WIP Massive Titanium Roller Bearing Frame Lock

I certainly like to use thin blades in my liner locking folders, be they like the more common looking ones (?) or tactical (?) looking ones, however a blade thickness of .127 does seem in my opinion, thin for the knife your are masking. Great planning ,for sure, and I always like to do that myself. Frank
 
Frank Niro said:
I certainly like to use thin blades in my liner locking folders, be they like the more common looking ones (?) or tactical (?) looking ones, however a blade thickness of .127 does seem in my opinion, thin for the knife your are masking. Great planning ,for sure, and I always like to do that myself. Frank
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Will stated that he was buying .27 stock, not .127, to make a finished .25" (1/4") thick blade.
 
Will,

Two more thoughts:

1) The Choil on the blade should have some jimping to protect the finger from sliding forward.

2) The configuration is blade up. Knives this size are often blade down because of difficulties in keeping the heavy blade from opening in the pocket.
 
MountainBilly said:
Will,

Two more thoughts:

1) The Choil on the blade should have some jimping to protect the finger from sliding forward.

2) The configuration is blade up. Knives this size are often blade down because of difficulties in keeping the heavy blade from opening in the pocket.
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Good observations. I will definitely think about choil jimping when handling the prototype. As to blade retention, I always prefer a tip up draw on flippers (right hander here, sorry lefties). A heavy blade can be a problem with a 1/16" detent ball. I will be using a larger 3/32" detent ball for better retention without an uncomfortable amount of force required to deploy the blade with the flipper.
 
blackcatt said:
I haven't used 4v yet but I have used V4E a few times and in real life it is much more wear resistant. It can be hardened really high(63+) with good toughness where 60 is near tops with 3v. I'm not making an argument for using or not using the steel just sharing my experiences.
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I don't have experience with 4V either but I have handled some of Jerry Hossom's work in 3V and I was really impressed. I think CPM 3V is gonna be the ticket Aldo has .270"x36"x6" bars for $385. That meets my goals for an excellent performance steel at the cost per unit price i need to be at to make a profit.

I should receive the blanks tomorrow from Alabama so stay tuned for an update.
 
WilliamWoods said:
Why go with CPM-4V? 3V has a ton more toughness and only slightly worse wear resistance. 3V is also more stain resistant with 7.5% chromium vs 5% in 4V.
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Well, I already have a 5.5" 4mm 3V folder and a 4.5" 3/16" M4 folder, so that's my personal reason for looking for variety. I also don't worry about stain resistance, so again no personal incentive to want 3V in this knife. But, you are looking to satisfy the most people, not me :)

4V is more wear resistant than 3V and tougher than M4, so it looks to be a nice middle ground. The toughness of 3V is a lot, the force needed to peen a lock face or the cups where the stop pins rest is not a lot. S30V blades have taken the beatings that create sloppy lockup, so 3V does not address a 'weak link'. So a longer wearing edge and a more impact resistant microstructure is a good thing, imho. I'd like to see how 4V does in Bladesports, 3V hasn't shown the success M4 has there.
 
The water jet parts came in today! They look perfect, all dimensions are just a hair undersized just how i like it. I'll get the holes reamed true this weekend and counter-bore the blade for the bearings.

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really lookin' good. can't wait to see your grinds on that blade! hope I am able to sneak in on one of these... (second time mentioning.. not concerned at all! :D )
 
i would love for this baby to have elmax or m4 or m390 if we are talking super steels

but honestly i dont know how much of a price difference it will make or the range we are talking about but i am fine with 5160 and a good heat treat if i am going to pay less for it

however if this is already a $350 dollar knife with 5160 and i can get m4 or elmax for 375 or 400 well then guess what i want

i dont know if its possible but options are good

and no s35 or s30 please i am so sick and tired of them and they dont perform THAT well

also on a flipper knife it should have a choil from the flipper so i DO NOT need or want jimping i find that it just tears my hands up and a choil is much more secure
 
sloth357 said:
really lookin' good. can't wait to see your grinds on that blade! hope I am able to sneak in on one of these... (second time mentioning.. not concerned at all! :D )
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Don't worry. If you want one that bad I'll make sure and alert interested parties the moment I'm ready to do the pre-order.

