Nordic Viking
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mister_wilburn said:
IMO, you should go for a Spyderco Salt, 'cause denile is quite full o' corrosive croc poop, dis time o' year
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What do Real Military Men/Women Carry
- Thread starter brownshoe
- Start date
IMO, you should go for a Spyderco Salt, 'cause denile is quite full o' corrosive croc poop, dis time o' year
brownshoe said:
My son and daughter both served an 18 month tour in beautiful Baghdad at the beginning of the police action. He was a recon platoon leader with 1st Armoured Div. He used the standard issue knife-bayonet (alot more knife than bayonet). I sent them each a Microtech MSE-SC automatic folder which they carried. In discussions he said that all his troops carried basically the same equipment so everyone knew what to do with everything in an emergency. They were not allowed to carry all kinds of personal stuff including knives, especially fixed blades. This policy is apparently set by the unit you are with. He said he personally would trade knife weight for ammo weight anyday.
Here is the M9 knife-bayonet they used. he said it was very effective for opening doors, house and cars. They sharpened them every day before going out on patrol.
http://www.m9bayonet.com/
Ex-Army. A plain grunt.
Found knife buying/using/collecting after discharging.
In the service, just the issue kabar. Small paper cutter here and there. No one around carried any other thing.
Being a lowly private, we were discouraged to carry a knife or anything non-issue. Especially a knife or any edged tool was frowned upon. Being E3 or E4 can get things more on their way. But, sergents or officers generally not happy with soldiers carrying an extra knife.
Of course it all depends on what unit you're in. More specifically, who your superior is.
One of my cousins was airborn trooper, another was in special forces. Neither carried extra knives while in service that I know of. One cousin retired as air force seagent(E6), and he had nothing special too.
A coworker of mine was air force captain, ex-fighter pilot. He still keeps his survival knife and another small knife issued to him, and uses them on camping.
After becoming a knife nut, I've met a few knife nut active duty personnel. A sergent carries a kabar and a leatherman. A lance-corporal carries a BM. He is on headquaters duty and high ranking officers are generally tolerant about him carrying a knife, but still gets frown from some.
I think if a solder is into the knife thing, he would carry whatever he fancies, and if not, he won't give a damn. Except asking to borrow one if his buddy has a good one.
(Sorry for service woman, I used 'he' just to simplify writing. Using 'he/she' repeatedly feels awkward)
Found knife buying/using/collecting after discharging.
In the service, just the issue kabar. Small paper cutter here and there. No one around carried any other thing.
Being a lowly private, we were discouraged to carry a knife or anything non-issue. Especially a knife or any edged tool was frowned upon. Being E3 or E4 can get things more on their way. But, sergents or officers generally not happy with soldiers carrying an extra knife.
Of course it all depends on what unit you're in. More specifically, who your superior is.
One of my cousins was airborn trooper, another was in special forces. Neither carried extra knives while in service that I know of. One cousin retired as air force seagent(E6), and he had nothing special too.
A coworker of mine was air force captain, ex-fighter pilot. He still keeps his survival knife and another small knife issued to him, and uses them on camping.
After becoming a knife nut, I've met a few knife nut active duty personnel. A sergent carries a kabar and a leatherman. A lance-corporal carries a BM. He is on headquaters duty and high ranking officers are generally tolerant about him carrying a knife, but still gets frown from some.
I think if a solder is into the knife thing, he would carry whatever he fancies, and if not, he won't give a damn. Except asking to borrow one if his buddy has a good one.
(Sorry for service woman, I used 'he' just to simplify writing. Using 'he/she' repeatedly feels awkward)
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I'm curious as to why so many on-line subscribers to this forum place such a high value on what military folks select for their knives? I am a huge supporter of our honorable and brave servicemen, but I think I'd be more interested in what a professional guide or other wilderness expert had to say about knife performance/selection. After all, the few friends I have who serve in military spec ops outfits all told me they really don't place a big emphasis on the type of knives they carry (other than multi-tool type knives). In fact, I was kinda surprised to hear from all three of my buddies that size and weight were the real concerns when choosing what knife to carry. According to each of them, carrying an extra loaded magazine on missions was a far better trade-off than a heavy duty knife. Learn somethin new every day I guess.
