WARNING: To NYC Residents & Tourists

Interesting,,,I thought that there was New York case law that said a knife like a Benchmade or Balisong was NOT a gravity knife and that is why they have the specific 4'" lockblade rule in NYC I carried my Caffrey EDK comcealed while I was up there this past weekend. It is a very small fixed blade.
 
I took the family to NYC last month. I carried my Spderco Delica clipped to my pocket. Could that be construed to be a "gravity knife"?

If so, then any folder with thumbstuds/opening hole could be deemed a gravity knife in NY.

Interesting note: we took the ferry to see the Statue of Liberty. The ferry port has security like an airport: metal dectors, x-ray, etc. I walked up to a security guard and told him that I had a pocket knife. He told me that I could leave it outside or give it to him for destruction.

I had no where to put it outside, so I just gave it to him. Good thing I had another Delica back at the hotel :)
 
Good Lord! Thanks for the heads up, I'll keep it in mind next time I'm in the city. I wonder if this has anything to do with the recent Wall St. Journal article. Is this the way of the future for the rest of the country?

im wondering if you have the name of the article by any chance id be interested in reading what they have to say on knives
 
CHP5, If it can be flicked open it is a gravity knife. You can NOT carry a knife exposed, which means if the right officer saw the pocket clip on your pants pocket you may have spent a few more days in NYC than you planned.....
 
CHP5, If it can be flicked open it is a gravity knife. You can NOT carry a knife exposed, which means if the right officer saw the pocket clip on your pants pocket you may have spent a few more days in NYC than you planned.....

Thanks for the response Tom. I guess the question is what does "flicked open" mean? My Benchmade Axis knives and my Spydercos with linerlocks can be flicked open.

To open the Delicas, you have to push it completely open with your thumb through the entire range of motion. So is a Delica a "gravity knife" in NY?

I travel to NYC about once a quarter, so thanks for your help!
 
The problem is not so much as how they are designed to work, but can the knife be flicked open by any of the following ways: holding the handle and "flicking" the knife either downward or accross your body to make the knife open completely in one fast motion, and (believe it or not) if you hold the blade and flick open the handle so as to open the knife in manner that will leave you holding the blade of the knife ( this is a NYC manner only- the rest of NYS is a little more sane). I have a few, VERY FEW. knives that can not be opened this way. They have all had the blades tighten to the point where they take a bit to open but can not be flicked. A knife that does not lock open is also legal.....I know it sucks, and chances are you will not be questioned, but DO NOT carry any knife exposed in NYC as that violates the NYC Admin Code, and allows the officer to legally check the knife to see if it is a gravity knife....
 
And I thought the PRK was bad. This is some of the stupidest crap I have ever heard. I am glad I moved out of NY. Bloomberg is an idiot.

I was is NYC and Brooklyn over the holidays and had to keep remembering to not clip my minigrip to my pocket; next time I will remove the clip to be sure.

NYC is turning into a police state. Even that Transfat law is a joke.
 
The problem is not so much as how they are designed to work, but can the knife be flicked open by any of the following ways: holding the handle and "flicking" the knife either downward or accross your body to make the knife open completely in one fast motion, and (believe it or not) if you hold the blade and flick open the handle so as to open the knife in manner that will leave you holding the blade of the knife ( this is a NYC manner only- the rest of NYS is a little more sane). I have a few, VERY FEW. knives that can not be opened this way. They have all had the blades tighten to the point where they take a bit to open but can not be flicked. A knife that does not lock open is also legal.....I know it sucks, and chances are you will not be questioned, but DO NOT carry any knife exposed in NYC as that violates the NYC Admin Code, and allows the officer to legally check the knife to see if it is a gravity knife....


Thanks for the head up Tom. That's really incredible!
 
Are you serious? I don't think you know what you are talking about. Were people getting murdered with knives that could be opened with one hand before stricter enforcement of the state's "gravity knife" law began?

New York City does not have the lowest crime rate of any american city. It may have a lower than average crime rate amongst large cities but that has more to do with the very high average income level of people who live and work there compared to the rest of the country. Moreover, most areas of US experienced a reduction in crime within the last decade.

Stricter knife or gun laws have never been proven to have any crime reducing affect. "Normal Citizens" don't need you to tell them to "keep their collection at home". You can remain grateful for "these crazy laws." I choose to remain outraged.
I meant the large cities. If you look at american cities with over a million people new york is a the safest.

