Was this a FAIR-TRADE

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It's never been about the money. If you knew me, you would know that. And MIKEMCK since you ran ya mouth, I will E-mail you my address and you can ship me a TNT and stop my whinning. In return I will ship you a Gerber multi-tool and call it a FAIR-TRADE. As it's not a money issue, you should have no problem with this trade.
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Frankly, I don't care what it's about for you. What I do care about is you whining about it in several threads that have absolutely nothing at all to do with this trade. Once I stopped reading this thread, I thought I was done reading about this, but no, you have whined it about it in numerous threads, in other forums...Numerous people have problems with other people here, but what they do not do is whine about it, continually, in this or in other forums.
I myself have had problems with others here, and other than a quick post to warn others, that's it! No continuous posts for attention, no crying poormouth, zero, zilch, nada. It's done, I don't need the validation from others here to tell me I got screwed, and I realize that the other people that come here don't care to read about me whining in several posts.

I also think it's crap that you insist that you could not put a value on 2 knives, when you obviously had an idea of what you expected to get for them. What's more, people that sell and trade here are expected to put a value on what they have, without exception.
If you were some new guy here, you would have no support or sympathy at all for what you did and how you have handled it. What's ironic is that you most certainly should know better, with over 1400 posts, whereas someone that is new here most probably would not.

So, the only problem I have with this trade is your whining about it in numerous threads, and in other forums, that have nothing to do with this trade.
 
We are on another page here, so for those that only read half the story, my complete and final response to this is on page 3...
 
And again, since this is a public issue, and someone is obviously lying about the contents of emails there were sent and recieved, I would call for the emails to be posted here.

Someone is lying, as there are two very different versions of what was said and replied to, and it's important to know who it is.

What is the point of either party continuing to post in this thread, alluding to what was said or replied to, when the emails should be available for posting, and all doubt can therefore be removed.
 
and I have traded the GERBER 400 to another formite. Sunshine, you know what you sent me, a Gerber 400. Retail thru Gerber is $40.00.
Man, if you cannot show some proof [like a broken tip], and do not even know the difference between the Gerber 400 and the 600 don't think this might have been better handled by E-mail?

Now, you go and post all those "Threats" I made. Hurry up now. BTW, this is what ya sent me: I want this to end, so answer my mail
 
Subj: Now I am a TROLL
Date: 1/24/2002 4:41:29 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Jared:
You took the time to post, now take a moment and tell me why you felt the need to deal in such an underhanded manner? And to lie and say that the tip of one knife was broken, come on Jared, that's so immature. Why don't you answer this and make things right. you know those two Spydercos were worth more than a $30.00 tool. If you wanted them that badly, I would have given them to you.
I suggest you answer me because I will dog you until you do. You owe me approx. $35.00, and I intend to collect it. A deal is a deal Jared, but you forgot the key word....FAIR. now lets resolve this

Ira

>>Subj: This really needs an ending
Date: 1/22/2002 3:46:00 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Jared:
Why do you ignore me. The knife/tool issue is dead. Just step up to the plate and answer me one question: WHY?

Ira
Subj: How about a response Jared????
Date: 1/21/2002 9:16:13 AM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Come on....lets do it and resolve this........Ira
Subj: So where is the mail
Date: 1/21/2002 5:29:49 AM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Lets go jared....You sent me mail? let's resolve this between you and I. We both know this was not a fair Trade. So either we work this out like men, you send me back the knives, I will send you back this Gerber., or let us rtesolve this and find a happy medium.
No one is going to win a BF war, not you and not me. I wanted a fair-trade and you have dealt in and with knives a long time. These were users, we both knew it. But $35.00 for the pair is not fair. Make it right and lets >cyber-shake< and move forward.
So Please answer this one,
Ira
>>
>>Subj: R U going to respond
Date: 1/20/2002 7:40:10 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Come on Jared. this was supposed to be a FAIR TRADE Do you honestly believe a 35 dollar multi tool, without the sheath is all those two spydercos are worth? Would you be satisfied? Either send me one back, or send them both back and you can have your gerber back. the more I think about this and read the post:
"Trade for a multi-tool in the FAIR-RANGE" I get upset. you know this is a POS Multi-tool. it is the cheapest in the gerber line. What happened to the leatherman tools you E-mailed me about.
Conme on jared. do not ignore this. Explain to me how you figured each knife was only work abour 18 bucks. and do not even think of shipping charhes. I had to pay them too. What are you going to do? this must be addressed ASAP!!!
Ira
 
>>Subj: what do you think
Date: 1/20/2002 1:16:05 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@msn.com



