Backpacking equipment--deodorant over knife?

I have nothing against the guy and if he gets enjoyment out of what he does then good for him. However I wouldn't personally go as far as that to save weight - I would at least add a peanut lighter and a small SAK, the HUGE jump in weight of the gear be damned!!!!! A small 1 x AAA light + spare battery might be worthwhile as well - an ITP A3 EOS Upgrade edition is a versatile light with 3 levels (loooooong run time on low, higher output when you need it) and what is a couple of ounces here or there?
 
Actually, I find the small travel sized unscented antiperspirants nice for longer trips. Not so much for the pits/smell but to put on my feet; it keeps them from sweating in my boots and causing blisters.
 
To the op, thanks for posting the link.

I think his ideas about gear were clearly put in his very first line:
You don’t need too much money and you don’t need 95% of what is offered on line—most of the stuff offered online and in outfitters stores is sold to people who like to collect backpacking stuff and think about trips they seldom take

He obviously has worked out a system of hiking over the years and miles that works very well for him.
No reason to disrespect the guy because he doesn't do it "your way".
He travels light and I admire what he has accomplished.

I found this interesting:
An Open letter to summer hiking companions about to begin a 500 mile trek on the Colorado Trail
Most long distance hikers don't make it. That is, they start but don't finish. Some don't even start--pulling out the week before. Remember, on long distance hikes HALF the hikers pull out in the first week... HALF!!! Then another 40% pull out along the way--That's the truth---on long distance hikes only 10% --only 10%--of the starters finish... this is not some walk in the park that any old guy can do... it is more like a slow-paced marathon.

I also liked his statement, "hiking is a metaphor for life."

...most of all our character will be altered...
...we will do hard things when we don't like them...
...we will stick with things that aren't always pleasant..
..and we will repeatedly see that our hike influenced us most because…

..hiking is a metaphor for life...
...life is a long distance hike...
...a job is a long distance hike...
...marriage (especially) is a long distance hike...
...and we will ponder the influence of this hike on our lives...
...and determine that the metaphor is what influenced us...
 
___ Knife—seldom. I used to carry a ½ ounce tiny key-chain knife. There are so few things needing cutting on the trail I no longer take it. If I need a knife I wait until the next town or borrow one from someone I run into.

___ Lighter--seldom. The tiny mini-lighter between three people is perhaps nice—though I doubt it. It might be nice for someone to have one. Serious backpackers seldom or never build fires except for romantic purposes.

Serious backpackers? He's not a very serious backpacker. He's a guy who mails himself supplies then power walks. He's an alien in foreign territory that must have white gas and all types of other bits of petroleum (tarps to inflatable sleeping pads to sporks) to make it. He just walks through nature on a non-paved superhighway using mile markers for navigation, hoping to make it to his next mailbox where his sleeping bag and food is waiting. And praying he doesn't run out of freeze dried dinners in the meantime.

I'm not even sure I should take this guy seriously. He carries a quarter of a bandanna to save weight? And carries only six sheets of TP, but some "city folk" carry half a roll? He only carries a refill portion of a pen to save weight? The weight of the plastic outside part of a bic pen? I should take this guy seriously?

If he is serious, he's the reason that SAR exists. He can't handle even the simplest of emergencies or even the most minor of bad weather. He can't signal for help. He can't even make it through a cold night, because he mailed his damn sleeping bag and doesn't have a match. His emergency plan is borrow from someone else or hope someone else will rescue him. Unfortunately society is full of his types, and I don't mean just on the hiking trails.

I'm not saying he's the first of this type of fool I've read about. One says they cut off their toothbrush handle to save a tenth of an ounce. The other says he cut half the head off two. The first says he just took one bristle off the brush, the second says he no longer brushes (like professor deodorant). I'm surprised they haven't decided to go naked...to save weight you know. (Admittedly some of these knife nuts and gear whores are just as bad in the opposite direction.)

Just because there are plenty of these extreme ultralight fools, doesn't mean I should consider professor deodorant any less of an idiot. And there's no way to soften the statement. Anyone who recommends that other hikers go into the woods without a compass, knife, lighter, and other essential emergency gear is a as pompous as he is ignorant. My 8 year old boy knows better. I would think anyone with more than a couple of hours in the Boy Scouts knows better. Hell anyone he's seen a Boy Scout (or Red Cross or ready.gov) commercial knows better.

When the time comes, I'll go find professor deodorant, tracking him if I have to. It shouldn't be hard because he won't stray from the trail much at least until he gets too dehydrated or hypothermic and loses his faculties. However, that doesn't change the fact that I would tell him to his face he's ignorant.

Thanks for the lectures from the ultralight fanboys, now go home. I don't go to ultralight boards to talk knives or survival skills. Why do you come here?
 
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Just like politics there are the far lefts and rights. Here we have a long distance hiker on one of the extreme ends of the spectrum. Few long trail "thru" hikers are as fanatical.