tacdriver22mk2 said:
i would love for this baby to have elmax or m4 or m390 if we are talking super steels

but honestly i dont know how much of a price difference it will make or the range we are talking about but i am fine with 5160 and a good heat treat if i am going to pay less for it

however if this is already a $350 dollar knife with 5160 and i can get m4 or elmax for 375 or 400 well then guess what i want

i dont know if its possible but options are good

and no s35 or s30 please i am so sick and tired of them and they dont perform THAT well

also on a flipper knife it should have a choil from the flipper so i DO NOT need or want jimping i find that it just tears my hands up and a choil is much more secure
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As to the first production steel, I will not be making several different versions with different steels just yet. Multiple steels is a nightmare for water jet and heat treat fees when your profit margin is "conservative" at best. Yes this will be made in a modern high quality steel. 5160 is just the prototype steel. I'm not saying 5160 is bad or inferior. But when you spend this much time making the knife with the quality materials in the slabs and hardware why cheap out on the blade? 5160 is a fantastic forging steel and is amazingly tough with the right heat treat BUT tool steels like CMP 3V, D2, and M4 hold an edge longer AND retain the toughness of 5160 AND have increased corrosion resistance.

And yes i agree with you about S30v. It's really kind of overdone and expensive. A decent performer for sure but i believe the blade shape, grind style, and finished edge has more to do with cutting performance than tiny changes in alloy.

M4 is a fantastic suggestion. My only issue is availability and price, M4 is a wee bit difficult to source in .25"+ thickness. I usually give my business to Aldo at NJSteelBaron or AlphaKnifeSupply or AdmiralSteel because they can supply dimensionally appropriate sized steel.

Getting your $$ worth on a water jet is all about nesting the cut lines as close as possible on one large sheet. I'm not a huge operation so i really can't deal with Crucible Industries directly. My order just wouldn't be large enough. If I have to buy multiple smaller bars in an exotic steel I'm wasting good steel by leaving a ton of water jet trash behind. Same issues apply to the Ti slabs. Buying the right material in the right size for your fabrication method is the difference between a profit and charity.

As of now I'm leaning toward 3V but I'm open to discussion/suggestions.
 
This is very cool. Very over-built, I love it, should be a helluva user.

Going with a beefier detent then too I assume? That's a heavy blade you will be trying to hold back... Looking forward to seeing this develop :thumbup:
 
Maybe try getting in touch with Niagara for drop-offs if the CPM steel you want isn't stocked by those others listed. I got CPM154 and 154CM drops from them. You wouldn't have any trouble moving these knives in 3V. Cruwear, PD #1, Vanadis 4 or 6, DC-53, A8 mod, Sleipner, Viking, they would all probably also go fairly well.

I personally have no love for D2. Better wear, toughness, and corrosion resistance comes from CPM154, S30V, S35VN, Elmax, M390, 20CP, B75P, 20CV, XHP.

I posted my interest thinking the steel was going to be 5160, as did several others - so you're probably good to go either way.
 
I've followed everything so far with this folder, and it is looking awesome! I would prefer a tip down for a flipper, but I understand if that's just not possible. Either way I want to be put on your list, like everyone else, pending cost.
 
ceptor781 said:
Like where this is heading! Please add me to the list for the run. Awesome work!
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Ramiel said:
I've followed everything so far with this folder, and it is looking awesome! I would prefer a tip down for a flipper, but I understand if that's just not possible. Either way I want to be put on your list, like everyone else, pending cost.
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Both on the list. I'll contact you when I'm ready to do the pre-order thread.

OK so an update! Got out my .249 cobalt reamer and reamed the pivots and thumb stud holes on both the blade and slabs. 5160 machined like butter but the .190 Ti was a real slow process. I went ahead and ordered an undersize .249 solid carbide reamer so the production models go a lot easier. Checked my work with the trusty caliper and its perfect! .2495 on the blade and the slabs opened up a hair to .25" dead.

Next I'll counter bore the pockets for the bearing system... stay tuned.

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Very cool thread. Inspiring to see all the work that goes into something like this. Can't wait to see the final product. Please put me on your list if possible (pending final cost of course ;) ). I'll stay tuned. Cheers.
 
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