An ambitious folder.

Only problems IMO.

1) Stop pin too thin. And...

2) Pocket clip too small.

The stop pin is too thin/small. Would have been good if they had some titanium backspacer material (referring to the area, I know there is no backspacer) supporting the stop pin. As it is, the stop pin is weaker than the strength of the lockbar which makes this folder stronger in resisting closing/spine-whacks compared to opening/chopping forces. Either make the pin thicker or support the pin with some titanium, not necessary to grind away the support of the stop pin. Best to adopt both :)

The pocket clip is a bit short. Though it is pretty strong (thick little bugger) it would have been perfect is they could incorporate the Hawks Bros type clip for a folder of this level. The Hawk Bros pocket clips (one with a polymer ball bearing and one with a roller) enables easy insertion/extraction from pocket and does not mar the finish. However failing which a simple lengthening of the pocket clip is gonna improve aesthetics and pocket retention.
 
I think comments on how the knife actually functions are totally premature. Hardly anyone has even handled the knife yet, let alone used it enough to comment on it with any authority.
 
philwar said:
I think comments on how the knife actually functions are totally premature. Hardly anyone has even handled the knife yet, let alone used it enough to comment on it with any authority.
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Good point. There is good information if anyone uses it extensively for a good period of time. But there is also good to come out of initial observations like if one is to view it from a passaround.

In my case I think it will be a little difficult since it's so pretty so for the first time I think I'll not be able to gather information of how it fares under extensive use :)
 
I will be using mine. I don't really have a need to beat on knives so I don't know how hard it will be used, but it will be used regardless.

I don't see the stop pin being an issue. Both ends go into the titanium and it is supported at each end. It is also 5/32" (.156") in diameter which isn't 'small'. The amount of force required to shear a steel pin of that diameter in 2 places is more than I can apply with my arms and any mechanical advantage the blade can provide. The pin would deform the hole in the titanium before it sheared. Sure a bigger pin would be stronger but the pin only has to be so strong before other parts will fail and it's my opinion it is plenty strong.

The clip is small but it is going to hold the knife in place just as well as any other clip. A short clip doesn't mean it is weak or will have bad retention. I don't have a problem with it other than I use clips to get a better grip on the knife by pinching with my pinky and ring finger and pushing the knife into my palm. It is a little small for that, but that is not it's purpose which I think it will do what it's supposed to do just fine. That is just my opinion of course.

What I would like to see improved is with the rotoblock. A piece of metal rotates so that it will block the lock bar from opening. But it hits a stop and doesn't keep moving to be in contact with the lock bar as it wears in and moves further across the tang. If a ramp was machined where the rotoblock hit the lock bar then it would rotate until it hit the ramp. As the lockbar moves further across the tang it would just travel a little further until it contacts the ramp again. Not a huge deal because it will stop the lockbar from unlocking, but it might allow the lockbar to move a slight amount before it is stopped by the rotoblock. Hopefully that explanation makes since. I'm sure some other stuff that could be improved upon will come up.
 
Fedex. I think they have world delivery and don't have to hand off a package to a different shipping service.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I will be using mine. I don't really have a need to beat on knives so I don't know how hard it will be used, but it will be used regardless.

I don't see the stop pin being an issue. Both ends go into the titanium and it is supported at each end. It is also 5/32" (.156") in diameter which isn't 'small'. The amount of force required to shear a steel pin of that diameter in 2 places is more than I can apply with my arms and any mechanical advantage the blade can provide. The pin would deform the hole in the titanium before it sheared. Sure a bigger pin would be stronger but the pin only has to be so strong before other parts will fail and it's my opinion it is plenty strong.

The clip is small but it is going to hold the knife in place just as well as any other clip. A short clip doesn't mean it is weak or will have bad retention. I don't have a problem with it other than I use clips to get a better grip on the knife by pinching with my pinky and ring finger and pushing the knife into my palm. It is a little small for that, but that is not it's purpose which I think it will do what it's supposed to do just fine. That is just my opinion of course.

