Why have locking single-blade folders replace stockman/barlow/pen style knives?

Most don't dislike trads they tired of hearing how a 6 dollar knife is superior in every way.
 
I heard that in the past, some old-timers would put a matchstick (or a toothpick?) in the handle of their pocketknife so the blade wasn't completely closed; that would make one-hand opening their knife easier if they needed to get it open quickly or without detection. I suppose there were various tricks used to one-hand open common traditionals, but IMO most multi-bladed knives would be extremely difficult if not almost impossible to easily open one-handed, especially on any regular basis. In fact, I've never been able to one-hand any of my stock knives, trappers, peanuts, etc. I could two-hand open them much faster, easier and safer. I certainly wouldn't want to open my pocketknife with my teeth, as seen in the 1997 Titanic movie (lifeboats scene). I'm certain that one-handing a knife like an Opinel would be very doable.

Jim
 
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Sosa said:
Most don't dislike trads they tired of hearing how a 6 dollar knife is superior in every way.
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Would any real knife person claim a 6$ knife to be superior to something more serious ?

This whole time all I've been trying to say is that a particular Steel is only better if you think it is,and suits your needs better.
 
Not legal to carry everywhere, but seriously one of the best pure utility knives I've ever carried was an original microtech ultratech. Single edged. One hand opening. Out the front. Double action. Well made. Sharp. Good steel. Pocket clip. You can pull it out of the pocket, open it, cut whatever it is you are cutting, close it, and stow it back in the pocket faster and safer than any normal folding knife. There is no chance of cutting yourself during the opening and closing process. The lock failure mode does not involve the blade coming into contact with your hand. The action requires enough effort that it will never open accidentally in your pocket.

Too bad switches fell on the wrong side of the law or more people would be able to try them and see how convenient a well designed one can be, beyond the tacticool marketing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
LowKey said:
However, if closing a liner lock feels unsafe to you that is probably because you never took the time to get use to them and that is why it feels unsafe. That's ok though, its just your inexperience showing
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The danger of closing a liner lock ine handed is similar to that of closing a mid lock or lock back one handed. All of these designs require you to have your fingers across the well of the knife while you "break" the blade away from the lock. This is a well understood design issue with liner locks.
 
stabman said:
I have my Case Trapper in my hand right now, and if anyone says they can open it one-handed with thick gloves more easily than they could with a thumb-stud or opening hole, they are absolutely full of it.

It is okay to like the things you like, but don't make things up to try and justify your preference.
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I suspect you are reading things into what has been posted. Nobody has said that all traditional folders can be one hand opened. That is as wrong as saying that traditional folders can't be one hand opened.

Some can. Some can't. Depends on the design.

Folding hunters with clip point blades that have a big hump can be one hand opened easily. The Buck 110, Schrade LB7 and countless others fit this description.

Large Sodbuster style knives can be easily one hand opened.

And of course, most friction folders can be one hand opened.
 
pinnah said:
The danger of closing a liner lock ine handed is similar to that of closing a mid lock or lock back one handed. All of these designs require you to have your fingers across the well of the knife while you "break" the blade away from the lock. This is a well understood design issue with liner locks.
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When I first saw a liner lock I initially thought the same thing, however after practicing with one I realized that by moving my thumb out of the way I could safely close the knife. I honestly feel safer closing a liner lock one handed than I do going through the gymnastics of opening a traditional one handed, unless you're talking about a traditional like a one armed jack that truly is designed to be opened one handed. If the liner lock was so unsafe I'm pretty sure no one would be designing knives with them, especially in today's lawsuit happy society.
 
LowKey said:
When I first saw a liner lock I initially thought the same thing, however after practicing with one I realized that by moving my thumb out of the way I could safely close the knife. I honestly feel safer closing a liner lock one handed than I do going through the gymnastics of opening a traditional one handed, unless you're talking about a traditional like a one armed jack that truly is designed to be opened one handed. If the liner lock was so unsafe I'm pretty sure no one would be designing knives with them, especially in today's lawsuit happy society.
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One quick aside and I don't mean to pick on LowKey because a LOT of people do this whenever safety comes up. If I say X is safer than Y that statement doesn't at all imply that Y is unsafe, just that it's not AS safe as an alternative.
 
