A reality check for most makers

Shing,

I think most of the collectors who think they have the knowledge to critise knives and knifemakers probably haven't a clue if their knives are any good for what knives are for, to cut stuff. The expensive, pretty knives they have in their display cabinets could be made out of the softest mild steel and they will never know since the only thing they will cut is thin air.
Click to expand...

First, the link to your website is not working.

Most collectors buy what they like. Granted they may never cut anything but thin air. However, this only limits their ability to critique how the knife would work in the field.

This in no way, shape or form detracts from the ability to discuss "Fit and Finish", preferred materials, grind lines, sharpness, etc.

Just so we understand where you are coming from:

What knives are in your collection?

What experience do you have using custom knives in the field?

I look forward to your answers.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Hi Shing,

First, that link works, the one in your profile did not.

Second: No prices...why?

Next:

Just so we understand where you are coming from:

What knives are in your collection?

What experience do you have using custom knives in the field?

I look forward to your answers.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Les Robertson said:
Hi Tai,

However, I work in the now and the future. As you accurately pointed out I am very accurate with regards todays current custom knife market and what collectors want.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
Click to expand...

Hi Les,
Thank you for pointing that out.

However, I don't think either one of us is qualified to accurately predict the "future"...
 
The point I’m trying to make right now is that,… it is possible that brass guards and fittings could become fashionable in some future trend or market... among other things that may not be popular today.

Historically, I don’t think that many collectors or dealers in Vincent Van Gogh’s day predicted that his paintings or style would have ever become so valuable and popular in today’s market.

goh.jpg
 
What kind of market is there for $1500 users?

Is a knife maker selling $1500 custom knives really selling to someone who will use the knife or are they really selling to collectors?


Mitch
 
Hi Tai,

You are incorrect....It is my ability to predict the future of custom knives that allows me to continue doing what I love for a living.

You will note in my signature line I list myself as a Custom Knife Entrepreneur.

Entrepreneurs are proactive...not reactive.

Entrepreneurs create new markets and shape existing ones into what they will become in the future.

Not just in knives, but in all aspects of business....world wide.

It is the artist in you that forces you to live in the here and now.

Businessmen are not so restricted we understand that on Thursday...Friday was the future and today, Friday is now yesterday.

I can only speak for myself, but my business plan is 5 years into the future.

Modifications to that plan will be made as necessary. However, multiple Courses of Action allow those modifications to be made seamlessly. As multiple variables in multiple scenarios have already been identified and addressed.

Tai, the future is already here. If you lack the ability to visualize that you are merely existing in a state of "reaction."

Living in the desert working in your shop the way it is set up. You have chosen to limit your market and create your world as you see fit. Nothing wrong with this, artists have been doing this for probably thousands of years.

You enjoy the minimalist experience because you love the control.

You view the future as being impossible to control. As such you dismiss my claims of being able to "predict" the future.

My ability to "predict" the future of the custom knife market is due in large part to my daily interaction with makers, collectors, dealers, writers and editors. All provide information...more accurately indicators of what they want.

It is these very indicators that help you identify makers, style trends, design element trends, price point trends, collector trends, etc. Within the business plan each can be weighted with a Beta.

The Beta for purposes of custom knives would be a covariance of one maker compared to all the other makers in a particular market. This is a leading indicator to a makers position in the market (and you guys thought I was just guessing).

Beta examples might be makers who don't deliver on time, don't value price their knives, don't produce enough knives, all receive a higher beta because of the volatility this creates among collectors.

Although, short term this can work to the advantage of those looking for a decent return if you are able to get the knife directly from the maker. Then turn it in the after market for double or triple.

Any way enough of what Bob Terzuola calls "That MBA talk". LOL

Can I predict if someone will get hit by a bus or how many children you will have...no.

Can I predict with a fairly high degree of accuracy how makers, styles and trends will do in the future.

Yes I can.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
My advice to makers and collectors is simply,... make what you like and buy what you like. :)
 
We must hear someone say "buy what you like" at least a couple times a week on this forum. Does anyone actually buy knives that they don't like :confused: ;)
 
Kevin Jones said:
We must hear someone say "buy what you like" at least a couple times a week on this forum. Does anyone actually buy knives that they don't like :confused: ;)
Click to expand...