What I would like to see improved is with the rotoblock. A piece of metal rotates so that it will block the lock bar from opening. But it hits a stop and doesn't keep moving to be in contact with the lock bar as it wears in and moves further across the tang. If a ramp was machined where the rotoblock hit the lock bar then it would rotate until it hit the ramp. As the lockbar moves further across the tang it would just travel a little further until it contacts the ramp again. Not a huge deal because it will stop the lockbar from unlocking, but it might allow the lockbar to move a slight amount before it is stopped by the rotoblock. Hopefully that explanation makes since. I'm sure some other stuff that could be improved upon will come up.
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That will be a good direction for the Rotoblock. That way you can really lock-in the position of the lockbar. That would not be too difficult to adopt and maybe the manufacturers will try it out.

Yeah the stop pin is plenty strong for use. Not saying it isn't strong enough. I'm just anal that way. I feel it is a little bit of a pity the titanium backspacer is machined away from the pin. It could be used to support the pin. Kinda like the Recon 1 of Cold Steel.

In everyday cutting it will be absolutely fine. Chopping/batoning is another matter and generates much force. I know, why chop/baton with a folder? Get a fixed blade right :) I am just anal that way. I managed to deform my stop pin of my Rukus due to repeated flicking (I'm habitual flicker) by a little bit so I'm kinda anal about the stop pin. If the folder is already so almighty strong then why not bulk up there as well?

However even with my personal dislike of small stop pins I admire this folder very much. It is just so well made :)
 
Cotherion said:
That will be a good direction for the Rotoblock. That way you can really lock-in the position of the lockbar. That would not be too difficult to adopt and maybe the manufacturers will try it out.

Yeah the stop pin is plenty strong for use. Not saying it isn't strong enough. I'm just anal that way. I feel it is a little bit of a pity the titanium backspacer is machined away from the pin. It could be used to support the pin. Kinda like the Recon 1 of Cold Steel.

In everyday cutting it will be absolutely fine. Chopping/batoning is another matter and generates much force. I know, why chop/baton with a folder? Get a fixed blade right :) I am just anal that way. I managed to deform my stop pin of my Rukus due to repeated flicking (I'm habitual flicker) by a little bit so I'm kinda anal about the stop pin. If the folder is already so almighty strong then why not bulk up there as well?

However even with my personal dislike of small stop pins I admire this folder very much. It is just so well made :)
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I think I understand what you are saying now. You mean where they machined away the titanium near the pivot so you can see the blade tang and the stop pin?

And I bet even if your Rukus had a pin twice as big it would have still deformed. Steel can only take so much before you start moving metal around a little bit. But the good thing is that a stop pin is easy to replace.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
I think I understand what you are saying now. You mean where they machined away the titanium near the pivot so you can see the blade tang and the stop pin?

And I bet even if your Rukus had a pin twice as big it would have still deformed. Steel can only take so much before you start moving metal around a little bit. But the good thing is that a stop pin is easy to replace.
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Yup. If they had titanium supporting the stop pin, then even if the stop pin is thinner then it'll be supported by the super thick titanium. Deformation becomes exponentially more difficult.

Twice as thick pin will result in 4 times the resistance. Square the diameter. It is significant add-on. Though a cylindrical stop pin should result in makers making the impact zone in the blade tang to be machined circular inwards instead of flat. Flat means you will flatten the pin. Basically I'm a saying you can improve situation significantly if you increase contact area of stop-pin to tang.

In a nutshell you can either use a small stop pin but support it with the backspacer and machine the contact area on the blade tang to be not flat to match the stop-pin. That'll be nice :) Alternatively you can use a thick stop pin if backspacer is too small or far away.

However anything is only as strong as it's weakest component. So it'll be pointless to put a mutha of a stop pin if the liners supporting it is paper thin or when the case where the pivot pin is thinner cause it'll fail at the pivot first (bending moment is very similar).

