At What Point is a Knife OVERPRICED?

[Hyperborean]

Comment on the previous posters remarks about the CZ75 vs. Randall. I had some Randalls when I was younger. I would not leave an 01 blade as "soft" as they do, but hey, that's just me. As for the CZ 75, it is a very rugged pistol that incorporates good features of a number of other pistols, like the frame rails of a SIG 210. It probably won't let you down, but it is NOT pretty. Another example is the CZ copy of the pre-64 Winchester Model 70. My brother bought one and found it wanting when compared to his real Classic Model 70's. Most firearms today are mass produced items. Even the wonderful Kimber 1911's are made on CNC equipment. That is the reason that the Winchester Model 70 Classic Super Grade cost the same when they stopped producing it in 2005-06 as it did when they introduced the model in the early 90's even though the new one has a fancier stock David Miller designed stock with an ebony foreend cap like the old Supers. Less hand work on the newer ones. If you want to know what good gun that requires a fair amount of hand work costs, take a look at a side by side shotgun. The most reasonably priced one of good quality is probably a Ruger Gold Label. Anyone priced one of thsoe lately? Now apply this to knives.

Not pretty? The CZ 75 looks pretty attractive to me. Better looking than those stamped SIG series or Beretta with its painted aluminium handle. And the Glock is not pretty-it's ugly and a shit to hold in hand. There are probably more copies and modified copies of the CZ 75 than of any other pistol. Regarding the way how CZ firearms are produced,comment on CZ 97 B from their website:
"CZ 97 B
This model was evaluated by the American magazine Soldier of Fortune in its ‘99 issue as the most accurate serially produced "Combat" pistol in .45 ACP calibre."

http://www.czub.cz/index.php?p=32&idp=1&ids=3&lang=en

 

[TemplarKnight21c]

I draw the line at $100-$150. A knife is a knife. As I've said before, I EDC a $40 Buck Odyssey. I've had it for about 10 years now, and it hasn't let me down once. I really don't understand why people spend so much for something that will do the same exact job as something that costs so little. However, specialty/custom knives are different. If someone makes a knife by hand, and do a good job of it, they can charge more than a big name company, and I'm fine with it. But when it gets to $300+, it's still rediculous.

 

[3Guardsmen]

Strider knives for example cost about maybe $20.00 to make ($15.00 worth of steel, 30 cents worth of para-cord for the handle and a couple bucks to put the stripes on the blade), yet they charge you $300 to $500 dollars to buy one. If that's not overpriced then I don't know what is.

I have to wonder how you came up with that number. Does that low amount you guessed at ("about maybe") include tasks like grinding the blade and heat treating it? Are you a knifemaker?

Edit: Nevermind, my questions were answered with part of your post in another thread:

I have sharpened some Fury knives where I can shave the hair on my arms with them. That takes a little time, but it's worth it.

Regards,
3G

 

[Blop]

A knife is overpriced when no one will buy it. Period. End of story.

Well, something isn´t justed because anybody does that way. Our fuell here is overprized, even though anybody buys it.

You can get custom made knives like the chili handled and so on for much less. If the particular knife doesn´t feature something unique in design, which may cause a higher price (in respect to the designer). Design your own, and get it from your knifemaker.

Fixed, made of steel, full tang with scales of G10, micarta or wood, fibre, OL up to 10" between 150 to 300 may be ok, above in general not.

 

[noss4]

A knife is overpriced when I want it but I can't afford it. :grumpy:

 

[cgusek111]

My point is that you can find a good knife for under one hundred dollars that will outlast and outperform all that five hundred dollar, overpriced hype.

 

[barrabas74]

My point is that you can find a good knife for under one hundred dollars that will outlast and outperform all that five hundred dollar, overpriced hype.

Thats just not the case, and we could discuss this all day. You can buy two knives that cut equally and are made of the same steel. But due to fit/finish, and materials one can easily cost more and still perform on par with the other.

My DDR gunhammer does not "outcut" my Spyderco mili but due to its materials, it being AO and its fit and finish...it will cost more.