Let’s give credit where credit is due to the thru hikers. The resupply boxes are sent ahead because they have gear for changing seasons and terrain along with other consumables to be replaced and it’s done by all of the hikers, not just the few “elitists”.

There are at least 7 to 10 days of hiking, sometimes more, before stopping to resupply, mostly for food. Resupply means going off trail and it’s a time consuming hassle to get into a town so done as few times as possible.

The Pacific Crest Trail takes most men and women 6 - 7 months of hiking to complete. The “unsupported” speed record (no doubt held by an experienced "fanatic”) is somewhere between 60-70 days. Even for the fastest, this is not a quick race.

Anyone, whatever they carry, that has walked these long trails from one border of this country to another and especially those that have done it multiple times on multiple trails, is far more of an accomplished outdoors and wilderness person than most any of us here can comprehend.
 
Serious backpackers? He's not a very serious backpacker. He's a guy who mails himself supplies then power walks. He's an alien in foreign territory that must have white gas and all types of other bits of petroleum (tarps to inflatable sleeping pads to sporks) to make it. He just walks through nature on a non-paved superhighway using mile markers for navigation, hoping to make it to his next mailbox where his sleeping bag and food is waiting. And praying he doesn't run out of freeze dried dinners in the meantime.

I'm not even sure I should take this guy seriously. He carries a quarter of a bandanna to save weight? And carries only six sheets of TP, but some "city folk" carry half a roll? He only carries a refill portion of a pen to save weight? The weight of the plastic outside part of a bic pen? I should take this guy seriously?

If he is serious, he's the reason that SAR exists. He can't handle even the simplest of emergencies or even the most minor of bad weather. He can't signal for help. He can't even make it through a cold night, because he mailed his damn sleeping bag and doesn't have a match. His emergency plan is borrow from someone else or hope someone else will rescue him. Unfortunately society is full of his types, and I don't mean just on the hiking trails.

I'm not saying he's the first of this type of fool I've read about. One says they cut off their toothbrush handle to save a tenth of an ounce. The other says he cut half the head off two. The first says he just took one bristle off the brush, the second says he no longer brushes (like professor deodorant). I'm surprised they haven't decided to go naked...to save weight you know. (Admittedly some of these knife nuts and gear whores are just as bad in the opposite direction.)

Just because there are plenty of these extreme ultralight fools, doesn't mean I should consider professor deodorant any less of an idiot. And there's no way to soften the statement. Anyone who recommends that other hikers go into the woods without a compass, knife, lighter, and other essential emergency gear is a as pompous as he is ignorant. My 8 year old boy knows better. I would think anyone with more than a couple of hours in the Boy Scouts knows better. Hell anyone he's seen a Boy Scout (or Red Cross or ready.gov) commercial knows better.

When the time comes, I'll go find professor deodorant, tracking him if I have to. It shouldn't be hard because he won't stray from the trail much at least until he gets too dehydrated or hypothermic and loses his faculties. However, that doesn't change the fact that I would tell him to his face he's ignorant.

Thanks for the lectures from the ultralight fanboys, now go home. I don't go to ultralight boards to talk knives or survival skills. Why do you come here?


EPIC POST! well said! :thumbup:
 
I think they are "far more of an accomplished" long trail hiker. That's an appropriate amount of credit I'm willing to give.

DancesWithKnives
 
Thanks for the lectures from the ultralight fanboys, now go home. I don't go to ultralight boards to talk knives or survival skills. Why do you come here?

I'll presume that I'm one of the fanboys, though I questioned his lack of equipment. I'll further presume that my message of different equipment for different activities was my purported lecture.

Thanks for adding to the discussion in such a meaningful way. I'll certainly do just as you say and find myself some non knife forum.
Thanks again!
 
Thanks for the lectures from the ultralight fanboys, now go home. I don't go to ultralight boards to talk knives or survival skills. Why do you come here?

It is amusing when people make wild assumptions.
Since this was posted a few hours after mine, I guess I'm a "fanboy" too....lol
Actually, I've never been to an "ultralight board" until I clicked on the OP's link.

But just for fun, let's take a look at my last true wilderness "ultralight" adventure.
Colorado. Flat Tops Wilderness.
Wife with horses packing in. My idea of "ultralight" camping.
ElkHunt-4.jpg

Wife in camp.
ElkHunt-15.jpg

Packing out. First trip. We had to go back for the rest of our gear.
ElkHunt-42.jpg
 
'Till such time as I'm willing to go up to an aborigine and ridicule him for his lack of kit 'cos he's stood there with little more than loin cloth and a stick I'm going to say each to their own. Some men live a reality that others can only marvel at and presuppositions can often come back to bite you. While we ponder what it is to presuppose here are some pics:

whatswivallthetwatshere.jpg


What's it like to be a bat?
 
