Mistwalker-
I just saw this and I'm pretty sure your talking about my "22 tinders" thread over on BCUSA.
When I have disdain for something, I don't veil it, thinly or otherwise.
When I was out in the woods this November I tried to come up with 20+ different types of tinder for Rescue Riley's Skills challenge. The top of my list was in fact FATWOOD. Everything else was just an afterthought. Where I live I should have no issues finding and harvesting fatwood. But you know what? I've been trying unsuccessfully since I heard about it on these forums, and it's frustrating the hell out of me.
If you were reading a disdain of fatwood into my post, it just ain't so. I quite envious of all your fatwwod posts. I think if I could harvest some, I'd love the stuff. I just can't bring myself to go to the Home Depot and buy it.
The truth is for me "I've 22 tinders and Fatwood ain't one." was more a rhyme of unrequited lust for the stuff, rather than disdain.
Actually you are right in that it was your post that was the one to push me into this, but it wasn't the only one...just the last one and it was much more about the timing of it than the content within...though I am not familiar with Jay-Z's music. I did say that I could be mistaken about how you meant the comment, inflections in text are hard to get and my mood was definitely slanted at the time. The problem was I was still brooding over a kid who lives here in this rain forest unwilling to even consider learning about a completely natural tinder in, of, and specific to his own often wet environment simply because of someone else's judgemental opinion. Fearing to use a tinder that could well make his time in the woods here not only more enjoyable but safer as well all year round. This made as much sense to me as some kid in upstate New York being being pressured into not using paper bark on their outings. Now... I've known the kid his whole life so in that particular case I was bothered more by his being so closed-minded than whoever wrote the arbitrary post he read, and angrier with him for succumbing to the pressure without even considering circumstance.
Sorry if I came down a little hard on the corn husks thing, hell I've used a million corn husks to start fires on camping trips on the river after raiding the local corn fields for a few ears to go with the fish I had caught or the rabbits I had shot. Camping out is about fun, and survival is about using what can be used quickly and expediently with little energy loss. Both are about not working any harder than you have to. I see nothing wrong with using any tinder except when someone actually needs a fire and they pass up what's available and will work well in the situation while wasting time searching for something else. That's the reason I keep chemical tinders handy, when it comes to cold weather and some-one's health and well being are at stake, it is no time to be on a search of the country side for something that will work under whatever the current conditions are. If I were on the verge of hypothermia from a boat over-turning on a shore next to a field of dry corn and my buddy was 50 meters down stream looking for some paper bark I'd be pretty upset.
Mistwalker those are some nice pictures. I was especially surprised by the drop with the reflection~pretty cool.
I am a bit green on this forum life, and exactly how to navigate through its pitfalls. Sometimes I just can't help throwing a little jab, a yay for my team, my way, my choice. It's an ego thing; so many egos flailing around looking for a little pat on the back-someone to say "hey your right.
I know I don't mean anything by it- perhaps the fatwood haters you refer to are the same. Expressing an Ideal, a goal. But when flame is not produced by force of will alone, they soon adopt whatever works asap.
In some regard I feel I can understand where they are coming from. > when it is,or if it becomes a bit contrived. Relying too much on 1 method
I have felt that way about my ferrorod for a few minutes. Just another high tech gadget thing, maybe too easy, not native enough... then the rabbit hole became obvious. I like hitech if it makes me look like I carry hardly a thing
One's kit is very personal. We have a lot of our identity, self image tied up in it. some like the military style, others the mod backpacker, the primitive, etc. each projects an image and says a lot about the user imho. (to a certain extent)
It's possible there are times when: whatever works for you: is just a brush off- like saying I have better things to do than convince you your choice is ridiculous. I guess it's just a good way to let each person decide for themselves. Which I think may be the best lesson your youths may have taken with them. Think for yourself, try it before adopting a given pov just because it is a safe opinion held by Expert A, and by agreeing I cant be wrong.
Perhaps so. I don't have any problems with statements like "using fatwood in a forest on a dry day shows a lack of skills" that is a true statement. Even in the summer there are many other tinders that show various skill levels. I read through a lot of forums on the net so I don't recall the exact places or posters but I have read with my own eyes more than once where some poster just said to use it at all shows a severe lack of skill. I'm secure in my own skills and really don't care what others think about what I choose to use at a time when I want or need a fire, I've started fires using cell phone batteries, steel wool, and fatwood just to see if it can be done and it can. It didn't really bother me until the other day when it dawned on me just how young and impressionable some of the readers on the forums are and I became inspired to throw in my two cents on the matter. Try as I might to keep it in check sometimes my Gaelic temper flares a bit.