Overpriced hype is all relative to who thinks whose product is "hyped" many people think certain companies are hyped. Wont spend over 150? Thats cool you certainly can find a Ranger9 that will last longer than you for less than that but that doesnt mean that the Custom Bowie is "overpriced hype" if it is made of the same steel and cuts the same...what if it has a Hamon? Ivory? Damascus gaurd and pommel? But still cuts the same? Does that make it hype? What if it cuts slightly under that Ranger9? Most people saying this would never buy such a knife so this will probably fall on def ears.

 

[jdm61]

oops....editing screw up

 

[jdm61]

My point is that you can find a good knife for under one hundred dollars that will outlast and outperform all that five hundred dollar, overpriced hype.

But you would have to look a good long while. You have to figure that a $100 knife today probably has an actual MSRP of about $120. That means that it wholesales for no more than $70 IF it came from a dealer that buys directly from the factory. The you have to factor in that the factory has to cover overhead, materiel cost, advertsing and promotion and employee cost. Where are the corners being cut? Someone earlier posted that they use a $50 Wal Mart Gerber to dress out multiple deer withnot problem. Good for them. My cousin's experience was slightly different. The first time he tried to dress out a deer, the blade on his $50 Wal Mart Gerber snapped. Needless to say, he will be carrying one of my forged W2 hunters into the field this season and if he had to pay for it, it would cost him around $200-225 including a VERY nice Treestump Leather pouch sheath

 

[jdm61]

Not pretty? The CZ 75 looks pretty attractive to me. Better looking than those stamped SIG series or Beretta with its painted aluminium handle. And the Glock is not pretty-it's ugly and a shit to hold in hand. There are probably more copies and modified copies of the CZ 75 than of any other pistol. Regarding the way how CZ firearms are produced,comment on CZ 97 B from their website:
"CZ 97 B
This model was evaluated by the American magazine Soldier of Fortune in its ‘99 issue as the most accurate serially produced "Combat" pistol in .45 ACP calibre."

http://www.czub.cz/index.php?p=32&idp=1&ids=3&lang=en

LOL.....if the Glock is shit to hold in your hand, then you must have a funny shaped hand. Ugly as they may be, the Glock is one of the scant few pistols that I have ever shot that does not require me to adjust my sight picture when swtiching from another gun. It has a grip angle similar to a target pistol in my opinion. The other pistols that I have owned that are like this are a Sig P220 (totally different grip angle and feel than the P226, etc), a Walther P5 and a Smith Centennial Airweight, but that is because I "choke up" onto the area where the hammer would normally be. As for the CZ 75, I will restate my opinion that it is an ugly cuss. The CZ 85 was a slight improvement in the looks department. Looks wise, my favorite autos are the full sized P5, the PP series, a nicely done 1911 and the no longer produced full sized Walther P88. The new P99 and its Smith counterpart are abortions, by the way. The newer Hi-Powers are pretty good looking too.

 

[A. G. Russell]

A knife is overpriced when I want it but I can't afford it. :grumpy:

How much better could it be said?

 

[Hyperborean]

LOL.....if the Glock is shit to hold in your hand, then you must have a funny shaped hand. Ugly as they may be, the Glock is one of the scant few pistols that I have ever shot that does not require me to adjust my sight picture when swtiching from another gun. It has a grip angle similar to a target pistol in my opinion. The other pistols that I have owned that are like this are a Sig P220 (totally different grip angle and feel than the P226, etc), a Walther P5 and a Smith Centennial Airweight, but that is because I "choke up" onto the area where the hammer would normally be. As for the CZ 75, I will restate my opinion that it is an ugly cuss. The CZ 85 was a slight improvement in the looks department. Looks wise, my favorite autos are the full sized P5, the PP series, a nicely done 1911 and the no longer produced full sized Walther P88. The new P99 and its Smith counterpart are abortions, by the way. The newer Hi-Powers are pretty good looking too.

I think you must have pretty funny shaped hands youself since you can naturally hold that box like thing with such pleasure LOL.
And while we are at this the Glock pistols are example of another hype...before it appeared in Die hard movie (along with some totaly lame claims it was undetectable by metal detector) it was completely unknown to public and then all of suddenly you could see and hear about them...someone correct me if I am mistaken...

