A Poll - Is Pre-Selling At A Knifeshow...??

Is Pre-Selling To Dealers At A Knife Show

  • OK?

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Not OK?

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    0
Like I tell the kids at work...I'll play any game, any way, as long as I know the rules before we start.
Thursday night sales, VIP early passes, pre-selling has been going on for a long time. Basically those are the rules. Now make the rules work for you, instead of trying to change the way the (Knife) world works.
I only go to the 2 local shows here in NYC. Someday I'll get to Blade, my daughter in college comes first.
So, if I had the $ and the overwhelming desire to own one of Maker X's knives, I'd do my best to 'schmooze' Maker X, make myself available to be in the position to meet him Thursday night, pick him up from the airport, offer to carry his bags...make the 'rules' work for me.
Realistically, I don't have that overwhelming desire (or the $$$ :( ) to buy any knife.
I do my homework, and more importantly, I buy what I like from people who I like.

Instead of damming the river go with the flow. And if you *really* hate those that pre-sell, don't buy from them (or the dealers that they sell to).
Oh yeah, one note about the dealers buying MakerX's wonder knives...at least the dealer will offer them up for sale, eventually. If I get it, it stays in the collection.
 
Personally, I don't have a problem with pre-show sales, as long as the makers leaves a certain percentage of his of inventory available to the general public(just as a courtesy).

It's not fun to find out the game's over, before you've even had a chance to suit up.
 
First off, let me congratulate bandaidman on summing up my feelings on this dilemma. I understand makers have to make a living, and certainly would in no way want to interfere with someone's financial stability. But the bottom line is that the collector is the final customer, whether he buys it from a dealer or from the maker himself. If the maker chooses to piss off potential customers, so be it. It's a mistake that they WILL eventually feel, financially.

Although I am no Don Guild, I have collected roughly $65,000 worth of custom knives in the last 3 years. That gentlemen is not "chump change". There are a number of makers whom I refuse to buy from, either directly, or from a dealer, even though I really admire their work, and can now afford it.
Why is that? BECAUSE they did something that REALLY pissed me off! It is a short but very distinguished list.

There are some dealers that have knives that I would buy, at reasonable prices occaisionally, but I spend my money elsewhere. Care to guess why? :rolleyes:

One solution to this dilemma is to do what some makers do and stipulate to the dealer that the knife must stay with the maker through the show, even though it is pre-sold. At least then you can really appreciate the design, and craftmanship before you plunk down $1,500-$3,000, and place an order.

Now look at it from my end, a fairly serious collector who has a "real job". I am very much like a knifemaker in what I do, I work for "piece work". I read a case , and do a report and (usually) get paid for it. Of course, after I pay my overhead. You know the little things like office space, business manager and secretarial salaries, computers, 80 grand in malpractice insurance, payroll taxes, accounting and legal fees, billing costs, etc., etc., etc.

When I take a day off or two to got to a knife show, I'm not generating any income to pay for my hobby. Unlike the maker, WHO IS! He is promoting himself and selling his product. Even though he is not actually making knives at the time. Now, I worked it out that if I'm off in NY for a Friday opening show, it costs me about $2,000 or more in lost income just to attend, not including lodging, travel and the aggravation factor.

So, if I'm really interested in placing an order, or buying a knife directly from a maker, and all he has to show me are some photos he could have e-mailed me, or that I can see on a dealer's web site, would you be a little pissed off? :confused:
 
Excellent observations Steve, and I couldn't agree more! But I guess when you really look at the basic question being asked in the poll, "Is it fair for makers to pre-sell their knives to dealers at knife shows", the "fair" issue depends on perspective. From the maker's and dealer's perspective the practice is "fair", but for the collector that pays his admission fee and gets squat, it sure isn't fair. But then again, life ain't fair and it never will be, so I'm quite sure the practice will continue with some makers and some dealers. However, I sincerely hope though that the practice doesn't turn off prospective collectors and causes a decline in the overall knife collecting experience.

To me, going to a custom knife show and seeing pictures of knives on a table in front of the maker is like paying $100 for a ticket for a Pavarotti concert, and instead of hearing him sing live, you get to listen to his CD while he sells them at a table in the lobby.

The next thing ya know we'll have makers with just cardboard cutouts of themselves in front of thier table with pictures of thier knives and continuous playing videos of thier shop and them at work! ;) :rolleyes:

Rant complete for the time being.
 
Frank, I had already mentioned the pictures and DVD player earlier in one of these many same topic threads. That's my plan.
Just ain't no way I can make that many knives in my spare time, even if I started now for the next Blade show. :D
 
Hey Kit,
Don't get me wrong. I've got no beef with any maker that sells out once the doors fly open cuz I've encountered that myself at the BAKCA show several times with dozens of bodies ahead of me scarffing up the remaining custom folders on a table, but to not have any kind of shot at all at handling or even seeing a real knife from a maker in the first 5 minutes of a show because there ain't none there, is a major bummer and surely is a legitimate cause to bitch for a collector. Hey, I know I can't change the practice, but my vote and opinion on the subject was asked for and that's how I see it. But please don't do the cardboard cutout of yourself thing!;)
 
Hey guys, while waiting for the next wave of arguments to roll in check this out. This is amazing!
This is what it's all about... stuff like this.
Posted by SharpByCoop in the Gallery.
orig.jpg
 
You guys and your DVD/video comments are really crackin me up....:D
 
Kit, that's Curly from the Three Stooges. He wasn't scary at all.