I don't know for sure, because there could be some conditioning going on here...

However, I have to admit,... that last post of mine wasn't very "imaginative". :)
 
Hi Tai.

Paul Gauguin was a contemporary of Van Gogh's. He was much more popular in his life time because his "beta" was lower than Van Gogh's.

Gauguin, could be counted on to produce and supply the dealers and his clients with works of art.

Van Gogh's died broke and with body parts missing. Obviously the sums of money being paid for his work 100 years after his death did him no good.

No Brass will not be making a come back.

Nickel silver has had its foot out the door for some years. I insist on the knives built for me have stainless steel guards (as opposed to Brass or NS).

Brass has for the past two decades in the custom knife market the mark of a beginner. This is due primarily to its cost and forgiving nature while work it.

Your advice to makers and collectors alike comes with caveats:

For the makers, make what you like. However you do not get to complain...EVER about the following:

Not selling out at a show.

Not winning awards.

Not getting articles

Not having a dealer consider working with you.

Not having your knives hold their value.


For collectors you do not get to complain about the following:

Your knives not finding any interest in the aftermarket.

If your knives do find any interest in the aftermarket, you can't complain if you lose money on the sale.

Tai, your advice speaks to your Bohemian mind set. And quite frankly is bad advice to anyone other than a new maker or collector.

Collectors should do their homework. Look for value pricing, upward movement of the maker in their market, the ability to work different designs and with different materials.

Buy what you like, however do so with an eye to the future. Many makers out there can build very similar knives. There is no reason to give the one your business....that doesn't treat their knife making with at least some business sense.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Kevin Jones said:
We must hear someone say "buy what you like" at least a couple times a week on this forum. Does anyone actually buy knives that they don't like :confused: ;)
Click to expand...

I don't think a collector would, but they might pass on something they do like because of what they hear from an "expert". It doesn't follow trends, won't be a good investment, has brass, isn't from one of the top makers, etc... To me that statement means to keep it fun.
 
anyone who claims to be able to predict the future is pretty much " hyping " them self up , totally my opinion of course.

Perhaps guess what some makers knives may be of more value down the road , but claiming to accurately predict the future , is quite absurd.

Les , with all due respect you appear to be negative towards Tai's knifemaking ways/style yet in the same light call yourself a Custom Knife Entrepreneur , which is just your buzz word for DEALER( which you make sure to point out you are a not a dealer every chance you get ).
 
Jose Reyes said:
I don't think a collector would, but they might pass on something they do like because of what they hear from an "expert". It doesn't follow trends, won't be a good investment, has brass, isn't from one of the top makers, etc... To me that statement means to keep it fun.
Click to expand...

Fun for me is buying knives I like that are also good investments. :)

It's not like it's an either or situation, you can have both. ;)
 
Kevin Jones said:
Fun for me is buying knives I like that are also good investments. :)

It's not like it's an either or situation, you can have both. ;)
Click to expand...

That's true, Kevin, but just one of your good investment knives probably cost more than most people spend on knives all year.

There are people who make a living gambling in Vegas but the vast majority go there on vacation to have some fun. :D
 
Jose Reyes said:
That's true, Kevin, but just one of your good investment knives probably cost more than most people spend on knives all year.

There are people who make a living gambling in Vegas but the vast majority go there on vacation to have some fun. :D
Click to expand...

Why does a knife have to be expensive to be a good investment?
I have found it's easier to profit on lessor priced knives. More buyers in the lower price ranges thus less risk.

Here's an example of a John Fitch Boot Bowie that sold the other day. It appreciated 30% in three years in spite of the fact that John's knives are a little soft right now. Even considering the 30% appreciation the buyer still got a great knife at a fair price and is extremely happy as he should be.

JOHNFITCHSmallDamaususBowie001.jpg
 
Hi John,

With all due respect I will have to disagree with you.

While it may seem to you I am merely a dealer or purveyor (the fancy "buzz" word for dealer).

Entrepreneur is much more geared to what I do. I have written the only book...every on collecting custom knives.

