When the SHTF - Camps

zman308

zman308

Joined
Sep 3, 2007
Messages
831
When the SHTF. Yesterday on the news they featured cities that have emergency evacuation plans. I asked evacuate to where? Once you get out of town, where do you go. I assume that they think we all go to Motel 8 and sit the emergency out. These fill up fast. How about "refugee" camps. Who would run these camps and what weapons rules would they have. The National Guard certainly would not allow any type of firearm, how about large fixed blade knives? You would have to hide your folders and other blades. How would you like to be in the Detroit area when they evacuate that bunch. The camps would be worse that any prison in the third world. Gangs would rule and if you had a problem who would respond to it. So you would then have to form your own alliances for protection. Remember New Orleans when they started confiscating legal weapons so only the hoods had guns. Martial law would supersede any local gun protections. I live outside the city and would not evacuate unless forced to by armed authorities. I could improvise and scrounge out an existence at home. If I had to move I keep a car survival kit and would head out to the family farm. (well, propane, rural, generator) Would roadblocks search your car and confiscate weapons? That leaves you the alternative to bug out on foot. Basically I would not like to be in any type of formal camp or relocation area. So what are your thoughts on this scenario?
 
I agree! thats alot to think about. Katrina was bad. what about a major earthquake, or terrorist attack that left a city unlivable(dirty bomb) It could get real bad real fast & look how long it took the gov. to just get people water! SCARY!!!
 
I agree anywhere is better than a government camp.
I've thought of this much myself living through many Huricanes, Andrew included.

If a nuclear weapon was used in the north part of Florida on I95, South Florida might as well be an island.
There are very few areas not occupied by people.
Very few wilderness areas.
It would be a real mess.
There are no easy answers.
Be prepared to live like a rat.
If your home is even partially standing you're probabilly better off staying put.
Store food and ammo and learn all the skills you can.
I personally would never be disarmed.
During Andrew there were no Police or Fire or National guard for quite a while.
I had no power for 2 months.
Some went a year without power.
My neighborhood had armed people patroling their own homes and neighbors looking out for each other.
A whole block of homeowners with rifles watching each others homes is the way to go.
Having water,water purifacation,food guns and ammo and having enough to share can get you more soldiers on your team.
Keeping a few hundred pounds of rice is inexpencive and good barter.
An Ice making machine and a generator would make you king and could be used as barter for goods and services.
Filled propane tanks gives you the ability to cook and purify water.
I do believe in keeping your core supplies and having seperate extra items to share and barter.
When the gangs of armed starving desprate people come looking for your supplies it's nice to have neighbors who can watch your back.
 
The best place to be in a really major disaster IMHO, is AWAY from large groups of people you don't already know, and in some cases people you do.
 
If something really seriously awful happened, I'd have plenty of places to go from relatives in Lapland to a summer cabin by a lakeside. You can't get much further away from people than these places, and we Finns like fallout shelters. :D But in most cases, I'd just gear up and go help with whatever the emergency is that we have at hand.
 
I'd definitely agree that the last place you want to go is inside one of the government camps. Some folks who oppose this standpoint suggest that having a family makes things different, but you'll still have an easier time keeping everyone in your party safe by doing it on your own terms, not allowing a schmuck with national guard back-up to tell you what to do. I wasn't in the wake of Katrina, let alone in the dome, but I've read every first person report I could find and wasn't that surprised.

Be prepared enough to store a healthy amount of food and water (and means of purifying it) in your home, along with an appropriate long-arm with a good stock of ammo. If you're with a neighborhood of like-minded people, you might be lucky enough to have a group of good folks willing to look out for one another.

Staying home means you already have shelter, beds, tools, etc. and hopefully some food and other necessities. The woods would be great if you know where you're going, but there will be lots of Ne'er-do-wells with the same notion of heading to the woods.
 