If you don't believe me, here is a list of every crime commited in the united states. http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/offenses_reported/offense_tabulations/table_08.html

I don't know why new york has less crime, and I don't know if weapon control laws reduce crime or increase it. But don't you think it may be more than a coincidence that new york has strict laws and less crime? Is that possibility not even worth considering? Everyone on this forum is so outraged by the idea of not being allowed to walk into a bar armed to the teeth with daggers that they never bring up the possibility that the these laws might actually protect people.

Please don't act all indignant. I'm not telling you what to do with your knives. I don't really care. My point is that the police aren't going to knock down your door and steal your stuff like they did to this shop owner. You're all acting like it's a personal attack and the cops are breathing down your neck. As long as you don't attract attention to yourself the police do not care.
NYC is turning into a police state. Even that Transfat law is a joke.
Why? What is wrong with that law? If no one had told you trans fat was gone you would never have noticed. Trans fat tastes the same as normal fat, the only difference is it's cheaper and it clogs your heart faster! How can you be against a law that prevents heart attacks?
 
So essentially, any type of locking folders with thumbstuds/opening hole is prohibited as a gravity knife.

So what about a fixed blade under 3"?
 
fixed blades should be good, but there is one member here that works for the legal department of a local college that has stated there was one case where a small fixed blade was considered a dirk. That to me would be a rare case that I would not worry about. the gravity knife issue is taught in the Police academy to recriuts so that is a far more enforced policy.
 
Hi linzoy-
"...I want to go to college in NYC and I'm not looking forward to walking around defenseless, but I feel pretty safe because right now new york has the lowest crime rate of any american city. It's not right for someone who's been selling pocket knives their whole life to be convicted of a felony but maybe we normal citizens should be grateful for these crazy laws. As long as you keep your collection at home nothing is going to happen..."
Not a flame, but by any chance do you live outside the United States of America and wish to visit here for schooling?

~ Blue Jays ~
 
I'm as indignant as the rest of you and I think one of the first things we can do is to start supporting the organizations that support us as knife collectors and users.

For starters, us registered users could step up our membership at Blade Forums. As a relative newbie, I haven't done that yet, but I intend to...I just get so much entertainment value here ;)

As mentioned above, there is the United States Knife and Tool Association, which is re-organizing as Knife Rights. They are not taking memberships yet but they are taking names for potential members...we can sign up for that. (USKTA, see link above) AKTI is an industry association of knife manufacturers.

Then there's Knife World and Blade magazines, which we could subscribe to. They're the free press, like Blade Forums.

About ten years ago, there was legislation before the NYS Assembly that would have made any lockback knife illegal. Not just switchblades, gravity knives, balisongs or flippers, but any lockback...your Buck 110.

A friend of mine who got me into knife collecting heard about it through Knife World. He told me about it, we wrote letters to our local assemblyman, as I'm sure a lot of other people around the state did. The law was never passed. Legislators are still more impressed by a personally written and signed letter from a constituent than they are by an email, or a list of 1000 names submitted by email.

Right now there are dozens of laws before the NYS legislature relating to gun control such as: Prohibiting a parent from taking their child under the age of 16 to a gun show, as that would be interfering with a minor. So a generation of kids will never be able to learn, see and dream about their first .22, shotgun, or deer rifle, as we did.

Currently there is a law before Congress, I believe it's sponsored by Nancy Pelosi, that would require a waiting period of several days for any guns (rifles, shotguns) sold at a gun show...instead of an instant background check with BATF. We know that gun shows, like knife shows, are usually weekend affairs at a civic center or hotel with dealers from out of town. So how could an out of town dealer hope to make any sale at a show? And if he can't sell, why bother to attend? While most sheeple probably think a waiting period is reasonable, this law will effectively shut down gun shows across the country without actually banning them.

These are the insidious ways some politicians think up to control us.
 
fixed blades should be good, but there is one member here that works for the legal department of a local college that has stated there was one case where a small fixed blade was considered a dirk. That to me would be a rare case that I would not worry about. the gravity knife issue is taught in the Police academy to recriuts so that is a far more enforced policy.

Thanks Tom. It's counterintuitive to me that a concealed fixed blade is OK, but not a Spyerco Delica!
 