The CZ 85 look exactly the same as CZ 75 except it has ambidextrous safety controls and slide stops. Personaly I haven't handled SIGs but I doubt there is such big difference between P 220 and P 226 as you say since the only important difference between the two is a caliber (according to technical data the width of P 220 grip is slightly narrower than P 226s).

And in case you start again with some bullshit I have funny hands here is photo of my hand, uploaded for you :
http://s212.photobucket.com/albums/cc96/Hyperborean_photos/?action=view&current=PIC_0323.jpg

 

[barrabas74]

And in case you start again with some bullshit I have funny hands here is photo of my hand, uploaded for you :
http://s212.photobucket.com/albums/cc96/Hyperborean_photos/?action=view&current=PIC_0323.jpg

Uh oh it looks like your grippin it with your:jerkit: hand. I find the new glocks more comfortable than the old but still I like my S&W M&P more than my glocks....but back to the topic at hand.

I know what Noss4 means, if I cant afford it I have this feeling of....well its just overpriced. And it is for me anyway, but that doesnt mean its hype.

jdm61 email your way.

As for pistols and knives and prices. I have often caught myself buying a sebbie or custom going..."Ya know, thats enough for a decent pistol or rifle" or at least enough to cover a good portion of it. But many knives I buy I can carry everyday while many guns I buy I cannot or are specialized like my AR's or M1A1's(I wish I could carry them everyday). If I sold some of my knives I could get the Barrett I want, but that wont happen. It is funny how something with moving parts that holds and explosion to propell objects costs the same or less than something that is a solid piece of steel and plastic or wood....but hay who knows how much time and cost is required by each.

But the same argument is used over in gunforums everywhere...why buy a Sauer or a Nula when I can have a fully decked out Remington or Winchester? Is the accuracy and weight that diff enough to justify the cost? Or are Nula and Sauer and others just overpriced? I mean they are just pieces of wood and steel and sometimes plastic This certainly isnt relegated to knives. Only you can decide whats overpriced, and hype shows itself in the end, those that are hype eventually fade away.

 

[jdm61]

I think you must have pretty funny shaped hands youself since you can naturally hold that box like thing with such pleasure LOL.
And while we are at this the Glock pistols are example of another hype...before it appeared in Die hard movie (along with some totaly lame claims it was undetectable by metal detector) it was completely unknown to public and then all of suddenly you could see and hear about them...someone correct me if I am mistaken...

The CZ 85 look exactly the same as CZ 75 except it has ambidextrous safety controls and slide stops. Personaly I haven't handled SIGs but I doubt there is such big difference between P 220 and P 226 as you say since the only important difference between the two is a caliber (according to technical data the width of P 220 grip is slightly narrower than P 226s).

And in case you start again with some bullshit I have funny hands here is photo of my hand, uploaded for you :
http://s212.photobucket.com/albums/cc96/Hyperborean_photos/?action=view&current=PIC_0323.jpg

LOL...........well played, sir There was another change on the CZ85. They cahnged the slide and frame up near the front and took out that unsightly indentation. The P220 grip is not only narrower but seems to have a slightly different grip angle. It could be argued that ANY double stack mag is a compromise when it comes to handling and feel. The Browning Hi-Power is a perfect example, although that was aggravated by the fact that they have those square slab grips. The first thing i did with mine was to buy a set of Pachmyr wrap around grips and cut off the "wraparound" part so that I was left with 1911 style scales. DRASTIC improvement. The Glock is arguably a very good pistol for those who are marginally trained in the use of semi-automatic pistols. With the exception of having the cycle the slide, it is pretty close to a revolver in its simplicity. Now when I say that i like the feel, I am talking about a full sized 9mm like the 17 or the 19. The small Glocks feel horriblee to me and the full sized 45 is too big. The P88 is still my favorite high capacity 9mm by far.

 

[jdm61]

Uh oh it looks like your grippin it with your:jerkit: hand. I find the new glocks more comfortable than the old but still I like my S&W M&P more than my glocks....but back to the topic at hand.

I know what Noss4 means, if I cant afford it I have this feeling of....well its just overpriced. And it is for me anyway, but that doesnt mean its hype.

jdm61 email your way.