Dear Jared:
Do you think you have been fair? Read GB&U
Ira

>>Subj: Re: Unfair? Flamewar?
Date: 1/20/2002 4:29:19 AM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: Jaredmoon@msn.com



Dear Jared:
Just an explanation as to why you figured each Spyderco was only worth 20 bucks. Thats all.................................
IraSubj: got Gerber
Date: 1/19/2002 3:34:03 PM Eastern Standard Time
From: Wolfmann601
To: jaredmoon@Msn.com



Dear Jared:
I did get the Gerber. I am just a little disappointed that you felt those two Spydercos were worth a $40.00 tool without a sheath. I had expected at least $25.00 each.
Well, a deal is a deal, but what about FAIR. Come on, make this right!!!!!........Thanks
Ira

>>
 
Another member of BF is now the owner of that Gerber if you need him to remind you of the Model. Like I posted, go to WWW.cheaperthandirt.Com and they sell for $30.00 there. You are in the "Business" so your price was even lower. I can buy the 400 for $25.00 all day long. Two Spydercos???? "Fair-Trade"????

So, how about making this right????

And if you do not want it public, just answer anyone of the FIFTY e-Mails I sent you. Or should I post every one of them?

And photos of the Spydercos??? Got lots of them also. None with a broken tip. Are they need here also? Answer this on E-mail.

To the others on BF. This is the only way I can communicate with BF MEMBER Sunshine. He will not deal with this issue via E-mail, so it's got to be done in public. This is the UGLY in GB&U.

But as a member of BF, I will not allow another formite to screw me. PERIOD.........Ira:mad: :mad:
 
...work a trade with, or sell to, either of you!

This thread, and all others associated with it, were completely out of line!

This should have never been brought up in the context that it was. A simple single GB&U post should have been made by Wolfmann, only after a single email request was made to have the knives returned, contingent on a non-response to said email.

The rest of this crap is a complete and total waste of bandwidth. You two should both be ashamed of your behavior.

And never, ever, post personal emails in a public forum. That is so freaking immature.

I'm ashamed of you both. Your childish temper tantrums reflect poorly on us all.

'nuf said. :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by Melvin-Purvis
...work a trade with, or sell to, either of you!

This thread, and all others associated with it, were completely out of line!

This should have never been brought up in the context that it was. A simple single GB&U post should have been made by Wolfmann, only after a single email request was made to have the knives returned, contingent on a non-response to said email.

The rest of this crap is a complete and total waste of bandwidth. You two should both be ashamed of your behavior.

And never, ever, post personal emails in a public forum. That is so freaking immature.

I'm ashamed of you both. Your childish temper tantrums reflect poorly on us all.

'nuf said. :rolleyes:
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:eek: :eek: Mel - this was your 666th post! :eek: :eek:

I've got too much time on my hands :D :rolleyes: :D

Matthew
 
Rare is the occassion that the number 666 provides levity in comparison to the rest of the content :D

That is all.
 
