What are local knife shops thinking?

KrisOK said:
I believe that there is only one dedicated knife shop left here in OKC, and unfortunately, the owner has gotten a bit of a bad reputation. Most of his business is knife sharpening, and of late he's gotten some REALLY bad reviews on review sites. Plus, his hours of operation are VERY erratic. I've gone there several times during what should be business hours only to find the store closed. Finally I just gave up.

Other than that, we have some smoke shops that deal in knives as a sideline, and one western clothing outfitter that has a resonable selection of knives. All of these have prices that are 50% or greater above what I can get online. I'd LOVE to find a local knife store to call 'HOME', but it's not going to happen were I live apparantly.
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There's a gun&gear store pretty close to there, small selection of several brands, over priced IMO, but friendly staff.
 
There's a fairly new specialty knife shop near me, Vulcan Knife Works, and I think their model relies a lot on sharpening and restoration in addition to sales. I haven't bought anything there yet, nor have I been in since I really started doing some pricing and window-shopping for knives I'd want to buy, but I did browse for a while as I was waiting for my kitchen knives to be sharpened and as I recall their prices seemed to be somewhere in between online market price and MSRP.

Quick local servicing is one thing brick-and-mortar still has on online retail. You can send your knives in to the manufacturer or shops with websites for sharpening, but if you take them to your friendly local bladesmith you don't have to pay shipping and wait days or weeks for them to come back.

Anyway, I'm also grateful for their services as a showroom, and since they let me handle a number of knives I'd been looking at while I was there, I'll definitely try to buy my next one from them if they have what I want and I can get the price to within 10-15% of what I'd pay online with shipping factored in.
 
To the few guys arguing that MSRP or higher prices are required to run a B&M store, what about stores like the one in JDavis882 frequents in this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsGhiFTH7Sg It's a huge knife store, with low prices, and check out the crowd. That place looks and sounds packed! I think they sell more items than just knives, but they're able to successfully sell tons of HIGH end knives at competitive prices and even earn business from us savvy knife knuts.

In my local knife shops (others may be different), the amount the prices are marked up are just not worth it. Like I said, the service I've received from just about any knife/gun store is the employee pulls the item out of the case so I can handle it, then puts it back. Other than that, the only perk I'm getting is having it right then and there, which isn't a huge deal to me. And as to not getting a knife with flaws, most of the knives I've handled in stores had loads of blade play and rough action.
 
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You know, I went looking for a local knife shop and couldn't find one.

You know what? I wasn't surprised.

I'm old enough to remember the days before the internet. I also remember knife shops from back then. Prices were just as out of line as they are today, we just didn't know it.

If you can't move product, you can't stay in business. It's why gun shops sell knives. They may not sell enough knives to make the rent, but gun people like knives. Gun shops make most their $$ off accessories. Why can't a knife shop do that? Seriously.

Sometimes rock bottom $$ isn't what moves a product. Sometimes it's merely a decent price combined with something you can't get from an internet retailer......like maybe free sharpening 1x a month, or buy 10 knives, get a SAK free. Treat your customers right, and make your physically close location into a boon instead of a problem...........make sure to inspect all knives before they even get put out to be sold, and then if a person makes a return, make it a selling experience, not a "whew, I'm glad to be rid of that knife, and that shop guy is an asshole" experience. If people come to your place, and leave smiling.....you did well. If people leave your shop in a hurry because they don't want to have to deal with the guy behind the counter.....well......you'd be better off being a cold, lifeless webpage.

Brick and mortar stores are at a disadvantage when they play to the advantages of the internet (bulk sales, smaller profit per unit).

HOWEVER, internet stores are at a disadvantage in other areas. Find them, exploit them, and I'll be willing to bet they do better.

Brick and mortar stores that can't get that are going to fail. You can't expect to play to your opponents strength, and expect to fare well. Play to their disadvantages.
 
fwiw- I really wanted to get a balisong and a local knife store had the one I wanted for $200. I found the same knife on line for $170. Guess which one I bought? I know times are hard but I why spend more money if you don't have to?
 
I am very fortunate. Here are a few of the shops offering knives in easy driving distance: Gander Mtn, Dick's, Herb Philipsons, and best of all...Bradlees Military. The Big Boxes all carry the standard fare...I purposely left out Wally World, etc.

I am willing to pay a bit more for the ability to handle/fondle the knife, take it home with me immediately, not paying for shipping though that is offset by Northern NY's very high sales tax. I am not willing to pay more than I feel is fair and I will and do say something to the manager...not the poor schmuck sales person...I state my case politely and leave it at that.

Bradlees is the big winner. Their prices are fair and they carry a huge assortment of bladed things from a Cold Steel Gladius, soldiers buy the oddest things, to BM's, Spyderco, Buck, Ka-Bar, Tops, Cold Steel, etc...too many brands in stock to name...I especially like handling/fondling the varied autos he carries...selling those to active military and LEO's...
Living close to Fort Drum has its' benefits and I try to take advantage of them.
 