As for pistols and knives and prices. I have often caught myself buying a sebbie or custom going..."Ya know, thats enough for a decent pistol or rifle" or at least enough to cover a good portion of it. But many knives I buy I can carry everyday while many guns I buy I cannot or are specialized like my AR's or M1A1's(I wish I could carry them everyday). If I sold some of my knives I could get the Barrett I want, but that wont happen. It is funny how something with moving parts that holds and explosion to propell objects costs the same or less than something that is a solid piece of steel and plastic or wood....but hay who knows how much time and cost is required by each.

But the same argument is used over in gunforums everywhere...why buy a Sauer or a Nula when I can have a fully decked out Remington or Winchester? Is the accuracy and weight that diff enough to justify the cost? Or are Nula and Sauer and others just overpriced? I mean they are just pieces of wood and steel and sometimes plastic This certainly isnt relegated to knives. Only you can decide whats overpriced, and hype shows itself in the end, those that are hype eventually fade away.

Double shotguns are where the rubber meets the road as far as money spent on handcrafting. Bolt action rifles can be made VERY well without costing as much as the average economy car. The recent Winchester Model 70 Classics and the Kimber rifles are examples of this. The Winchester Super Grade had an MSRP of arount $1100 when it went out of production and was a hairs breadth away from being in the same league as a basic tomid level Dakota if you got one with really nice wood. My brother has one in .388 Win Mag and it is SWEET!!!

 

[barrabas74]

Double shotguns are where the rubber meets the road as far as money spent on handcrafting. Bolt action rifles can be made VERY well without costing as much as the average economy car. The recent Winchester Model 70 Classics and the Kimber rifles are examples of this. The Winchester Super Grade had an MSRP of arount $1100 when it went out of production and was a hairs breadth away from being in the same league as a basic tomid level Dakota if you got one with really nice wood. My brother has one in .388 Win Mag and it is SWEET!!!

Oh I agree on shotguns, those puppies are sweet I have a Browning Citori(not that high end I know) and its still up there in price that I use for Skeet and trap. My girl has an affinity for doubles and lets just say she no longer gets mad at me for knives

 

[Hyperborean]

Uh oh it looks like your grippin it with your:jerkit: hand. I find the new glocks more comfortable than the old but still I like my S&W M&P more than my glocks....but back to the topic at hand.

Yes, I am gripping the knife with my :jerkit: hand. I hope you haven't got aroused by the photo LOL...it was definetely not meant to provoke such feelings but you never know what kind of people are on the internet.


To Jdm61:

Sir, you are talking about CZ 85 Combat version, not original CZ 85 .

http://www.czub.cz/get_img.php?img=img/CZ_85_B.jpg&width=450

http://www.czub.cz/get_img.php?img=img/cz_75_b.JPG&width=450

 

[jdm61]

Yes, I am gripping the knife with my :jerkit: hand. I hope you haven't got aroused by the photo LOL...it was definetely not meant to provoke such feelings but you never know what kind of people are on the internet.


To Jdm61:

Sir, you are talking about CZ 85 Combat version, not original CZ 85 .

http://www.czub.cz/get_img.php?img=img/CZ_85_B.jpg&width=450

http://www.czub.cz/get_img.php?img=img/cz_75_b.JPG&width=450

Yes, sir, I apparently was. Is the CZ 97 still an all steel pistol?

 

[Hyperborean]

Are you reffering to recoil spring guide as mentioned here http://madogre.com/Interviews/CZ97B_Review.htm ? I have not handled one so I can't tell whether is that true or not.

 

[PHANTOM6]

Gee, I don't think Randalls are underpriced, but they certainly can't cope with demand as they now offer a 6 year wait for some models.

This is a fuzzy thing anyway, prices on anything are impacted by much more than is usually visible or discoverable. The stock market is a classic example. If prices were predictable, the market would not really exist. It's the unknown that makes it work.

For knives, I would suggest that some autos are as complex, have as much or more high tolerance machining and are as difficult to make as many firearms. The current fashion in high end semi-autos does not necessarily mean they are harder to make than say, a 1911 .45, but prices reflect what the manufacturer THINKS they can get.

The same is true for high end knives...not customs, but benchmade/machine finished products. The answer to the original question is simply: The price is too high when no one will buy it."