UPDATE Hinderer Full Track Lock Stick

TheFactor said:
As I mentioned earlier the pivot nut on mine had play also and you could actually feel it move sometimes when open and closing the knife and or when tightening or loosing the pivot screw.
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Yes, I just confirmed that there’s quite a bit of play in the pivot nut on the Full Track I received today. The machined hexagonal pocket is definitely larger than the nut. Doesn’t really affect the performance of the knife, but quite sloppy when compared with the fit of parts/hardware on a CRK or WE Knife.

I keep coming back to this being a $600 Knife!
 
augustus88 said:
Yes, I just confirmed that there’s quite a bit of play in the pivot nut on the Full Track I received today. The machined hexagonal pocket is definitely larger than the nut. Doesn’t really affect the performance of the knife, but quite sloppy when compared with the fit of parts/hardware on a CRK or WE Knife.

I keep coming back to this being a $600 Knife!
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It could take its toll and start rounding the corners off after time either way unacceptable. I’ve had many Hinderers over the years so I sincerely would not write them all off because of the Fulltrack. Although I sincerely understand your feelings with the Fulltrack .
I just got a replacement for it being a XM24 and like all my other Hinderers prior to the Fulltrack it is a beautiful knife in all areas including fit and finish .
 
Here’s a short video of the play/slop in the pivot nut. Not major and probably nothing that will ever be a problem, but not impressive.
 
Yup just like the one I had .
My ZT 0393 hinderer collaboration the nut is seated perfectly with no movement.
91l50AI.jpg
 
I hear you brother. $60 dollar Kershaw blur, after 2 years I still have to punch the pivot nut out to clean it. I'm not a Hinder h8ter at all, I'm the opposite. I'm just pointing out an observation I made looking at a bunch of posted pics. I have no Horse in this race. < See what I did there :D.
zmZimx8.jpg
 
If you all recall, when I first got my Full Track, I specifically said I wasn’t sure I felt like I got my $600 worth.
This was BEFORE the lock stick reared it’s head. It was things I saw like the machining and tolerances being questionable to poor in some areas. The M390 blade itself is a work of art in Stonewash. Just a beautiful grind and blade. But to be honest, I’ve got many different ZTs with superior fit and finish than the FullTrack I had.

Also, notice how tight the G10 lock side scale is against the lock bar. With some pressure, mine would actually touch/rub the lock bar. Too tight of tolerance there. I had the play in my pivot as well, and the poor machining in the area pictured above.

I truly believe the lock bar is too short. Another 1/8” longer and even a few thousandths thinner Ti in the lockbar hinge recess would go a LONG way to lessen the effort required to unlock the knife.

IMO, there needs to be a Gen1.1 FullTrack with some real design/machining tweaks made to fix these issues. It’s not a $250 ZT.
Yet for $250 or even $180, somehow ZT can produce some superior, stellar fit n finish.

The Gen6 XMs I have are awesome. I will say I have spinning pivot screws that now need to be blue-loctited on a brand new $425 knife - that’s not awesome.
 
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I wouldn't give up on "USA manufactured" just due to one manufacturer.

A lot of stainless steels like to gall to themselves or each others (and so does 6AL4V Titanium which is why I like lockbar inserts) so I wonder what the insert is made out of?

I thought M390 and 20CV were chemically identical so I find it odd there would be a difference between the blades having lock stick or not.
 
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KVT said:
Any word on the DLT M390 FT progress with Hinderer? Too soon?
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Nothing further about the M390 Full Track was mentioned when I requested a refund from DLT. They issued a RMA and prepaid return shipping label. I can’t complain about their customer service at all. I hope they get their Full Track issues sorted out. Loved the action and look of the knife, but I have a feeling that the lock problem is worse than reported/admitted with that run of knives. I’m guessing that galling of the lock bar insert is the problem based on my observations of two Full Tracks.

Unfortunately, I’m going to take my experience with Hinderer Knives as a sign that I should move on.
 
KVT said:
If you all recall, when I first got my Full Track, I specifically said I wasn’t sure I felt like I got my $600 worth.
This was BEFORE the lock stick reared it’s head. It was things I saw like the machining and tolerances being questionable to poor in some areas. The M390 blade itself is a work of art in Stonewash. Just a beautiful grind and blade. But to be honest, I’ve got many different ZTs with superior fit and finish than the FullTrack I had.

Also, notice how tight the G10 lock side scale is against the lock bar. With some pressure, mine would actually touch/rub the lock bar. Too tight of tolerance there. I had the play in my pivot as well, and the poor machining in the area pictured above.

I truly believe the lock bar is too short. Another 1/8” longer and even a few thousandths thinner Ti in the lockbar hinge recess would go a LONG way to lessen the effort required to unlock the knife.

IMO, there needs to be a Gen1.1 FullTrack with some real design/machining tweaks made to fix these issues. It’s not a $250 ZT.
Yet for $250 or even $180, somehow ZT can produce some superior, stellar fit n finish.