I did my national service in the Finnish Army 1999-2000. I started off in Pioneers (sappers) and moved to a Jaeger (light infantry) company after basic. Our "Finnish Rapid Deployment Force" trained and equipped for UN and NATO peacekeeping ops. I was a rifleman.
Privates were never issued knives but I saw all sorts of stuff that was privately purchased. I carried:
-Gerber 400 series multi tool.
-Spyderco Endura.
-"Leuku" style puukko, a traditional Finnish design hunting knife. 7" blade
-Peltonen Ranger Puukko M95 fighter/utility fixed 7" blade
-Mora fixed blade utility
NCO school and Reserve Officer school graduates were issued a specially marked black Marttiini puukko upon graduation.
The Peltonen was impressive, easily one of the best military fixed blades I have ever handled. It was issued to Finnish Special Forces only but a few of us bought them. Some of my mates bought similarly large combat knives by Fiskars/Gerber and the odd Ka-Bar. As would be expected, traditional Finnish puukkos were very popular.
The Leuku was a big, good looking traditional design that looked cool. It took me a few weeks to realise that a big blade looked impressive but was just another thing to carry around and possibly lose. As we were paid a per diem allowance of about US$5 a day (no, that’s not a typo), I didn’t want to lose my precious Peltonen so it saw minimal field use.
Most of us bought Swedish Moras for about US$10 and abused the hell out of them. The hard plastic case and handle made it look like a toy but the steel quality was very impressive. We lost a few and snapped the odd tip between us but for $10 who cares? A lot of us carried multi tools, mostly Waves and Swisstools.
By the end of our service many of us (including those who deployed to Kosovo) agreed that a multi tool and maybe a small puukko (or similar) and was all that was required.
Killing the enemy would be a job for the rifle.
Privates were never issued knives but I saw all sorts of stuff that was privately purchased. I carried:
-Gerber 400 series multi tool.
-Spyderco Endura.
-"Leuku" style puukko, a traditional Finnish design hunting knife. 7" blade
-Peltonen Ranger Puukko M95 fighter/utility fixed 7" blade
-Mora fixed blade utility
NCO school and Reserve Officer school graduates were issued a specially marked black Marttiini puukko upon graduation.
The Peltonen was impressive, easily one of the best military fixed blades I have ever handled. It was issued to Finnish Special Forces only but a few of us bought them. Some of my mates bought similarly large combat knives by Fiskars/Gerber and the odd Ka-Bar. As would be expected, traditional Finnish puukkos were very popular.
The Leuku was a big, good looking traditional design that looked cool. It took me a few weeks to realise that a big blade looked impressive but was just another thing to carry around and possibly lose. As we were paid a per diem allowance of about US$5 a day (no, that’s not a typo), I didn’t want to lose my precious Peltonen so it saw minimal field use.
Most of us bought Swedish Moras for about US$10 and abused the hell out of them. The hard plastic case and handle made it look like a toy but the steel quality was very impressive. We lost a few and snapped the odd tip between us but for $10 who cares? A lot of us carried multi tools, mostly Waves and Swisstools.
By the end of our service many of us (including those who deployed to Kosovo) agreed that a multi tool and maybe a small puukko (or similar) and was all that was required.
Killing the enemy would be a job for the rifle.
As part of our training my battalion attended a two week peacekeeping exercise in southern Norway in May/June 2000 (Co-Operative Banners 2000). Troops of all services from 16 countries attended and it was a great opportunity for cross training. As a knife nut, I checked out what others were carrying.
