Why have locking single-blade folders replace stockman/barlow/pen style knives?

[pinnah]

Sorry, I don't buy this theory of people being "scared" of knives. I've pulled out karambits, I've pulled out big 5 inch bladed Cold Steel Voyagers, pulled out automatics, you know how many people were upset or scared by them? Not a one.

Perhaps we live in different places with different social norms. Or perhaps I'm more sensitive to how people are reacting around me and notice more. You don't have to buy that, or anything. I'm just noting, that for me, most traditionals create less social friction.

And I CAN open an Opinel or Sodbuster one handed, as long as I'm paying attention and being careful, but it's nowhere NEAR as easy OR as safe as, oh, literally ANY KNIFE with a thumbstud, flipper, or opening hole, not even freaking CLOSE.

If you can't open an Opinel or Sodbuster one handed safely, then perhaps you should stick to those safety scissors with the rounded tips. More likely, you are younger than I am by a matter of several decades and the fact that you never have gotten comfortable with traditionals makes them feel unsafe to you. <shrug> That's just your inexperience showing.

BTW, friction folders (Iike the Opinel) and slip joints (like the Sodbuster) are much safer and easier to CLOSE one handed.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

Perhaps we live in different places with different social norms. Or perhaps I'm more sensitive to how people are reacting around me and notice more. You don't have to buy that, or anything. I'm just noting, that for me, most traditionals create less social friction.

100% agree and it's why I always pair a traditional with a larger modern folder. People don't get scared of the larger folder, but they feel the need to make a comment or joke, just a nervous reminder that I've violated social norms by producing said knife. I find it annoying and a traditional A. Avoids that reaction 99% of the time B. Makes my EDC more versatile (much more versatile if it's a SAK I'm toting) and C. Gives me an excuse to buy, fondle and carry another knife.

 

[AreBeeBee]

Trads vs. mods is an eternal subject here, with no proven outcome in sight! Ya pays yer money; ya takes yer choice.

For me, I have both, but I notice that I tend to carry traditionals much more often, probably because I have used them since before Boy Scout days, now some 50 years in the past. However, I do like looks of some moderns: this will grate on some people here, but the ones I like most are Chinese-made and mostly by SanRenMu and Enlan. Go figure.

Anyway, what Pinnah says about social friction is quite true as a general rule, though it may not hold for some people's social circle. Also, I find two-handed opening eases the angst among the angst-prone, and this goes even with a modern knife.

Why? Thanks to Hollywood and TV, the on-screen act of flicking a knife open one-handed is instant video-speak for "sociopath". This association, which spreads wide and deep among the public, obviously doesn't hold in specific situations — construction sites, for example — where one-hand-opening knives are carried by most people on the site. But as a general rule for social situations, trads pass where mods don't.

Someday this may change, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[alewn]

I switched because the locker is a better weapon than the penknife. I can't always ccw a pistol, but the knife is almost never not on me, Unless I know that I'll have to pass thru a metal detector. Anybody who's going to be upset by my choice of blade is somebody I wont be hanging with, anyway.

 

[Hickory n steel]

I like that, puts into perspective some of the nonsense being touted as 'knife philosophy'. Saying this as someone who only carried a traditional.

My mom had a 2007 Hyundai with manual windows, so I'm sure there are even some 2016 cars in existence with manual windows.

 

[Hickory n steel]

The pocket clip and "so-called" better steels.
rolf

Exactly !
All I ever hear is better steels this or better steels that, and this has better steel.
Better is a relative term, why are modern super steels better ? They're not, it's just preference.

 

[Lycosa]

Yep.^ I'm happy with INFI or my Sodbuster.
rolf

 

[K.O.D.]

Traditional's have never really interested me. Just not my cup of tea I guess.

 

[Zidfeldts]

I have a lot of traditionals and a lot of modern folders. For anyone to say that modern steels aren't better than traditional is like saying a model T is as good as a new F150; it just ain't so. I don't think most of us need M390 or S90V rather than 1095 but they do surpass 1095 in every aspect of knife performance.