I'm leaving ya'lls blade forum. it is based on what i've seen as far the prices of what ya'll prefer in knives (don't blame anyone for what they like in a blade, or their choice), and how few people talk about a few good quality blades by good quality makers. Not a blade that can't be found by 85% of us, but a blade thats been proven worthy of its price, say, 50-150 dollars for a top end blade. a medium folder at 50 dollars is usually a reasonable bet, as is a fixed at maybe, 105-145 dollars. I saw one blade mentioned by a member that was 500+ dollars! most of us in a not so comfy financial situation would consider that as a good gun, or two car payments, or with me, 4(!!) land payments, plus beer for a couple of weeks. Again, I do not condemn anyone for their blade choices, just the feasability of why I'm here, whem I rarely see any metion of what I like in a good blade. Everyone , have a good life, continue to carry, keep them close, and don't loan them to people who don't carry........ marlinman4570 r.i.p.
 
marlinman4570 said:
I'm leaving ya'lls blade forum. it is based on what i've seen as far the prices of what ya'll prefer in knives (don't blame anyone for what they like in a blade, or their choice), and how few people talk about a few good quality blades by good quality makers. Not a blade that can't be found by 85% of us, but a blade thats been proven worthy of its price, say, 50-150 dollars for a top end blade. a medium folder at 50 dollars is usually a reasonable bet, as is a fixed at maybe, 105-145 dollars. I saw one blade mentioned by a member that was 500+ dollars! most of us in a not so comfy financial situation would consider that as a good gun, or two car payments, or with me, 4(!!) land payments, plus beer for a couple of weeks. Again, I do not condemn anyone for their blade choices, just the feasability of why I'm here, whem I rarely see any metion of what I like in a good blade. Everyone , have a good life, continue to carry, keep them close, and don't loan them to people who don't carry........ marlinman4570 r.i.p.
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Well, THAT was rather random!
 
One thing to consider is that not all businesses are equal. Not all business owners are equal. Some people have a knack for success. They know exactly who their target customers are. They choose superior locations for the b&m strorefront. They don't stick with the same old distributor just because he's "a good guy"; Instead they drive hard bargains with suppliers to squeeze out every last .1% of dealer discount, and they will switch suppliers if necessary. They keep a close eye on competitors and are quick to match or beat them. They look for exclusives and specialty items to differentiate themselves from other retailers. Many of them realize that internet sales are a crucial part of their success, so in addition to the b&m outlet they also have a website or at least an Ebay store.

It seems to me that if you want to sell mid to high end production knives you cannot half-ass it. You either go all in or you get knocked out by entrepreneurs who ARE willing to commit.
 
If anyone is near Cincinnati, Ohio, specifically Newport Kentucky right over the river, go to Cecil Clark knives. It's a small but very full store with an internet presence under a different name and great prices and good people.
 
A lot of the brick and mortar knife shops out there probably stay afloat due to all of the Opinels, Buck 420HC, Victorinox/Wenger. Case and other well known work/sporting knives. Most people walking into a knife store are not going for the customs in the center display case, are not going for the ZT, Benchmade, Kershaw, Spyderco and high end Case, Buck etc. There's a reason why people will keep going to the flea market or swap meet for a couple of those 5 dollar ripoff knives, when after a year they could have bought the real one. I've seen some collections of Frost, Steel Warrior, Chinese Schrade etc. Whenever I am introduced as the big guy that likes knives, someone has a Harbor Freight bowie, a hardware store machete, or a Frost slipjoint. You paid more than 20 bucks for a knife, what the hell is wrong with you?

Hell, there are a few support groups, ahem, I mean forums out there, we are all over!

The one knife shop I support is right outside the radius of a bunch of seaside resorts in the mid Atlantic, and part of my summer vacation involves a visit there. The other shop I support is a stop whenever I head out to the mountains of western MD. I don't go often, but when I do, I always walk out with something in hand.
 
00ChevyScott said:
To the few guys arguing that MSRP or higher prices are required to run a B&M store, what about stores like the one in JDavis882 frequents in this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SsGhiFTH7Sg It's a huge knife store, with low prices, and check out the crowd. That place looks and sounds packed! I think they sell more items than just knives, but they're able to successfully sell tons of HIGH end knives at competitive prices and even earn business from us savvy knife knuts.
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I think you've answered your own question. In a word VOLUME. If you have a large store, with a large selection, a lot of customer traffic/interest, and high sales, you can afford to sell at cheaper prices.

Location also counts for a lot. A large knife-specific store located in an area where few people are interested in buying knives will fail. A small knife store with a small customer base might survive if they charge enough to cover the expense of staying open.

In the end it's simple business economics, and those are always a gamble. Sure, if you have low prices it might translate into more customers and more sales, but there's no garuntee of that. And if your prices are high you might make enough from a few customers to stay in business. Or, if your prices are too high you might scare away customers and go out of business as a direct result. Small business owners don't have a crystal ball, they don't know which business plan will succeed. They likely operate on a razor-thin margin and if they choose the wrong business plan it could put them out of business, cause them to lose their home, not be able to feed their family or send their kids to college. Perhaps it wouldn't hurt to remember that when wondering why their prices are what they are. Their not trying to get rich off you, they're trying to survive and provide for their families.
 
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marlinman4570 said:
I'm leaving ya'lls blade forum. it is based on what i've seen as far the prices of what ya'll prefer in knives (don't blame anyone for what they like in a blade, or their choice), and how few people talk about a few good quality blades by good quality makers. Not a blade that can't be found by 85% of us, but a blade thats been proven worthy of its price, say, 50-150 dollars for a top end blade. a medium folder at 50 dollars is usually a reasonable bet, as is a fixed at maybe, 105-145 dollars. I saw one blade mentioned by a member that was 500+ dollars! most of us in a not so comfy financial situation would consider that as a good gun, or two car payments, or with me, 4(!!) land payments, plus beer for a couple of weeks. Again, I do not condemn anyone for their blade choices, just the feasability of why I'm here, whem I rarely see any metion of what I like in a good blade. Everyone , have a good life, continue to carry, keep them close, and don't loan them to people who don't carry........ marlinman4570 r.i.p.
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Sorry, my computers "gibberish translator" isn't working. I didn't understand a thing you said.

;)
 
Ya at a gun show I went to they were selling a $20 knife for $65. I just don't get it.
 
Maybe they're a front for a money laundering business or illegal gambling ring. Next time you go in tell them that "Tony" sent you and you want to go in the "Back".
 
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