Anyways if the Italian design crew had a nice talk with us guys in Bladeforums to improve things they'll not regret it :)

PS: I'm in Malaysia, replacement stop pins are not so easy to obtain, shipping cost is a killer.
 
unwisefool said:
So did the packages arrive FedEx or USPS? Just want to know what to look for!
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Definitely FedEx, most likely signature required. When the rep called me on Wednesday, she got my voicemail and left my tracking number along with her contact info. I checked it on the FedEx website and they handled the package from Lion Steel through Italy, France, and on over here into the U.S. :thumbup: It should be here later today, Friday.
 
Got mine today.

I greatly appreciate the opportunity to try this knife out.

So far, I can say I pretty much like the knife with little issue (nothng as far as the making of the knife goes, just minor design things - as one expects in any knife).

Thanks again and most satisfied :)!
 
Jaxx said:
Definitely FedEx, most likely signature required. When the rep called me on Wednesday, she got my voicemail and left my tracking number along with her contact info. I checked it on the FedEx website and they handled the package from Lion Steel through Italy, France, and on over here into the U.S. :thumbup: It should be here later today, Friday.
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Oh cool, hopefully mine will be over at my parents house. I have stuff sent there since someone around me has sticky fingers when it comes to packages :grumpy:
 
unwisefool said:
Oh cool, hopefully mine will be over at my parents house. I have stuff sent there since someone around me has sticky fingers when it comes to packages :grumpy:
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The package requires a signature when being delivered so even if it went to your house if you weren't there then you would have to go pick it up. As pricey as they are I'm glad they didn't skimp on shipping.
 
Just got mine!! First impression is good. It's actually slimmer than I thought it would, which is a good thing to me. Fit and finish seem good and opens up smoothly and VERY solidly. The Rotoblock is easy to engage and disengage and the blade is scary sharp.

The only three minor complaints I have is that 1) the part of the blade that engages the lockbar is kind of rough 2) it should come with an extra lock bar tip. What's the point of being able to change it out if you don't have a spare? :p 3) I wish I had bought a purple/blue one also.

Other than that I think it is a very cool knife and more than worth the preorder price. I really look forward to seeing what Lion Steel puts out next. I wonder if they have a mailing list.
 
Mine is also a little rough on the blade tang where the lock bar engages. While it doesn't look great it's not that noticeable and I don't think it presents any problems. The only other thing finish wise I have found is that the very edge of the blade closest to the pivot was not sharpened all the way. A couple mm are thick and not ground to a sharp edge. But it will sharpen out eventually or a couple minutes on the edge pro will knock it down so again, I'm not too worried about it. Other than that the finish is nearly flawless.
 
FlaMtnBkr said:
Mine is also a little rough on the blade tang where the lock bar engages. While it doesn't look great it's not that noticeable and I don't think it presents any problems.
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It's not a finish flaw, but a tungsten carbide layer.
This layer of carbide hardens the surface of the tang, minimizing wear against the ultra hard replaceable lock face. Plus even w/o the Rotoblock engaged the frame are not going to move. :)
 
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ombrapelone said:
It's not a finish flaw, but a tungsten carbide layer.
This layer of carbide hardens the surface of the tang, minimizing wear against the ultra hard replaceable lock face. Plus even w/o the Rotoblock engaged the frame are not going to move. No slicky locks here. :)
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+1 on this comment. My XM-18 has this on the Ti lock bar face and it was done on the blade since the lock bar face can be replaced. I must say that I have 2 of these and one is going in my pocket. I think the fit and construction of this folder are as good as any Sebenza, Strider or similar priced folder I own. The only variation I can see is the top of blade spine where it is hand rounded and a few other hidden areas. Mine shaves hair easily!

The one piece construction of the handle is amazing! This is going into EDC rotation with my Hinderer Xm-18, my SnG CC and my Lambert Custom Whar. If you don't have one....this knife is a marvel of constuction. I don't think you could even make a folder like this 10 years ago. CnC technology has come a long way.
 
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