LowKey said:
When I first saw a liner lock I initially thought the same thing, however after practicing with one I realized that by moving my thumb out of the way I could safely close the knife. I honestly feel safer closing a liner lock one handed than I do going through the gymnastics of opening a traditional one handed, unless you're talking about a traditional like a one armed jack that truly is designed to be opened one handed. If the liner lock was so unsafe I'm pretty sure no one would be designing knives with them, especially in today's lawsuit happy society.
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I will readily admit that I have no clue how to one hand close a liner lock in a manner that doesn't put a finger or thumb in danger. If you could describe that in more detail or maybe point to a video that would be great.

Note: I'm cautious with mid and back locks for the same reason.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
One quick aside and I don't mean to pick on LowKey because a LOT of people do this whenever safety comes up. If I say X is safer than Y that statement doesn't at all imply that Y is unsafe, just that it's not AS safe as an alternative.
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I think in a round about way I am on the same page with you on this. I think you stated more clearly the point I was trying to make about liner locks, they might be LESS safe than other designs but that doesn't mean they are necessarily UNsafe especially if you recognize what make them less safe. :thumbup:
 
Pure convenience.

If it's inconvenient to operate and deploy. I won't use it

Also I remember as a kid I wasn't allowed to have a locking knife.

I've always thought of slipjoints as inferior tools as a kid.

I can appreciate them now though.

Case knives are beautiful.
 
pinnah said:
I will readily admit that I have no clue how to one hand close a liner lock in a manner that doesn't put a finger or thumb in danger. If you could describe that in more detail or maybe point to a video that would be great.

Note: I'm cautious with mid and back locks for the same reason.
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The key is to move your thumb out of the way before you close the blade all the way.......
 
I have not read through all the answers but I believe that answer is because most modern people are not outdoors men like those that carried a stockman or a hunter folding knife.

When was the last time you woke up and grabbed the shotgun and went out and hunter two or three rabbits and then cleaned them. Your modern knife can do the job but not as well.

The design of the stockman is for hunting pure and simple and most here do not hunt. We need just one blade for most of our chores. And the other older styles of blades were for agriculture.
 
LowKey said:
The key is to move your thumb out of the way before you close the blade all the way.......
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Sure. That's true with mid locks and lock backs too. The issue though is that you must hold the liner/frame open while you "break" the blade free of the lock and that means you're forcing a freely hinging blade towards your thumb. And if you get the least bit careless and the blade hangs up on the lock and then lets loose, the blade can swing shut quickly like a sling shot effect.

Every knife forum I've been on has pictures of folks who've been cut in this way.

IME, slip joints and friction folders are much safer one hand closing.
 
JamesofArc said:
I have not read through all the answers but I believe that answer is because most modern people are not outdoors men like those that carried a stockman or a hunter folding knife.

When was the last time you woke up and grabbed the shotgun and went out and hunter two or three rabbits and then cleaned them. Your modern knife can do the job but not as well.

The design of the stockman is for hunting pure and simple and most here do not hunt. We need just one blade for most of our chores. And the other older styles of blades were for agriculture.
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The folding hunter, trapper, muskrat & probably some others were designed for hunters.
The Stockman was made for people looking after livestock. Skinning was part of it, but it has a spey blade for castrating & a sheepsfoot for paring & pushcuts. Not really a hunting specific knife.
 
pinnah said:
Sure. That's true with mid locks and lock backs too. The issue though is that you must hold the liner/frame open while you "break" the blade free of the lock and that means you're forcing a freely hinging blade towards your thumb. And if you get the least bit careless and the blade hangs up on the lock and then lets loose, the blade can swing shut quickly like a sling shot effect.

Every knife forum I've been on has pictures of folks who've been cut in this way.

IME, slip joints and friction folders are much safer one hand closing.
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Every knife forum I'm on has plenty of pictures of people injured by slipjoints as well. ;) The problem is that we lack data on frequency and severity of injuries. And reducing modern knives to all liner and framelocks effectively ignores the many, many modern folders that lock open and can be easily closed without placing any body parts in the path of the blade. The huge advantage modern knives have over traditionals is, I think, in the very nature of the two. Modern knives are free to evolve. You can't make a new traditional. It's a contradiction in terms. Traditionals tend to have the edge in terms of cutting geometry, but there's no rules stopping a modern knife maker from matching it whereas if you want a stockman with a quarter inch blade, you're out of luck.

I still think traditionals are more than enough for the vast majority of us and, if the hardcore adherents of modern knives were forced to 'get by' with traditionals they would be just fine 99% of the time, but embracing innovation has some serious advantages.
 
pinnah said:
Sure. That's true with mid locks and lock backs too. The issue though is that you must hold the liner/frame open while you "break" the blade free of the lock and that means you're forcing a freely hinging blade towards your thumb. And if you get the least bit careless and the blade hangs up on the lock and then lets loose, the blade can swing shut quickly like a sling shot effect.