for your compassion and kindness:rolleyes: :rolleyes: Getting the shaft from another member of BF is something NEW for me. Matter of fact, in 24 years of Gun-trading, I never had a trade or a sale that could not be resolved via E-mail, and in the one year or so of trading/buying on bf, (never did sell too many:eek: ) every transaction went smooth.
There were alot of false promises made in this trade for my two Spydercos. As of this moment, the consenus value is $35.00 each. Now, I finally have an idea of the value. I made every attempt possible to ascertain this BEFORE posting these for trade after finding them in my kitchen "junk-drawer ( Most Kitchens have on of these drawers!)
Jared and I had no problems communicating in the beginning, hell we were "Buddies". I was also trying to move a NIB MOD Hornet auto that causght Jared's eye and wanted to work this knife into some part of this trade, so the Hornet was pulled from the "for sale Board". AS I had not one clue to the current Vakue Sheldon, I made the mistake of TRUSTING another member of BF..............My bad. Since Jared appeared honest and sincere in his posts, made me believe he has some sort of "knife business on E-bay" and seemed genuine, I simply let me guard down and shipped them to Jared, asking for only a FAIR-TRADE in return.
Jared E-mailed me a couple of times. The first E-mail was to acknowledge receipt of the two used knives, and top comment what "nice condition" they are in for being 1986-ish. Next he e-mailed me to ask if one had a screw "missing" after he ran them both through his Mommy's dishwasher. being the hot-shot cop, I gave him some training in "crime scene searching" and low and behold the screw was recovered. Again, some nice words were offered and jared posted in GB&U what a nice guy I am and what a smooth trade this has been.
Then an E-mail apology about some delay on his part shipping back the Multi-tool. He and I were using my other E-mail address at the time: wolfmann@aol.com. ( I have yet to post these). No problem I replied, afterall he is a member of BF. Jared added he was going to look through his collection of multi-tools and pick out a "nice leatherman". (how would I know he has more than one Multi-tool and Leathermen?).
Finally, the E-mail that the Multi-tool is on it's way to NH. Hope I enjoy it. Picture my surprise when all I found was a GERBER 400 in that nasty Bubble-wrap with just the little instruction pamphlet. No sheath, no box, just a Gerber 400...Period. I banged out my first E-mail (see above). I get back an E-mail that says simply: "I do not understand". I explain that a POS Gerber in no way represents a fair trade and to work this out to PREVENT a Flame-war on BF as nobody will come out a winner ( see E-mail above).
Now there are no answers to my E-mails and I am e-mailing often. I post a generic "what if" on GB&U without the mention of any names. I did try to prevent this. Jared decides to post and identify himself and throw out some serious false statements. Then he goes on to state one knife tip is broken. I E-mail him to inform him I have numerous "pre-ship" photos of both knives and when My wife packaged them, both had tips as the photos clearly depict. I add that I did ship them insured so send me a photo, or the knife so I can file a claim with the USPS. No response. nothing. Then it ends up with him calling me a troll here and on other forums. matter of fact Sheldon, he followed ME around to inser something derogatory about my character several times. I am not normally thin-skinned but this guy now has made this whole issue appear as an intentional scam.
Now Sheldon, if I am willing to shake down a scammer all the way to Ireland for a few members of BF, why would anyone expect me to just post ONCE how I got burned by another member of BF, just "roll-over" and let time pass so that this is forgotten? If Jared would act in an adult and responsible fashion, he would have answered my E-mail, explained how the tip got broken, offer a photo, and allow me to file that claim. better yet, he he just used the private E-mail, this NEVER would have appeared here to begin with.
That's the biggest problem I have found with BF Sheldon. people engage in a "Deal" (Funny word Deal, huh?)here on BF, and if one gets the very short end of the stick intentionally, and the other BF member fails to do what's right a post or 100 appear here on GB&U. then three weeks later all is forgotten and the person screwed rmains screwed, the "screwer" remains "Uunjustly enriched" but can continue to conduct business as usual. I would then just be ANOTHER BF "Victim".
No sir Sheldon, not me. I refuse to be a victim and just go quietly away and allow Sunshine to own those two Spydercos for a Gerber 400. if not for Essav Benjamin and his kindness and compassion, I would be stuck with a Gerber 400. But Ed now owns this tool after trading me for a Leatherman "Wave". And to the others who have kindly offered to make this right, Thank you. But jared needs to make this right. A simple "I screwed up" would be OK with me. But if he is not going to respond to my E-mails except to continually upload attachments that contain folders LOADED with the exact same photo that I posted on this Board depicting the Spyderco Hunter and the Worker. This done simply to push my buttons. but not once even being kind enough to say "why".
So Sheldon, you are embarassed and ashamed of "both of us?" What did I do other than to place TRUST in another member of BF. If you and I engaged in a trade and you sent me a knice knife for one of those coveted A/F's that you love so dearly and I treated you to this, would you simply post once and move forwrd?. maybe you should cahge you sig line to : get screwed but cry only once and then shut up. For me, being a "victim" is something I promised myself never to allow TWICE. And the fact remains that I got screwed on this deal, and by jared's actions and the way he has responded to this;INTENTIONALLY. Until Spark tells me to quit, I intend to dog jared all the way to IRELAND/b] if he shopuld decide to move in with Simon until Jared makes this trade FAIR.
Afterall Sheldon, this board is called the Good, bad & UGLY, and when another formite finds it necessary to burn another over a $70.00 trade and then refuses to step up to the palate, it was destined to become UGLY and this is the appropriate board.
BTW, don't trade with me. At last count there were a few others in this great world of other's that happily take my money or happily trade with me, and treat me FAIRLY and HONESTLY.
Ira
 
Originally posted by wolfmann601
I suggest you answer me because I will dog you until you do. You owe me approx. $35.00, and I intend to collect it. A deal is a deal Jared, but you forgot the key word....FAIR. now lets resolve this
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Excuse me, but maybe someone can tell me why you even bothered to post this LAME complaint. YOU told him to send what HE thought was fair in return for your knives. He did that. End of story. STFU already. He doesn't owe you squat! You even admitted that YOU were the one at fault by not specifying what you expected in return. Did you get screwed? Perhaps, but by nobody but yourself. :rolleyes:

You should have chalked this one up to YOUR own stupidity, learned from YOUR mistakes, and never said a public word about it. :barf:
 
As you can see, I do not post very often. Let's say, I am selective. I feel I have to come to the assistance of Ira in this case. I am no judge or jury, but Sunshine's refusial to communicate with Ira is meaningful in my opinion. A simple swap would have finished a trade gone sour. But Sunshine's non-communication stimied that idea. I never heard of puting knives of this sort in the dish washer, that also seems strange to me.