I totally agree with you ! You must remember that the whole concept of "gravity knife" was to put in the law to prohibit a specfic type of knife, a paratrooper style knife where the blade drops out of the handle when "released" from the handle or sheath. The law makers at the time, did their best to articulate how that type of knife works, and even used the term "release" rather than open( the term used for a switchblade) to express the difference in how these knives opened. In the late 1960s, police started to interpert the law to include any knife that could be flicked open. The wording could allow this interpatation, but it was not the intent of the law. The courts have allowed this to stand for many years now, and that would greatly hinder any judge from looking at the law correctly now simply because it would open the flood gates for appeal on cases that have occurred in the past.....I would like to see a clarification written into the law, but I fear we could loose more than we would gain as Knife collectors.....such as assited openers being banned, or losing the right to possess switchblades and gravity knives for use while hunting, and fishing. Since no longer being a LEO and understanding the legal system, I always carry a small fish hook attached to ten feet of monofilament fishing line in my wallet right next to my NYS Sportsman license. That equipment is leaglly considered "fishing tackle" if you where to possess such at a lake without a valid fishing license. A loop hole perhaps, but one that is legally sound to defend a possession charge of a gravity knife in the NYS Penal law. The NYC code states "going directly to the activity" but that only relates to a blade over 4". I am not saying this is fool proof as a defense, btu it is within the guidelines of the law......
 
I would like to see a clarification written into the law, but I fear we could loose more than we would gain as Knife collectors.....such as assited openers being banned. . .

Are assisted opening knives not already prohibited as a "gravity knife" or "swithblade"?
 
Assisted openers are not prohibited per se. You push a flipper or thumbstud on the blade not the handle and you must over come resistance so they are not fully automatic. They are sold openly on many NY stores. The problem is most if not all can be open by flicking them, so reguardless of design, if it can be flicked open also beware. I added to the post above while you where writing....
 
I meant the large cities. If you look at american cities with over a million people new york is a the safest.

If you don't believe me, here is a list of every crime commited in the united states. http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/offenses_reported/offense_tabulations/table_08.html

I don't know why new york has less crime, and I don't know if weapon control laws reduce crime or increase it. But don't you think it may be more than a coincidence that new york has strict laws and less crime? Is that possibility not even worth considering? Everyone on this forum is so outraged by the idea of not being allowed to walk into a bar armed to the teeth with daggers that they never bring up the possibility that the these laws might actually protect people.

Please don't act all indignant. I'm not telling you what to do with your knives. I don't really care. My point is that the police aren't going to knock down your door and steal your stuff like they did to this shop owner. You're all acting like it's a personal attack and the cops are breathing down your neck. As long as you don't attract attention to yourself the police do not care.
Why? What is wrong with that law? If no one had told you trans fat was gone you would never have noticed. Trans fat tastes the same as normal fat, the only difference is it's cheaper and it clogs your heart faster! How can you be against a law that prevents heart attacks?
How can someone be against a law against "heart attacks"? Because maybe some people don't want Hizzoner Monsieur Bloomberg being their surrogate mommy......that a good enough reason? As for crime, New York has not been the murder capital of the U.S. for decades. However, it remains the petty crime, nuisance and "get-over" capital of the known world.
:D As for crime rates, why don't you compare NYC to EVERY city in America and ALL crimes. You can work the numbers any way you want. By the way, I had a GREAT time this past week in New York and will be going back soon....and i SMOKED in a Marriot hotel room and they didn't even bother to hit me up for the $250 "room cleaning" fee...MUAH, HA, HA, HA. However, Bloomberg is gone after this term and hopefully, his draconian smoking policy will be gone with him because it was criminal that i couldn't have a cigar after dinner at "21". The pricey streets of Midtown Mahattan are littered with my cigarette butts:cool: How bout this.......let the people of NYC carry any knife they want as long as they agree to let the NYPD shoot them 50 times for no reason.....wait....that happens anyway,even if you don't have a knife....nevermind...lol
 
How can someone be against a law against "heart attacks"? Because maybe some people don't want Hizzoner Monsieur Bloomberg being their surrogate mommy......that a good enough reason?
No. Ever since I stopped breast feeding, trans fats have been clogging my arterys, and I didn't even know they existed until they put them on the nutrition label. Trans fat brings no joy into anybody's life except the CEOs of margarine companys.
 
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