A local guy offered to sell me these knives....

"Surgical" isn't the name of an actual steel type. So arguing about whether it's a good steel or not seems a bit silly. ;)

In real-life though, surgical blades are disposable. And the label "surgical steel" is used by low-end knife brands because they don't want to say (or don't even know) what type of steel their knives are made from.
 
They certainly look nice, but when have you heard of a knife made with "surgical steel" being quality?
 
Chipaway cutlery is one of frosts brands. They sell those same knives on the late night show for the low low price of 10 dollars or so. Sometimes, when Tom O'Dell is feeling frisky, he'll let em go for less than 5 dollars! Don't let Jim know!:eek:
 
Chipaway cutlery is one of frosts brands. They sell those same knives on the late night show for the low low price of 10 dollars or so. Sometimes, when Tom O'Dell is feeling frisky, he'll let em go for less than 5 dollars! Don't let Jim know!:eek:

I got my wife to watch Cutlery Corner one night with me.
We both laughed a whole bunch, and she asked "Does anyone actually buy that garbage?"
 
I'm sorry, i know i don't know you and please try to see this as i do- from the outside?

But......you just told a guy to "read more and post less" while you have 15,691 posts?

You've got to see the irony in that......honestly, i'm not trying to be rude; it just made me LOL ;-)

They key difference being that Marcinek knows what he's talking about....
 
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I like them knives according photographs, "Surgical steel is code for garbage " I wouldn't be too sure of this, as genuine surgical steel is definitely not anything close to garbage.... Hospitals and surgeons doesn't use garbage steel, when these blades are cutting human body in order to save it's life....

Pictures however can not do good justice to us,you have access to blades,why not try them before the purchase...

No quick judgment is worth any judgment...if he is genuine guy, he will let you use at least one of them on wood....try re-sharpening, maybe it is worth it.Knives are looking good, but that's not something anyone can say based on pictures what the knife is made of....

Maybe it is garbage,but maybe they will last forever in your service and you may never regret the purchase.

Too many guys judging too quickly here is my opinion...

You are one special snowflake...
 
For the record:

I am professionally involved in surgeries. Our disposable surgical scalpels are commonly made from AUS-8 stainless steel. This is comparable to your 13C26 and AEB-L or 440B stainless steels. Would any of you throw away knives made from such steel? Is it "garbage"? Buck's 420HC is considered "inferior" to these steels. We throw away the scalpel blades after the surgery is over, i.e. we continue using the blade to cut what needs to be cut until either the blade is dull or it becomes "contaminated" (non-sterile), and rarely is dullness the concern. We do not bother washing and resharpening/reusing the blades NOT because we couldn't but because we don't have to and it is cheaper to simply use a new one.

Oh, and for those interested, the manufacturer states that the scalpels are sharpened at 15-20 dps to the apex.


Our NON-KNIFE tools are commonly made from stuff more akin to 420J steel.
When Gerber lists "surgical stainless", you can contact their CS-reps to learn what steel they happen to be using currently in that model - they commonly use 7Cr13 (chinese) or 440A or 420HC when listing "surgical stainless". Knives coming out of Pakistan are almost always graded as 420J steel. A neighbor owns a hardware store and sells knives imported directly from his brother-in-law in Pakistan, was told that they are made from 420J stainless steel. They sharpen very easily and hold an edge about as well as a tin can.
 
There is nothing wrong with surgical steel as such as long as the term is used correctly. Randall knives are 440B and I don't hear too many complaints there. 420 steel as used by Buck is generally pretty good. They seem to have the proper heat treat nailed down pretty good. Elsewhere not so much.
 
There is nothing wrong with surgical steel as such as long as the term is used correctly. Randall knives are 440B and I don't hear too many complaints there. 420 steel as used by Buck is generally pretty good. They seem to have the proper heat treat nailed down pretty good. Elsewhere not so much.
Surgical steel doesn't mean steel used in cutting instruments during surgery. It could very well be the steel of forceps or staples. It would still be surgical steel.

Zero
 
Surgical steel doesn't mean steel used in cutting instruments during surgery. It could very well be the steel of forceps or staples. It would still be surgical steel.

Zero

Um, yeah we covered that bit already. See post #22 above

Hence "as long as the term is used correctly"
 
Um, yeah we covered that bit already. See post #22 above

Hence "as long as the term is used correctly"

Yes... the term WOULD be used correctly for 420j2, or whatever. It is steel, of the same grade as used in surgery. It isn't labeled "Surgical scalpel steel", but "surgical steel". Thus the term is correctly used if it is the same steel used in any instrument during surgery. In fact, if it was the same steel used for the used instrument pan, for the wheels on the cart, etc. it is still correct.

I was responding to your post without having read the one above it, where you tried to limit the idea that "surgical steel" is only correct terminology in reference to 440B class steel- it's not.
Zero
 
Yes... the term WOULD be used correctly for 420j2, or whatever. It is steel, of the same grade as used in surgery. It isn't labeled "Surgical scalpel steel", but "surgical steel". Thus the term is correctly used if it is the same steel used in any instrument during surgery. In fact, if it was the same steel used for the used instrument pan, for the wheels on the cart, etc. it is still correct.