 

[Hickory n steel]

I have a lot of traditionals and a lot of modern folders. For anyone to say that modern steels aren't better than traditional is like saying a model T is as good as a new F150; it just ain't so. I don't think most of us need M390 or S90V rather than 1095 but they do surpass 1095 in every aspect of knife performance.

How easy are those modern steels to sharpen compared to 1095 ?
They both cut, so the only thing it could possibly do better is edge retention. And it can't possibly be just as easy to sharpen but hold it's considerably longer.

Better is still a relative term.
If you prefer edge retention then the modern Steel is better for you. I prefer a knife that's quick and easy to sharpen when it gets dull as all knives do, so 1095 is the best for me.

 

[sodak]

How easy are those modern steels to sharpen compared to 1095 ?
They both cut, so the only thing it could possibly do better is edge retention. And it can't possibly be just as easy to sharpen but hold it's considerably longer.

Better is still a relative term.
If you prefer edge retention then the modern Steel is better for you. I prefer a knife that's quick and easy to sharpen when it gets dull as all knives do, so 1095 is the best for me.

And the bias emerges.

I have knives in "modern steels" that not only hold an edge much longer than, say, 1095, but sharpen much faster. It's a complete myth that modern steels are hard to sharpen, unless their design is completely out of whack from the intended purpose.

This has been beaten to death here, why don't you try the search function.

That said, I still like and carry both, and if I were forced to choose, I'd carry a Vic SAK. Hands down.

 

[LowKey]

Perhaps we live in different places with different social norms. Or perhaps I'm more sensitive to how people are reacting around me and notice more. You don't have to buy that, or anything. I'm just noting, that for me, most traditionals create less social friction.



If you can't open an Opinel or Sodbuster one handed safely, then perhaps you should stick to those safety scissors with the rounded tips. More likely, you are younger than I am by a matter of several decades and the fact that you never have gotten comfortable with traditionals makes them feel unsafe to you. <shrug> That's just your inexperience showing.

BTW, friction folders (Iike the Opinel) and slip joints (like the Sodbuster) are much safer and easier to CLOSE one handed.

I agree that traditionals are a great option for more discreet use in public and that is one reason that I usually carry a traditional in addition to my modern folder outside of work.

It is true that a slipjoint is easier to close one handed. However, if closing a liner lock feels unsafe to you that is probably because you never took the time to get use to them and that is why it feels unsafe. That's ok though, its just your inexperience showing

 

[Hickory n steel]

And the bias emerges.

I have knives in "modern steels" that not only hold an edge much longer than, say, 1095, but sharpen much faster. It's a complete myth that modern steels are hard to sharpen, unless their design is completely out of whack from the intended purpose.

This has been beaten to death here, why don't you try the search function.

That said, I still like and carry both, and if I were forced to choose, I'd carry a Vic SAK. Hands down.

I'm pretty sure Steel has to be harder to hold an edge longer, so how can it be easier to remove material from a harder material ?

Either way I am one again stick by my statement that better is a relative term.

 

[sodak]

I'm pretty sure Steel has to be harder to hold an edge longer, so how can it be easier to remove material from a harder material ?

Either way I am one again stick by my statement that better is a relative term.

Because thickness is much more important than hardness when sharpening. Proper geometry and heat treat makes sharpening a trivial experience. 1095 at typical soft HRC's have me chasing a stupid burr all the time.

Now if you've ever tried 1095 at 65 HRC, you'd never go back to the 40/50's that you typically see. 1095 at 65 HRC will take you half the time to sharpen as 1095 at 55 HRC.

I'm not saying anything about "better", I'm arguing that "modern" steels are easier to sharpen than many of the "older" ones. Much, much easier and faster if the knife is properly made.

Check out this thread:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...based-on-Edge-Retention-cutting-5-8-quot-rope

Go down to the 400 grit section. See the knife at the top with 2400 cuts? That's my knife. Never takes more than a couple of minutes to go from completely dull to screaming sharp. Don't have to chase a burr either.