I was instrumental in the design, marketing and implementation of the LDC line a of knives. Note, every one in the custom knife community thought this idea would fail miserably...they were wrong. Our knives had covers on both Tactical Knives and American Handgunner.

I then introduced my Vanguard series of custom knives. To date, with the addition of new knives from Larry Chew and Daniel Winkler, the series now includes 60 different knives....to include a Cover on Blade.

I conduct seminars for both makers and collectors.

I write (with my own column) for Knives Illustrated. As well I write for Blade on a variety of subjects.

I was in every issue of Blade and Knives Illustrated last year. Can you tell me what other dealer was in every issue? Actually it is a trick question.

I work with new makers, not just buying and putting their knives on my web site or table. I actively market their knives by continuously suggesting improvements to their work that will improve their position in which ever market they chose to make knives in.

This is not to say that other dealers and purveyors have not had a couple of knives made exclusively for them, or have written an article or two, or possible have conducted a seminar or two.

I am talking about a body of work over the last 13 years that is truly Entrepreneurial. Not merely the buying and selling of custom knives.

John, while Entrepreneur is not a "buzz" word per se it is part of an overall marketing plan for creating a "brand".

After all John can you name another dealer or maker that calls themselves a "Custom Knife Entrepreneur"?

John, predicting the future of the custom knife market seems absurd only to those who do not practice it every day.

You see John, if I do not accurately predict which styles, makers and materials will be successful. Do you really think I would have sold 60 different models?

Do you really think that the LDC Line of Knives would have been successful.

How many "new" or up and coming makers do you think I can make a mistake with and still make enough money to pay my bills, attend shows and continue to carry tens of thousands of dollars worth of inventory?

More to the point how many custom knives can I afford to buy that don't sell in a reasonable period of time? If I am not buying the right knives then my web site becomes stale, people stop going there because there is nothing there but the same old knives...or worse when you click on the makers names over and over again there is nothing there.

How long do you think I would be able to do this full time...I have now or have not had for the last 13 years any other source of income. I rely 100% on my ability to predict future trends and capitalize on them before they become mainstream. The same is true with knife makers.

John, with all due respect...just because you can't do it or do not know of anyone who can...does not mean it cannot be done.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
Over
4000 views

130+ posts

Some guy shows up from out of the Woodwork...

claiming the know the future.

He professes to build markets and demand...

then boasts of manipulating said markets...

and makers, too!!! :eek:


Jeez just who does he think he is...a Ghost, perhaps.

Quite possibly THE best dealer on the Internet, me thinks.
(please leave the envelope and my Blade pass with the concierge)


Great posts, Les.
Always a pleasure reading your responses.
School's in session!
 
Hi John,

I forgot to address your comment about my negative attitude towards Tai's work.

What I wrote was an observation of how he prefers to make his knives and why.

There have been many of Tai's knives that I have personally liked over the years. The same is true of many knife makers who work I have not yet bought or traded for.

You may want to reread my post about the "beta and what it indicates about volatility".

From a purely business perspective I need work with makers who will ask them what I make (as I am basing my orders many times on what will sell in the future...there is that predicting thing again). I need them to deliver relatively close to on time, I need them to produce several knives for me every year.

There is no reason for me to waste my time marketing a maker whose knives I will not get.

I wrote about responsibility earlier in this thread. I am responsible for everything good, bad or indifferent with regards to Robertson's Custom Cutlery.

It took me several years of making excuse after excuse to my clients as to why I do not have the knife they ordered.

The conclusion I came to was, while it may be more time consuming to work with a new maker or an unknown maker. If they are willing to actually do the work they commit to. And build knives in their shops instead of excuses.

This, long term will benefit both my clients and my business.

As such, I just started to fire those makers who did not live up to their responsibility.

A benefit of this business strategy is that it forced me to ask more questions of the maker before the first order was ever placed. The answers to these questions, generally taking less than 5 minutes, would help me gauge if the maker and I could work together.

After years of trial and error trying to find the right questions, I came upon a group of questions that has, for the most part, have helped me identify the traits of makers who will be successful long term.

Whether you are a collector, maker or a dealer this is ultimately what we all want.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top