The US Marines had their Ka-Bars which they described "tough... use em for hammers, levers, whatever you want". Their countrymen from the Army preferred folders. I noted a lot of CRKT M16s and Benchmades (I think ACFK). The nordic troops seemed to prefer small to medium traditional fixed blades of their home countries. We are fortunate that Scandinavia has a rich knifemaking heritage. The British didn't seem to carry any fixed blades. The most popular knives overall were small folders (mainly SAK) and multi tools, especially older Leathermans.
The US Marines had their Ka-Bars which they described "tough... use em for hammers, levers, whatever you want". Their countrymen from the Army preferred folders. I noted a lot of CRKT M16s and Benchmades (I think ACFK). The nordic troops seemed to prefer small to medium traditional fixed blades of their home countries. We are fortunate that Scandinavia has a rich knifemaking heritage. The British didn't seem to carry any fixed blades. The most popular knives overall were small folders (mainly SAK) and multi tools, especially older Leathermans.
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Hey GUys..
WoW,, this is an old thread....
What I'm finding with my clients who are Mil is a wide spectrum of different knives..
Everything from Cold Steel, Ranger Knives, Busse, Ontario, Kershaw, Striders/Buck Striders, Beckers, Moras,Benchamades, and a few customs...
All kinds of stuff really, everything from inexpensive Moras to higher end blades..
Nothing has passed my desk from Commanders or purchase orders, other than some police departments.. All the sheaths seem to be bought by individuals..
Here are a few examples of what my clients are carrying...
Cold Steel
Becker BK7
Becker Crewman
ttyle
Eric....
WoW,, this is an old thread....
What I'm finding with my clients who are Mil is a wide spectrum of different knives..
Everything from Cold Steel, Ranger Knives, Busse, Ontario, Kershaw, Striders/Buck Striders, Beckers, Moras,Benchamades, and a few customs...
All kinds of stuff really, everything from inexpensive Moras to higher end blades..
Nothing has passed my desk from Commanders or purchase orders, other than some police departments.. All the sheaths seem to be bought by individuals..
Here are a few examples of what my clients are carrying...
Cold Steel
Becker BK7
Becker Crewman
ttyle
Eric....
Gravelface
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19D Scout 4 yrs Ft. Hood Tx, 1 tour to Iraq, Coporal. I assure you most every one I knew carried something from the local PX. No high dollar knives were harmed in taking of the country. Kinda defeats the purpose of them I think. I personally carried 1 gerber gator(35.00 walmart), 1 cold steel srk(52.00 PX), 1 benchmade Nimravus (found in the field, only cost me 2 packs of cigs to get from the original finder). That the only significant ones, there were a slew of others I traded out. Now that I am out, I have begun to purchase the high dollar knives and travel far from my roots, I now own Fehrmans, Swamps, Rangers. In Iraq I saw a few people carry Onatario fixed blades. Jason
Mr. Blugrn, I started this thread to find out what real military men and women use. To me and others its been enlightening...just because 
Wilderness guides may be a good source of information, but these days I'd bet there are more military personnel on these forums than true wilderness guides. Plus wilderness guides don't use their knives as weapons. The reason I find this topic interesting is two fold. First, knives are weapons and tools and the military uses them for both purposes. The only time I've used a knife as a weapon was to kill a rat. Second, the knife companies have a lot of ad copy and the knife mags have a lot of articles (also in many ways ad copy) about hard use knives and military knives. It's interesting to see how few of these blades (and there are boatloads of designs and firms) actually wind up being used by the military. There could be a lot of hard use knives resting in suburbia Some firms claim their knives are part of "military issue" and it's neat to see how true this may really be. It's been fun seeing the various respones.
Thanks for the info. Keep it going.
Wilderness guides may be a good source of information, but these days I'd bet there are more military personnel on these forums than true wilderness guides. Plus wilderness guides don't use their knives as weapons. The reason I find this topic interesting is two fold. First, knives are weapons and tools and the military uses them for both purposes. The only time I've used a knife as a weapon was to kill a rat. Second, the knife companies have a lot of ad copy and the knife mags have a lot of articles (also in many ways ad copy) about hard use knives and military knives. It's interesting to see how few of these blades (and there are boatloads of designs and firms) actually wind up being used by the military. There could be a lot of hard use knives resting in suburbia
Some firms claim their knives are part of "military issue" and it's neat to see how true this may really be. It's been fun seeing the various respones. Thanks for the info. Keep it going.