Every knife forum I've been on has pictures of folks who've been cut in this way.

IME, slip joints and friction folders are much safer one hand closing.
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If they have a half stop or if you close it against your leg then a slipjoint can be safer ( but certainly not without a half stop )
I know it's about convenience, but is putting your knife away quickly really that big of a deal ? I certainly like the ability to close my knife more quickly, but don't care one way or the other weather a knife promotes it and won't risk cutting myself in order to do so.
 
pinnah said:
Sure. That's true with mid locks and lock backs too. The issue though is that you must hold the liner/frame open while you "break" the blade free of the lock and that means you're forcing a freely hinging blade towards your thumb. And if you get the least bit careless and the blade hangs up on the lock and then lets loose, the blade can swing shut quickly like a sling shot effect.

Every knife forum I've been on has pictures of folks who've been cut in this way.

IME, slip joints and friction folders are much safer one hand closing.
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Based on my personal experience I feel like the danger of closing various locking knives one handed is overstated. Based on my personal experience I also feel that the danger of a slip joint closing on your hand during use is overstated. At the end of the day regardless of style all knives are dangerous to use to some extent. The cool thing is that now days a person has an almost overwhelming selection of knives regardless of the style they prefer.
 
mtangent said:
The folding hunter, trapper, muskrat & probably some others were designed for hunters.
The Stockman was made for people looking after livestock. Skinning was part of it, but it has a spey blade for castrating & a sheepsfoot for paring & pushcuts. Not really a hunting specific knife.
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Right tool, right job... :thumbup:

Insipid Moniker said:
Every knife forum I'm on has plenty of pictures of people injured by slipjoints as well. ;) The problem is that we lack data on frequency and severity of injuries. And reducing modern knives to all liner and framelocks effectively ignores the many, many modern folders that lock open and can be easily closed without placing any body parts in the path of the blade. The huge advantage modern knives have over traditionals is, I think, in the very nature of the two. Modern knives are free to evolve. You can't make a new traditional. It's a contradiction in terms. Traditionals tend to have the edge in terms of cutting geometry, but there's no rules stopping a modern knife maker from matching it whereas if you want a stockman with a quarter inch blade, you're out of luck.
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Exactly, very well stated, many modern knives are not job specific like a traditional, a Harness Jack is meant to do leather work like repair the harnessing a rancher or farmer would have used to connect his horse/oxen to farm implements and carriages. This is patently obvious in the design. What's the specific job of a ZT 0808, lets look at their description:

The Zero Tolerance 0808 is our latest piece of pocket technology. It's a collaboration between ZT and custom knifemaker Todd Rexford and is based on his Cesium model. But the technology here isn’t circuits and wires. Instead, it’s advanced-formula stainless steel and ZT’s smooth-as-silk KVT opening system.

The 0808’s blade is built of Crucible S35VN stainless steel. This powdered metallurgy steel is extremely fine-grained so it can be sharpened to a razor edge. Added niobium and nitrogen enhance toughness to resist chipping and provide excellent edge retention. Yet it’s also easy to re-sharpen.

Opening is fast and simple with KVT. Caged ball bearings surround the pivot to make the blade quick and easy to open using the built-in flipper. With KVT, the 0808 is as easy to open as any assisted knife, but without the need for a spring.

The 0808’s blade is paired with chamfered titanium handles that provide a solid, and very durable, grip. The sturdy frame lock has a hardened steel lockbar insert to offer extra-secure, extra-solid blade lock up. The reversible pocketclip enables you to carry comfortably left- or right-handed. Move over, iPhone. The 0808 deserves pocket space

I still think traditionals are more than enough for the vast majority of us and, if the hardcore adherents of modern knives were forced to 'get by' with traditionals they would be just fine 99% of the time, but embracing innovation has some serious advantages.
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If I was looking through a knife catalog, other than it having bearings, bein' a collaboration knife and a fast flipper I still have no idea what it was designed to do. Now having one and puttin' a more acute angle it becomes an excellent slicer, the needle like point is great for cuttin' gasket material the fairly flat blade is great for scrapin' and it would make a reasonable SD tool in a few ways but it's not specifically designed to anything except relieve your pockets of your money. That's not to say it's not a great knife, it is and it's extremely well made but in the end it's a knife meant to cut and for that job with a little reprofilin' of the blade excels at a job it was OK at before.
 
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