn’t required and for the most part, wood around 2” is plenty. Baton a few pieces to expose the dry centers, get a good hot fire going and start adding larger wood.

It is a decent test of a knife’s strength, but I do not consider it a survival skill that needs to be practiced regularly. If my ass were on the line and I only had one knife I would be very choosey about what I pounded my knife through, but I would not skip batoning if it were what I needed to do to get a good fire going. Split wood catches faster and burns faster in the event I need a fire quickly.

If the wood lying around is dry, I’m not batoning anything. I’ll collect small, dry wood to get my fire going, then start throwing on logs.
 
Pitdog and adaman04, you guys are right on the money. The debate will continue, but I share your perspectives.
The idea that you can beat a knife through the center of a 8" log, as seen on YouTube videos, make guys think that's the "norm". That's the only problem I have with it.
 
foxx said:
Pitdog and adaman04, you guys are right on the money. The debate will continue, but I share your perspectives.
The idea that you can beat a knife through the center of a 8" log, as seen on YouTube videos, make guys think that's the "norm". That's the only problem I have with it.
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My favorites are when someone holds strong on the argument that you need an 8" knife in the woods because you can't baton with a 4" knife, only take slivers off the outside of the wood. Then they muscle through halving, quarter, eighthing and sixteenthing a log and end up with pieces about the size of the slivers I take off with my 4" blade with much less effort and stress on my blade.

Everyone has their own methods, I'm not saying mine is right, but it's just my preference.
 
I would probably never shop for a knife to use mainly for batoning, however I feel that if you purchase a good strong knife and use it in whatever manner that works to do the job at hand that you will get by just fine.
 
adaman04 said:
I will NEVER tire of this debate!

Batoning is a valid technique to get to dry wood in the event that you need to. Now, these guys that take an 8” log and beat their knife through the center of it to split the wood in halves and quarters, that’s not my cup of tea. Pretty much anything over 4” isn’t required and for the most part, wood around 2” is plenty. Baton a few pieces to expose the dry centers, get a good hot fire going and start adding larger wood.

It is a decent test of a knife’s strength, but I do not consider it a survival skill that needs to be practiced regularly. If my ass were on the line and I only had one knife I would be very choosey about what I pounded my knife through, but I would not skip batoning if it were what I needed to do to get a good fire going. Split wood catches faster and burns faster in the event I need a fire quickly.

If the wood lying around is dry, I’m not batoning anything. I’ll collect small, dry wood to get my fire going, then start throwing on logs.
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This is the most cogent, well reasoned, and concise argument on the subject I have yet read, and I agree completely!

udtjim said:
I would probably never shop for a knife to use mainly for batoning, however I feel that if you purchase a good strong knife and use it in whatever manner that works to do the job at hand that you will get by just fine.
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This is my concern exactly. Batoning is a tertiary concern for me, but I want to know that the knife I buy is capable of it if needed.

Another question I have is: are there other techniques for breaking up larger wood for kindling without batoning? In this scenario, imagine you are traveling light and don't have an axe, hatchet, or saw. Thanks!
 
kgd said:
Okay, you've probably unmasked my segway for this thread. I think you answered your question. In 5 years of batoning when ever the heck I thought about splitting a stick, I just did it. I never really cared if my knife broke, because I baton and baton and baton and my knife never breaks. Sure some people managed to break their knives, but I didn't. If you are worried about it then maybe you shouldn't do it and your way is as good as mine. I don't worry about it one whip. If my knife breaks, really not a big deal either. I'm not talking some silly SHTF fantasy that people have.

Really, most camping trips I almost have to consciously think up reasons to use my knife. Not having a knife isn't really a big deal. If my knife breaks, is it going to shatter into six thousand unusable pieces? No, there will be a tip, there will be a part of a blade. I can use some of that. Not having a knife means I think out a new strategy and go around for how to deal with my situation. That is what survival training and the survival thought process is about.

Think about ways to protect your gear is simply symbol worship. Should I wash my gortex jacket in hot water every week and continuously impregnate it with DWR reagents. If you really love that jacket, then yes you should do that. Do you need to in order to keep your belly button dry and mould free?
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kgd said:
Point of survival is to protect your own ass. People around here want to protect their tools and forget about their own asses. I don't get it.
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I agree 100% with Ken. 100%.
 
IMO if you arent utilizing batoning as a SKILL, and instead an "in case of emergancy" thing, you are under prepared, and under trained. Like all SKILLS, it takes technique to do correctly.
 
I like the people saying "why risk breaking the knife" - haha, like I ever go into the bush with only one knife!

I'll smack the hell out of the back of my Becker knives with a baton if I want to and I doubt they will break - I now have a BK-2, BK-7 & BK-9 which will all handle a bit of abuse and ask for more.
 
kgd said:
Point of survival is to protect your own ass. People around here want to protect their tools and forget about their own asses. I don't get it.
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What you're forgetting is that no one here is actually surviving; they're going out in the woods to play with adult toys such as knives, saws, guns, and other assorted gear.
The homeless dudes dumpster diving in the alleys are surviving...and we don't talk about it because survival can be gross.:cool:
 
I have been camping, hiking, chilling in the woods for the better part of two decades and have never ONCE needed to baton wood to make a fire. Sure, some may find an odd reason to actually need such a skill, but my "research" has shown it to be unnecessary. That said, if you want to chance breaking a knife, go for it. I can't afford to replace them, so it isn't a chance I will take.
 
stabman said:
What you're forgetting is that no one here is actually surviving; they're going out in the woods to play with adult toys such as knives, saws, guns, and other assorted gear.
The homeless dudes dumpster diving in the alleys are surviving...and we don't talk about it because survival can be gross.:cool:
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Agreed. You may think a little differently about your knife if it was all you had in a survival situation. This is a remote possibility, obviously, but still, if people want to worry about their knife, why not let them?

A rock or another piece of steel will make a better baton then a chunk of wood, but I am not going to use it just to "get the job done".
 
I had a cousin that twirled baton. She is... well... a she, though. I'm not sure why there are such long discussions about whether to baton or not among men on this forum :eek:
 
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