 

[BenchCo Spydermade]

I grew up on somewhat modern folders. My father carried the case version of a buck110 or a classic italian stiletto switchblade. He'd mostly carry the switchblade, but kept the case in the car and took it if we were camping or needed a worker knife. I barely considered a Swiss army knife or slip joint a knife. It was like a multi tool w blades. But they didn't lock and couldn't be opened with one hand, so they couldn't fulfil what I thought was the primary role of a knife; to be a weapon.

As I came to collect knives I realised that I always used them as tools and never as weapons. So I began to see how a slip joint could be useful, but still don't see how a slip joint benefits over a locking blade.

 

[Hickory n steel]

Because thickness is much more important than hardness when sharpening. Proper geometry and heat treat makes sharpening a trivial experience. 1095 at typical soft HRC's have me chasing a stupid burr all the time.

Now if you've ever tried 1095 at 65 HRC, you'd never go back to the 40/50's that you typically see. 1095 at 65 HRC will take you half the time to sharpen as 1095 at 55 HRC.

I'm not saying anything about "better", I'm arguing that "modern" steels are easier to sharpen than many of the "older" ones. Much, much easier and faster if the knife is properly made.

Check out this thread:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/s...based-on-Edge-Retention-cutting-5-8-quot-rope

Go down to the 400 grit section. See the knife at the top with 2400 cuts? That's my knife. Never takes more than a couple of minutes to go from completely dull to screaming sharp. Don't have to chase a burr either.

OK then.
I haven't experienced that with 1095 , but I haven't experienced all knives either. In the end All steels have their advantages, so it boils down to what we like best.

 

[James Y]

I've read some books as well as some forum posts where it's stated that stainless steels don't take as good an edge, and are harder to sharpen, than straight carbon steels. That could only be true if one's only experience with stainless were the cheap, chrome-stainless switchblades from the 1970s or so that could neither take nor keep a decent edge.

As far as 'modern' steels, I for one have found VG-10 and H1 a breeze to resharpen and put a great edge on. I've also had good results with S30V, 154CM, ATS-34, etc. I've actually had to completely reprofile some S30V and ATS-34 blades. Some older stainless steels that I've had great experiences with include Victorinox's steel and 440C. I've had mixed feelings/results with 420 HC. Keep in mind I'm not a 'master' sharpener.

I found my old carbon steel Schrades to also be very easy to resharpen.

As far as closing one-handed, I would strongly advise closing any Cold Steel Tri-Ad locking knife using both hands. I learned that lesson the hard way 13 months ago. I've never had a slip-joint pocketknife close on me. I've never had any issue one-hand closing any other modern one-handlers, though I'm extremely cautious and rarely do so anymore, except for my CRKs. None of my CRKs are so loose as to swing shut on my fingers, as there is no spring tension to pull them shut.

Jim

 

[stabman]

I have my Case Trapper in my hand right now, and if anyone says they can open it one-handed with thick gloves more easily than they could with a thumb-stud or opening hole, they are absolutely full of it.

It is okay to like the things you like, but don't make things up to try and justify your preference.

 

[22-rimfire]

I open most knives two handed except for assisted openers and the couple of flippers I have. In public/around regular folks, I'll open the assisted openers with two hands also. I generally am not fond of the flippers, but you can open them just like most any other knife. I generally have no need for auto knives. I do think many modern folding knives are easier to open than traditional slip joints.

I don't see much reason to argue about this topic. You either like traditional knives or you don't. I don't much care for thumbstuds because they catch on things. I have to be careful where I clip a modern knife as they also catch on things. But this doesn't mean I don't like modern knives. I am just selective.

 

[stabman]

You either like traditional knives or you don't.

Or you can like them in addition to "modern" knives.
I just like knives in general, except for the ones that suck (Mantis, I'm looking in your direction! ).
But as someone who uses knives, it becomes apparent quite quickly what the benefits of different designs are.

Some will argue that a quarter inch thick knife slices as well as one 1/16" thick, regardless of the type of material (they are wrong).
Others will argue equally silly things from the "traditional" side of the issue...and they are equally wrong.