BlackKnight86
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Good thread! Lots of valuable opinions...and not all what I might have expected.
Here's an interesting question: what if you remove the "knife knut" aspect...would that make a difference in your answer? In other words, what if you go only by what your needs/requirements were?
I'm remembering the person who said that 90% (?) of the cutting jobs that he did in the Gulf War were with a box cutter. Now, it's been 15 years since I've been in the Army, and I love knives; but as I recall, I could (and did) get by with a basic SAK. Not that I didn't try to find things to cut with my fixed blades, but that's just my point...I had to try! They were my babies, and by golly, I was going to use them!
Some guys that I spoke to who are currently on active duty said that, for the average soldier in a regular unit (let's assume reliable access to resupply, whether military or commercial), a multitool and a small inexpensive fixed blade are the best use of their resources (remember: we're disregarding the "knife knut" aspect). The focus is on cost, replaceability, sharpening ability...factors like that.
A former 75th Ranger to whom I spoke said that the high end knives were desirable if one was in a specialized unit on a specialized mission (long term, behind enemy lines, limited resupply)...basically a situation where one's life depended on his tools, and he couldn't afford any of them to fail. He was a genuine knife knut...he loved his Striders (he was the one who introduced me to the line, at a local gun show). But even he said that for most of the stuff he did, he wouldn't carry more than $50 - $100 worth of knives (multi-tool, and maybe a small fixed blade), if that. He simply didn't need to.
It's a very interesting discussion...
Here's an interesting question: what if you remove the "knife knut" aspect...would that make a difference in your answer? In other words, what if you go only by what your needs/requirements were?
I'm remembering the person who said that 90% (?) of the cutting jobs that he did in the Gulf War were with a box cutter. Now, it's been 15 years since I've been in the Army, and I love knives; but as I recall, I could (and did) get by with a basic SAK. Not that I didn't try to find things to cut with my fixed blades, but that's just my point...I had to try! They were my babies, and by golly, I was going to use them!
Some guys that I spoke to who are currently on active duty said that, for the average soldier in a regular unit (let's assume reliable access to resupply, whether military or commercial), a multitool and a small inexpensive fixed blade are the best use of their resources (remember: we're disregarding the "knife knut" aspect). The focus is on cost, replaceability, sharpening ability...factors like that.
A former 75th Ranger to whom I spoke said that the high end knives were desirable if one was in a specialized unit on a specialized mission (long term, behind enemy lines, limited resupply)...basically a situation where one's life depended on his tools, and he couldn't afford any of them to fail. He was a genuine knife knut...he loved his Striders (he was the one who introduced me to the line, at a local gun show). But even he said that for most of the stuff he did, he wouldn't carry more than $50 - $100 worth of knives (multi-tool, and maybe a small fixed blade), if that. He simply didn't need to.
It's a very interesting discussion...
blugrn said:
I would agree. And while I am a knife knut I have to say that just about any knife from Gerber, Benchmade, Spyderco, CRKT, Cold Steel, Kershaw, would do fine.
Today people put too much emphasis on what steel and the hardness and whatnot. I know guys who have done 2-3 years with nothing but a Swiss Army Knife or a Gerber Paraframe or something cheap like that. Knowing how to properly use a knife is much more important than what it's made from.
Sure, we all like knives but realistically many of the knives we think are "junk" would do just fine.
Also, wanted to add that I think this is a great thread. I also love seing what real Mil folks carry/use. I have great respect for all of you and wish you all very well.