I believe that in a SHTF scenario one has to think for themselves. Waiting for others to help you is not the reality of a real bad situation. You'll be subject to waiting for political answers and roving gangs of looters/criminals. Both offer no sympathy to your situation. Now if help comes along, fine but do not plan on it. Good neighbors who think like you are indeed an asset. It is hard to determine who will have your back though till it's possibly too late. Try to get to know your neighbors now and make friends with them. See what their mindset is. During the LA riots and Katrina folks who stuck together did the best. As to going to a refugee camp.....I personally wouldn't do it. At least not in the short term when they would be overwhelmed and ineffective at best. I certainly would not go unarmed. Another handy thing one can do is obtain some hand to hand training. You don't need full on Ninja Academy to survive but some formal traing in self dense would definitely give you some confidence in an encounter. As to supplies study up and know some simple water treatment plans such as almost every houshold has some Clorox in it. Add a little to dirty water and hey! Your drinking :) Keep a kit made up or at least know where your gear is. I think the old 3 day plan is sorta outdated after watching the Katrina responses. Two to three weeks should be a modern plan. I figure that would be enough time for service to start coming back or time enough to walk away far enough to be out of the hot zone :)
 
Man. Thanks for posting this as it has started me thinking. I feel like I'm a pretty compassionate person, so my first response would be to help out in any way that I could. But I also want what is best for my family. It seems like in a really bad situation, only the strong and smart survive, but if I'm one of them, I'd want to help the weak and ignorant.

I definitely don't want to start shooting people for trying to get some water. I'm going to do some serious thinking about this, but it makes me thankful that this isn't all that there is.
 
What exactly are you implying when referring to "Detroit" and "that bunch"? I would think that any bunch of people, regardless of where they are from would be capable of desperate measures when placed in a desperate situation and unprepared for it.

And yes, a Gov. run camp or center is the last place you'll find me and my family.

hatchet-
 
If in the Detroit area, don't forget the ability to bug out by boat on the rivers that connect with the Detriot River. ;)
 
Rupestris said:
If in the Detroit area, don't forget the ability to bug out by boat on the rivers that connect with the Detriot River. ;)
Click to expand...

You know I live in Windsor (across the river from Detroit), and my friends and I have talked about this - Implications of a mass exodus from a city of 4 million people to one of 200,000. I'm pretty sure the bridge and tunnel crossing would be guarded, but boats wouldn't be easy to regulate. The current is too swift to swim and the river doesn't freeze in winter so overall not many people would make it. That said, Windsor wouldn't be any more of a desirable place than others, although access to the county is better than from Detroit. I would still likely leave Windsor and head towards some of the smaller communities on Lake Erie.

Personally, I visted a shelter during the '98 Ice Storms in Ottawa which knocked out power in some areas for 6 weeks during the dead of winter. I was one of the lucky ones where I lost power for only 1 day (although during that day I didn't know if the power would come back on). I checked out the shelter at the point, but decided to wait it out at home with my winter sleeping bag or attempt an exit south to visit family.

The shelter was basically a bunch of cots in a gymnasium that had heat, water and food supplied. As others implied, theft was ramped. People were cranky and there wasn't this wonderful group mentality that one might expect. However, because the whole area wasn't affected i.e. a total SHTF scenario, there was a good supply chain to the people and order was well maintained.

I concur with others however that over time the conditions would degrade. Larger groups of people together tend to start developing stupid rules and this would be reinforced by selected armed security where oppotunities for corruption would run very high. Also, it is my contention that such a group would attempt to secure existing resources and use them to the bring of exhaustion before finding sustainable measures of procurring them. For example they would more likely raid every grocery store for several months rather than consider food production methods.

I think having a plan beforehand of areas that you could go would be of great help. Perhaps a family member with land in the country or as mentioned a cabin somewhere distant from human populations numbers would be a good idea. Getting there though might be a big challenge.