RWS, that's a nice knife, but I think it could be a little fancier (just kidding).
 
I put this response in the other pre-selling thread as well.

Bastid said:
Sounds like sour grapes with no basis for reality to me.

... (Which still boils down to telling a maker how to conduct their business.) :rolleyes:.
Click to expand...
Actually, these complaints, by me anyway, aren't born out of sour grapes. Maybe pollyanna, but not sour grapes. I have no problem waiting for a knife to be made for me by a maker. I have a problem with going to a show and not having a chance to see the knives certain makers brought to the show that would have made it to his table if they had not been pre-sold before the show doors opened.

Secondly, The other side can also be accused of telling makers how they should run their business.

Isn't one side advocating the pre-selling of knife show inventory and the other side advocating not pre-selling that same inventory? If one side is accused of telling a maker how to run his business how is it the other side can't be accused of the same thing?

Aren't both sides suggesting what the makers should do and not do? If one side of the argument can be accused of telling them how to run their business, how is it possible that the other side can't be accused of the same thing?

One side may argue that the other side of the argument is against the will of the maker.
But, which side is that? Which side is against the true will of the maker?

Are we sure that deep down inside these in demand makers wouldn't truly rather keep their knife show inventory at their table for full retail sale to the showgoing public instead of being approached by a dealer and, out of some awkward sense of obligation to sell those knives, he does so at a discount. Whose side of the argument is really taking money out of the makers pocket?

My suggestions are based purely on my belief that these makers I'm referring to can sell out pretty regularly at most of the shows they attend. I may be wrong.
If I am wrong in this regard, then I think I agree that pre-selling is OK with the hopes of the maker being allowed to keep them at his table through the end of the day Saturday (not Sunday). However, I think I'm right about this, so no pre-sells! :D
 
I can deal with Curly, but that other dude was scary. Thanks for changing it back. I hate to have nightmares :)
 
I guess there are three sides then. I don't think any of us are in a legitimate position to tell a maker when to sell their knives or who to sell them to.
 
I don't believe anyone is TELLING makers to do or not to do anything. This is merely an opinion poll. The makers and dealers will continue to do whatever they please. However, the opinions expressed may be usefull to them, and hearing the other side of an issue always makes good common sense. Perhaps just talking about the issue will produce ideas that can be advantageous to all involved. ;)

Best,
Frank
 
FrankDL said:
I don't believe anyone is TELLING makers to do or not to do anything. This is merely an opinion poll. The makers and dealers will continue to do whatever they please. However, the opinions expressed may be usefull to them, and hearing the other side of an issue always makes good common sense. Perhaps just talking about the issue will produce ideas that can be advantageous to all involved. ;)

Best,
Frank
Click to expand...

Now just wait a minute Frank, are you trying to tell me that you think we should be able to freely discuss our views on aspects of the custom knife idustry? Just what do you think this is - a custom knife discussion forum or something?? :confused: :rolleyes: :p ;)

Instead of wasting bandwidth with an inappropriately rational post, why not just go beat the holy crap out of some stupid, silly, ridiculous whining cheesedick instead. There, now that's the spirit. :cool:

Roger
 
RogerP said:
Now just wait a minute Frank, are you trying to tell me that you think we should be able to freely discuss our views on aspects of the custom knife idustry? Just what do you think this is - a custom knife discussion forum or something?? :confused: :rolleyes: :p ;)

Instead of wasting bandwidth with an inappropriately rational post, why not just go beat the holy crap out of some stupid, silly, ridiculous whining cheesedick instead. There, now that's the spirit. :cool:

Roger
Click to expand...
ROTFLMFAO!

EDITED TO ADD
I'm not really sure what ROTFLMFAO means except I'm pretty sure it means that was funny!
 
RogerP said:
Now just wait a minute Frank, are you trying to tell me that you think we should be able to freely discuss our views on aspects of the custom knife idustry? Just what do you think this is - a custom knife discussion forum or something?? :confused: :rolleyes: :p ;)

Instead of wasting bandwidth with an inappropriately rational post, why not just go beat the holy crap out of some stupid, silly, ridiculous whining cheesedick instead. There, now that's the spirit. :cool:

Roger
Click to expand...

Roger,
I already beat up three Kerry supporters that came to my door about an hour ago. That pleasurable experience cause me to have a temporary moment of weakness causing me to post that inappropriate rational post. Please forgive me :D Whoops, gotta go..time for my meds! ;)
 
RWS said:
ROTFLMFAO!

EDITED TO ADD
I'm not really sure what ROTFLMFAO means except I'm pretty sure it means that was funny!
Click to expand...


RWS-

ROTFLMFAO = Rolling on the floor laughing my fuc**** ass off! :D
 
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