The Gen6 XMs I have are awesome. I will say I have spinning pivot screws that now need to be blue-loctited on a brand new $425 knife - that’s not awesome.
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Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

Just want to add that certain ZTs like 0562 aand 0801 also have reported issues of spinning pivots or the pivot becomes loose over time.
 
falar said:
I wouldn't give up on "USA manufactured" just due to one manufacturer.

A lot of stainless steels like to gall to themselves or each other (and so does 6AL4V Titanium which is why I like lockbar inserts) so I wonder what the insert is made out of?

I thought M390 and 20CV were chemically identical so I find it odd there would be a difference between the blades having lock stick or not.
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I’m not giving up on USA made knives. Lots of people slam Benchmade for QC issues, but I haven’t had any issues with my Crooked River or 940-1. I’ve also had good luck with Spyderco, and ZT. Never an issue with any of those.

I’m just really disappointed with higher end expensive production knives from two extremely respected USA manufacturers. All four of my knife purchases from CRK and Hinderer have had serious problems right out of the box. My only expensive USA made knife that was perfect was the Olamic 247.
 
augustus88 said:
I’m not giving up on USA made knives. Lots of people slam Benchmade for QC issues, but I haven’t had any issues with my Crooked River or 940-1. I’ve also had good luck with Spyderco, and ZT. Never an issue with any of those.

I’m just really disappointed with higher end expensive production knives from two extremely respected USA manufacturers. All four of my knife purchases from CRK and Hinderer have had serious problems right out of the box. My only expensive USA made knife that was perfect was the Olamic 247.
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Don't take this wrong but I think you live in a weird opposite universe. The fact your Benchmades have been perfect but you have had 4 bad knives from Hinderer and Chris Reeve Knives is absolutely nuts to me. We are a dealer for all 3 and the issues out of Hinderer and CRK are incredibly minimal where is Benchmade is on another level. Actually thinking about it, it might make sense. When we get Benchmades in we check the ever loving snot out of them for issues and send back any problems we find. While we check out the Hinderers and CRKs, we don't go as nuts because there are very rarely problems. Not to say that there are none, but way way less than Benchmade. This is no knock on Benchmade, they produce an absolute ton of knives everyday. With the volume they do there are bound to be more QC issues. Regardless I hope you bat again sometime in the future.
 
Update.... I shipped my Full Track to the Ranch and they repaired it the same day they received it and returned it to me. They send an email when it was received and said that these Full Tracks are getting priority attention. They replaced the Lockbar insert , Reset the Detent ball and Reset the Lock bar.

My initial impression is that mine is good to go and Hinderer knocked it out of the park for customer service.
 
So what's to say these won't end up just as they were after 30-100 flips?
Did they redesign the insert? Was the insert defective and now it's not? Did the M390 versions somehow get a bad insert?
What does "resetting the lock-bar" mean, exactly?

Is the knife any easier to unlock as far a thumb force required? (taking any previous lock-stick out of the equation)
 
KVT said:
So what's to say these won't end up just as they were after 30-100 flips?
Did they redesign the insert? Was the insert defective and now it's not? Did the M390 versions somehow get a bad insert?
What does "resetting the lock-bar" mean, exactly?

Is the knife any easier to unlock as far a thumb force required? (taking any previous lock-stick out of the equation)
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Honestly why do you care? You sent yours back and got a refund... Mine works fine and if it takes a dump I'll let you know.

Do me a favor.... Call Hinderer and ask rather than spew BS....
 
Tzoid said:
Honestly why do you care? You sent yours back and got a refund... Mine works fine and if it takes a dump I'll let you know.

Do me a favor.... Call Hinderer and ask rather than spew BS....
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Huh? WTF is your problem?

I care because I want a working FullTrack. I want to know exactly what was done to change the likelihood of the problem returning. As soon as DLT posts the Full Tracks, I’m buying another one. That’s why I care.

Legitimate questions. You’re not the only one that got a bad one.
 
You are asking questions that only RHK can answer in a tone that you are demanding answers... Call DLT the place you bought
your knife or call RHK and get the answers.

I paid shipping and sent mine in and shared my experience followed by your negative "What If Rant "
 
I’m just guessing here, but I have a feeling that the lock bar inserts on the M390 Full Tracks are too soft and end up galling. Anyone know if lock bar inserts are usually hardened then tempered back to softer than the blade? Maybe the hardening and tempering process was botched.

Tzoid, please keep up posted on how your Full Track holds up after a trip back to the ranch. Maybe I’ll give it one more a try after it’s been out for a year and the kinks are worked out. I really love the design, but I’m still too frustrated to go for round three right now.
 
Tzoid said:
You are asking questions that only RHK can answer in a tone that you are demanding answers... Call DLT the place you bought
your knife or call RHK and get the answers.

I paid shipping and sent mine in and shared my experience followed by your negative "What If Rant "
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You need to work on your reading / interpretation skills.
In no way was my post a rant. Holy cow man. Use some sense.
They were logical, technical questions. Did I use any exclamation marks? Double question marks? Slandering? Anger? Nope, just simple questions you obviously didn’t ask and don’t have answers to.
A simple “don’t know, didn’t ask” would have sufficed instead of the “do me a favor” and “spew bs” comments.
 
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