Pit you are one of the highest contributing members on this subforum. You post knives in actual USE, and a $#iTload of bushcrafty stuff. Your 4-legged assistants only add to your posts... Someone still buggin you? If anyone needs killin', you let me know brutha... I ain't kilt me a man in two whole weeks.:grumpy:
... and now, back to fatwood.
Rick
Agreed. I always enjoy and learn something from Pit's posts about an area similar to but different from my own whether it is what he is showing or something I notice in the back ground.
I always have fatwood in my tinder kit. I like to practice with other methods so I don't become reliant on the fatwood. It is there if needed when the most important thing is to get fire fast. If my fatwood is lost, I know what I can use in my area.
As far as fatwood being for the unskilled, I have a buddy who cant light a fatwood fire to save his A$$- yet, he is practicing and am sure he will have it down in no time, but it does take a little bit of skill to use the ferro rod without sending your tinder flying about.
Truthfully I prefer fatwood to magnesium. It's easier on the edge of a knife and isn't as sensitive to wind....though it doesn't make as pretty colors and sparks when wet.
Mist,
I'm not gonna go back and forth with the whole break down a post thing.
I know better than to get involved with these "look at me" posts and I broke my own rules. This is a reminder of why I have those rules.
We disagree, that's the bottom line.
If you think this is about some friction between us then I'm sorry for that.
I've got nothing else to say on the matter.
Iz
I am glad there is no friction, that's a relief. I can easily live with agreeing to disagree man. I am also sorry that's what you took away from this post. One of the reasons I do so many still shots and macro shots, and so little video is that I don't want people to "look at me" I want them to look at what I am trying to show them whether it be a material, a technique, or a particular tool.
Excellent pics man, the rant itself was a story within... very nicely done!!!
my 2 cents aren't worth much but::
It really doesn't matter how you get a fire started, what matters is that you're able to.. period, when you need it, you need NOW!!
sometimes I think people just need to (get off their high horse and come to the party)..
Thanks man, glad you both caught and enjoyed the gist of the post!
I tend to agree for the most part as well. I like more primative ways to start fires and practice at home or on solo hikes, but always carry a lighter and/or matches with a ferro rod, too. Nice to be able to start a fire with just 2 sticks if you had too, doesn't mean you always need to. Same as with tinders imo. The knowledge is great but getting a fire goin anytime is hardly cheating.
The exact thoughts I am trying to impart to these guys. Learn as much as you can. Study, experiment, and practice as much as possible...just don't forget or lose sight of other things along the way. When it comes down to health and well being bushcraft goes out the window and it becomes about survival.
I can tell you from experience that it is a disconcerting feeling when you are 17 years old and the doctors are trying to figure out if they need to remove half of your toes or if they can be saved. I imagine it could only be worse to have them actually remove them. I was really lucky, I'd like to help others avoid that feeling if possible.
Honestly I have no disdain for fatwood. I carry sme daily and I have numerous sources of preprepped tinder in my woods bag.
However lighting fatwood does very little to increase one;s skill level as a bushman..Particularly if it is not native to your area..
its the same as carrying a butane lighter.. it;s prety much a sure fire way to get a fire going if youdon;t feel like (or in a dire situation Can;t) futz around with developing natural tinder use as a skill set.
And honestly It;s been played out...It's wood that lights up easy and burns well when wet... Great stuff to have in a kit, and to beable to identify in your area....Beyond that what else is there to say about it, that requires thread after thread?
Anyay
Nice thread and Great pics MW.
Thanks John, I understand exactly where you are coming from. You and I think alike on a lot of things and I always enjoy your posts.
I just needed to know these guys grasp the area and could deal with things out there on a simple, albeit easy, level because one never knows what I might happen. The same reason I keep extra food and water in my pack when we go out. Even if something happens to me I am still responsible for and trying to look after their well being.
On the count of 3, I want everyone to pm and email Rick at leats 3 Fatwood posts or videos!! Extra points if you can find a KGD video or post on fatwood and send it!!!
Fatwood is to fire, like a Mora is to a bushcraft knife!
I was considering seeing if ken would loan me a couple of knives Rick made so I could do some awesome photos of fatwood fuzz sticks and them laying on fatwood stumps so I could send them to Rick for desk tops.
and that was a low shot bro...I've never had fatwood fail me
Hey Rick, you have your cousin that comes out with you and then you get to have a three legged assistant (or so your wife tells it)....No need for jealousy on Pit for his companions!
This thread was sooo already worth the time it took, but man that right there was some awesome icing on the cake!!
Now to clean the coffee off the screen.....
.
:thumbup:
to get an ignition, but where it be bic, firesteel, or friction, your fire ain't going very far without the proper prep work of fuel. I teach my daughters "Toothpicks, Pencils, and Finger" as the first 3 steps to building a fire. The reference is to size, not material. They know how big a toothpic is, a pencil, and their fingers. After that, they got a solid base, to build on.