Crunch points for roadways, e.g. larger bridges, highway ramps ect. are prone to getting clogged or might be guarded and set off limits for official traffic. They would also be ridden with highwayman and pirates. One would definitely have to come up with an exit plan that might not necessarily allow for road travel.
 
kgd said:
That said, Windsor wouldn't be any more of a desirable place than others, although access to the county is better than from Detroit. I would still likely leave Windsor and head toward some of the smaller communities on Lake Erie.

Crunch points for roadways, e.g. larger bridges, highway ramps ect. are prone to getting clogged or might be guarded and set off limits for official traffic. They would also be ridden with highwayman and pirates. One would definitely have to come up with an exit plan that might not necessarily allow for road travel.
Click to expand...

Using the current to move toward Lake Erie is also something I've thought of. Pirates on or near the water is another.

I live in what as known as the Downriver area, which means near the Detroit River but south of the Detroit. There are several streams that connect with the larger rivers in the area. Some aren't navagable by anything larger than a canoe and even that would require portaging over downed trees and shallow areas. Flood conditions would mean portage over several bridges.

Boats can be a blessing in some bug-out scenarios if waterways can get you to safety. Unfortunately, here, it also means traveling through some areas that might get you in trouble. Then again, bugging out on mountain bike, motorcycle, quad or 4X4 and using improvised roads would offer the same dangers when it comes to less-than-friendly folks doing their best to "acquire" your mode of transportation.
 
I live in the country if anyone tries to make me evacutae the 700 acre area where I live they will get shot. I have all the supplies I need and life would be way better for my friends and family than most everyone else.
 
ashtxsniper said:
I live in the country if anyone tries to make me evacutae the 700 acre area where I live they will get shot. I have all the supplies I need and life would be way better for my friends and family than most everyone else.
Click to expand...

Lucky guy ;)
 
Wow Neighbours guarding each others houses with guns in fear of roaming gangs, that must be a very scary place you live in. In all the natural disasters that have happened in this country we have pulled together and helped each other out. People tend to open up their homes, share what they have and not barricade them.
 
ashtxsniper said:
I live in the country if anyone tries to make me evacutae the 700 acre area where I live they will get shot. I have all the supplies I need and life would be way better for my friends and family than most everyone else.
Click to expand...

And your GPS co-ords are.... :D
 
xinel said:
Wow Neighbours guarding each others houses with guns in fear of roaming gangs, that must be a very scary place you live in. In all the natural disasters that have happened in this country we have pulled together and helped each other out. People tend to open up their homes, share what they have and not barricade them.
Click to expand...

People in Oz are just better people is all.
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/facts/2006/01_recorded_crime.html

There are approximately 21 million people in all of Australia's 2966368 square miles. In the U.S., there are 36,457,549 in California alone, 301,139,947 in the nation on 3537441 square miles. New York City packs 8.2 million residents within an area of 322 square miles.
 
Is is better to be out in the rural setting vs suburbia?

If many are evacuating and going by your rural location, you could be more of a target vs suburbia where you are one of the masses who instead could be hiding out with supplies.

Just playing devil's advocate here - it really comes down to the circumstances.
 
Quiet Bear said:
- it really comes down to the circumstances.
Click to expand...


Yes. What is the likely scope and duration of the event? Is the disaster localized? Statewide? Nationwide? Global? Manmade or natural? Biological, seismic or astrial? Does it affect water and food resources or transportation? Climate? A logical defense is based upon reasonable knowledge of the problem, or perceived or expected problem.

Codger
 
Another thing to remember is that you may or may not have a choice about where to go when SHTF. I don't mean agreeing/not agreeing to go with "the authorities" when they come to your door to take you to a camp; I mean even if you are able to retain some autonomy (by hiding out somewhere) you may find your later movements restricted, so you go from "wait and see" to "stuck here in [insert disaster area] indefinitely."

As I posted a while back, the Gretna incident after Katrina was a chilling recent example, as were the New Orleans gun confiscations. It might not take much for many of your plans and assumptions to become overwhelmed by events.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top