:thumbup:
I can't believe how many scouts (19D) and the old designation (11D) that I have seen here. I was in from '77 to '80 1st Bn 6th Inf 1st AD (1/6 Inf) eventually a scout squad leader E-5. Started under the old designator 11D and eventually was changed to 19D Regular army. I carried everyday a Buck 112 and when we alerted I also had my Gerber MKII. Didn't use the Gerber much but I beat the hell out of that 112. Finally retired it years ago. Daily carry now is my Spyderco Dragonfly and I abuse that fairly well, the way I used to use the Buck but maybe not quite as rough. I remember I used the Buck to cut through the metal strap on a C rations case once, one of those square metal straps about one tenth of an inch square on all four sides. Didn't hurt the blade but didn't do the brass any good. Couple of permanent indentions. Stomped on the knife twice to get through but it did work. I know that wasn't the brightest thing to do. Guess we were out in the weeds to long and pretty hungry. I have seen more scouts on this thread then I think I have met in all the time I have been out. Its an honor to meet all you guys. :thumbup:
KR
I have seen more scouts on this thread then I think I have met in all the time I have been out. Its an honor to meet all you guys. :thumbup: KR
Hmmm well Ive been out of the AF for 10 years now, I was an E4, worked in survival Equip., and am a disabled verteran from desert shield/storm.
Its been a long while since I was active duty, but I can tell you a few things from my experience. The knives we were issued at that time were the 4 blade utility folder, the ontario F/U.
The small 3 blade colonial stockman was issued for the survival kits, as well as the liferaft knife, and the parachute line cutter. The pilots knife was of course issued to pilots and some aircrew. The leatherman was issued, but not until after I came back from the 1st war. I had purchased my own and brought it with me.
I also carried many different SAK's, as they were cheap and readilly available at the BX (PX for you grunts), and other knives purchased there. And as anyone who has spent time in the military knows, the pay is not that great, so you do what you can.
The auto benchmades made it to the NSN catalog aorund the middle 90's as I was getting ready to be discharged for disabilty (health problems from the 1st war).
Through the war I had an issue F/U, a 4 blade utility pocket knife, a SAK and a leatherman (they all worked just fine).
Wow, these guys look younger, and younger! or perhaps Im just getting older!
A while back at the VA I met a young man who had some health problems from the Iraqi war. He told me he could not believe the way the military treated him with his health problems. I told him that I had been dealing with some of the same problems for over 15 years, when he was still a baby. I felt bad for him as it was an eye opener he had not expected. But then its nothing new, the vietnam vets had problems also getting medical coverage for cancer problems related to agent orange (and many still are!). It doesnt happen to all veterans, but it does happen allot. They've had a bad habit of mistreating veterans (most especially disabled ones) over the years on their benefits.
Its been a long while since I was active duty, but I can tell you a few things from my experience. The knives we were issued at that time were the 4 blade utility folder, the ontario F/U.
The small 3 blade colonial stockman was issued for the survival kits, as well as the liferaft knife, and the parachute line cutter. The pilots knife was of course issued to pilots and some aircrew. The leatherman was issued, but not until after I came back from the 1st war. I had purchased my own and brought it with me.
I also carried many different SAK's, as they were cheap and readilly available at the BX (PX for you grunts), and other knives purchased there. And as anyone who has spent time in the military knows, the pay is not that great, so you do what you can.
The auto benchmades made it to the NSN catalog aorund the middle 90's as I was getting ready to be discharged for disabilty (health problems from the 1st war).
Through the war I had an issue F/U, a 4 blade utility pocket knife, a SAK and a leatherman (they all worked just fine).
Wow, these guys look younger, and younger! or perhaps Im just getting older!
A while back at the VA I met a young man who had some health problems from the Iraqi war. He told me he could not believe the way the military treated him with his health problems. I told him that I had been dealing with some of the same problems for over 15 years, when he was still a baby. I felt bad for him as it was an eye opener he had not expected. But then its nothing new, the vietnam vets had problems also getting medical coverage for cancer problems related to agent orange (and many still are!). It doesnt happen to all veterans, but it does happen allot. They've had a bad habit of mistreating veterans (most especially disabled ones) over the years on their benefits.