I have been aware of Ira's dealings with helping other Blade Forum people in getting things right. I have particularly been watching the Ireland situation he has facilitated. I have a little trouble understanding Sunshine's difficulty in communicating with Ira, which would have totally headed off this thread.

Sunshine, I don't know who the heck you are. I have had no dealings with you. But your total defiance to answering Ira's emails is unacceptable in my book. Melvin, and someone other(sorry, don't remember your name) this is America and you are entitled to your opinions, but that doesn't make you right.

Ira, I think this whole sorted catastrophe has been a lesson for many of us on BF. Sunshine, by my definition, has shown himself to be less than I would like to deal with, and I think many others would agree. His name will not be forgotten. His busines will suffer. If he has not communicated with you over all this time to come to a meeting of the minds by this time he never will. I, personally, would not deal with a person of this sort.

I am not you, Ira, but at this time, I would write this person off. He admitted to you that he put your knives in the diswasher. Then he told you that a tip was broken off one of the two knives. Dishwashers do not do that. And I think it is unusual to put these knives in the dishwasher in the first place. Huh?? For what purpose?
I am pretty savvy with knives and I would not do that.

Ira,I am in your court. I agree with you. And I understand where your "justice" feeling comes from. But, I have to point out to you, that this guy is a loser no matter how many deals he had go good, when he has been nothing but noncommunicative in your case. It would have been easy to negotiate this transaction, but for his obstanance.

Broomhilda
 
Ira-I have expressed to you before the level of respect I have for you and your service to society.That has not changed,however, I must say that I think alot of what has transpired in this thread has reflected negatively on you.I believe it is extremely unfair to put the burden of determining value on the other guy.That ,to me, seems common sense.If you were selling a house,or car would you say"just give me what you think it's worth."?What kind of deal do you think you would get?I have only done a couple of trades.One did not go so well.The guy changed a description at the last minute.I went ahead with the deal and wasn't too happy with what I got in trade.I had to blame myself.I could have said no to the trade up to the email where I said O.K.-but I didn't and had to live with the results.I don't care how many e-mails you post or how many times you retell the details of the trade-When you put the burden on the other guy to decide the value of the trade,you gave up the right to complain about what you got.IMO.I still like and respect you,but I don't dislike Sunshine or fear trading with him because of this thread.
troy
 
I was told to stop long ago. I was offered more free sh*t than you can imagine. Was it to just shut me up, make this right, or pay me back for helping alot of formites DOG those POS's that need to come out on top? I know why I have gotten all the offers. Because I was shoving my foot deeper and deeper up my ARSE and not paying attention.

You see, I have been victimized once before. That's no secret. I talk about it alot now, because I did not for many years and it DESTROYED Me. I finally got my head srewed back on after serious therapy and I am now (well not RIGHT NOW) very Proud of who I am and what I have become once again.

I chase scumbags like SIMON all the way to Ireland to help my fellow members on BF. NOTHING MORE. I expect nothing, ask for nothing and honestly and sincerely do it only because it makes ME feel whole again.

Jared and I had a "DEAL" to Deal fairly. Thats how it started. We were very cordial with each other and I sincerely believe he had good intentions. But when I immediately E-mailed him too ask him how he came about with a Total of $25.00 for the pair, he IGNORED me. Then he posted lies about a knife-tip being broken, and then stating he shipped a Gerber 600 instead of the 400 that he actually did ship without the sheath to boot. Had he just responded to me, used that phone number I gave him, this could have been hanldled FAIRLY and certainly not here.

No way did I deserve this type of deal from a member of BF. There is simply no excuse for this. This is pure BULLSH*T. I know this, Jared knows this, hell, MOST of you know this. If you were me and got a deal like this..Oh well, nuff said.

It's over. Jared wins and I have learned a very VALUABLE lesson.
But I remain the Man and offer my sincerest apology for ever bring this to GB&U and becoming a DINK. I know better, and I am old enough to eat the plate of SH*T I prepared for myself. I have eaten said plate and hereby apologize to everyone, even Jared.

Now, I shall Drive-on and become the productive member of BF I demand of ME...Ira;)
 
:(

What painful reading !

nifrand is absolutely correct ! And, the sooner the better. . .

Like most threads of this nature it has served no purpose ~ except to prove that "they agree to disagree !"
 
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