I was responding to your post without having read the one above it, where you tried to limit the idea that "surgical steel" is only correct terminology in reference to 440B class steel- it's not.
Zero

Thats not what I said. No limitation was implied. Just a couple examples of use.

Used correctly as in proper description of the knife. Not used to imply a superior product.
 
For the record:

I am professionally involved in surgeries. Our disposable surgical scalpels are commonly made from AUS-8 stainless steel. This is comparable to your 13C26 and AEB-L or 440B stainless steels. Would any of you throw away knives made from such steel? Is it "garbage"? Buck's 420HC is considered "inferior" to these steels. We throw away the scalpel blades after the surgery is over, i.e. we continue using the blade to cut what needs to be cut until either the blade is dull or it becomes "contaminated" (non-sterile), and rarely is dullness the concern. We do not bother washing and resharpening/reusing the blades NOT because we couldn't but because we don't have to and it is cheaper to simply use a new one.

Oh, and for those interested, the manufacturer states that the scalpels are sharpened at 15-20 dps to the apex.


Our NON-KNIFE tools are commonly made from stuff more akin to 420J steel.
When Gerber lists "surgical stainless", you can contact their CS-reps to learn what steel they happen to be using currently in that model - they commonly use 7Cr13 (chinese) or 440A or 420HC when listing "surgical stainless". Knives coming out of Pakistan are almost always graded as 420J steel. A neighbor owns a hardware store and sells knives imported directly from his brother-in-law in Pakistan, was told that they are made from 420J stainless steel. They sharpen very easily and hold an edge about as well as a tin can.

Your scalpel manufacturer readily provides the steel type used. That is good, as well as what should be expected in a GOOD/RELIABLE manufacturer/supplier.

The problem with the use of the "surgical" reference on knives is simply one of hype, deception and/or obfuscation. "Surgical Steel" was a euphemism for stainless steel. The first attempts at "making" stainless or rather "acid resistant steel" was in the 1820s. Scientists had already noted that steel with chromium was more resistant to corrosion from exposure to acids. Attempts were made at improvements over the next several decades. Kind of a 2 steps forward and 3 steps back kind of thing. Stainless steel wasn't even defined until 1911.

The first "true" stainless steel was allegedly first produced in 1913, although it may have been successfully made even earlier, before the "standardized definition". Various industries pushed for the development of a "rustless" steel - ship builders, gun makers, cutlers, and more.

Now, to "surgical steel". After stainless steel formulation was developed and how to HT it figured out, steel makers needed customers to justify making it. One of the areas was knife and razor cutlers, especially razor makers, who tended to make scalpels as well. Back then, shavers and surgeons didn't have disposable razors and scalpels. They re-sharpened and re-used them. A lot. They also rusted. Touting the properties of stainless steel, cutlers started making razors and scalpels. After stainless steel scalpels took off, cutlers started trying to sell more knives. DUH!! :D:D

Here is where the term "surgical steel" raises its "ugly" head. It was used as a MARKETING term for the sales pitches by salesmen trying to hawk other kinds of cutlery.

"Hey, look. This knife is made out of the same stuff as surgeon's scalpels, so you just KNOW its gotta be sharp. How many knives can I put you down for?"

Thus was born the term "surgical steel". This was back when it really was meant to be a good term. As time went on, steel formulations changed. Salesmen didn't. They will still use whatever words they need to sell things. Starting in the 50s and early 60s, "cheap" knives from Japan started showing up. Their HT sucked. So therefore the knives sucked. The use of "surgical steel" on the ricasso stamps started showing up in an attempt to "prove" to customers that the knives were good.

This lead other cutlers to start advertising what steel was used in their knives to differentiate themselves from the "Made in Japan" or "Made in Taiwan" junk. You young'uns probably don't remember or even know that during the 50s and 60s and even into the early 70s, "Made in Japan" and "Made in Taiwan" had the same connotation as "Made in China" and "Made in Pakistan" and "Made in India" does now. It meant cheap crap, no quality, worthless, along with other, less PG rated language.

Many, if not most, knives stamped "surgical steel" or "surgical stainless" or "surgical stainless steel" now-a-days are either made with "mystery steel" meaning it's a mystery as to how it could be considered steel or the HT used is atrocious, or both.

Japan have overcome and Taiwan the "Made in Japan/Taiwan" stigma by improving their quality control and increased their workers wages. The prices to have goods manufactured there necessarily had to go up as well. Companies wanting to still make money on cheaply priced goods moved their production to China/Pakistan/India.

Without getting into a bunch of political claptrap, ANY company that still stamps "surgical", surgical steel" or "surgical stainless" into a knife is hiding something. All they are doing is trying to fool the unwary/unknowing into believing that they are getting something "good", which they aren't.

The term "surgical steel" started out as a piece of marketing bull shit. Nothing has changed. It still is marketing bull shit.
 
Rule #1) Never meet up with a girl from Craigslist.

Rule #2) Never buy a knife from Craigslist.

Rule #3) Never go to Craigslist.

That's ridiculous!!!! I mean if she's got really big tits and a great ass, dude, c'mon?!?


Yes, I'm still reading and learning. I guess I haven't seen anything labeled "surgical" steel since I was a kid. I only own a few fixed blade knives, all Cold Steel pretty much, so this is a new territory for me. Learn something every day, especially when you ask what may seem like dumb questions.
 
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