I agee taco, to each his own. If this guy breaks a leg and freezes to death he did it doing something he loves, good for him. It is not my way, but who am I to judge for him or call him stupid, lots of ultralighters, yet I don't hear about them dying by the dozens. Ishi or Otzi packed a lot lighter and did fine. Chris
 
when our state pays tons of cash out a year cause people need to be pulled off a trail ... and yes plenty of people do die being under prepared for there situation... and then expect rescue of some form...... personaly if your not responsable enough to pack for the situation ... you deserve it. of course im lumping novice hikers along with ridge runners. cause there are no statistics out for "ultraliters"

im not saying its a bad way to go. i did it for many years, and i even shaved down my knife needs down to a mini vic. and a micro bic.... even most ultraliters will tell you to bring these things in a must have emergancy kit....

there is a lotta good info in ultra-lite style of hiking. but you gotta do it like every thing safely and responsably. just like modifing gear , gear packing , materials.

From what i can tell , this guy must depend on other people for about everything. he also doesnt seam to hike alone. which i guess is why he can get away with it. and if i had to travel with him , i would force him to pick up some extra gear from other people to hike. or bugger off my extra 10 pounds of carry weight..... basicly hes a vulture. he can be happy go lucky and have other people pick up his slack to get a lighter then you attiude.
if he soloed and i know a few who do. he would be in total trouble. even near a heavy populated area like the east coast where you can pretty much get to a town in 15-30 miles about any where.

i wish him the best of luck and hope nothing bad happends , but i find most of his stuff trail ignorance from my experiance. i guess it cuts against my boyscout grain.

http://www.mummytombs.com/otzi/equipment.htm

Ishi or Otzi packed a lot lighter and did fine - otzi didnt do so well , but he was also packed up pritty well. Ishi... was at home basicly. not really applying to this at all. 1. he is not moving as fast as this guy. he doesnt have time to stop and forage for his supplys as he went. nore does he show much knowledge about obtaining these. hes totaly dependant on man made support.

also his idea of water useage kinda scares me ... and frankly free drinking from a stream freaks me out a bit. after being laid out for a couple days sick ... i wont make that mistake.
 
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I don't have any problem whatsoever with the guy being an ultralight hiker. That's fine and dandy.
Sometimes, when I want to have a little home away from home in the woods, I carry a bunch of crap. Sometimes I go with a bedroll and a knife. When I was younger I was gone for days and weeks at a time. Today, I have responsibilities and being gone for days and weeks at a time "camping" (it's the only way people understand what I do) is something that isn't possible. Maybe three to four days AT MOST is what I can stay gone now. So don't tell me about how he's some kind of hero for "doing something most of us can only dream about". Anyhow, getting side-tracked...

What irritates me about this guy is this statement, right here:

"If I need a knife I wait until the next town or borrow one from someone I run into."

It's not even about him not carrying a knife. But the very premise of this statement is telling of his mentality: "I'll save a bunch of weight and if I need something, I'll just borrow it from someone else."
At what point did it become everybody else's responsibility to supply him with stuff he deems "unnecessary"? If he doesn't need something, he doesn't need it at all. If it isn't important enough to pack, it isn't important enough to borrow.

I'm a kind person. If a person saw me off trail and said: "Hey, man, I packed my knife..but I forgot my stone and my blade's as dull as a liberal, you got a stone?" I'd lend him mine in a heartbeat. Might even sharpen his knife for him.
If a guy says: "Hey, man, I forgot to pack my knife--can I borrow yours?" I'll explain that I don't loan knives because of a hard lesson I learned and offer to cut what he needs cut for him.

But when some pontificating little shit preaches the uselessness of a knife, then turns right around and says: "But if I need one I'll just borrow one" he can kiss my ass. Either you need it or you don't.

Am I saying you must carry a knife? It's up to you. But don't get pissy because you don't think they're worth carrying, then ask a guy to borrow his and he tells you to take a flying effing leap.

It's this very kind of mentality--ESTABLISHED TRAIL OR NOT--that causes SAR members to have to be called away from their families at 2 am in the morning.

Ultralight hikers are fine by me. Kitchen Sink hikers are fine by me, too. Because I've been one of both at some time or another. But being prepared is everybody's responsibility. Leaving behind things that might save your life in favor of luxuries is begging for trouble.
 
Aah. How refreshing. Another thread that turns into ultralight bashing.

I don't think it's wise to hike without some means of making fire, not carrying even a blade.

Ray Jardine, the father of ultralight (according to some) has always recommended carrying emergency firelighting gear and tinder in addition to the everyday use firelighting stuff. He also recommends carrying a SAK classic to shave into wood.
However he isn't recommending this list for people who want to just go out in the bush and practice firemaking/ shelter making/ foraging/ hacking stuff etc. He recommends it for ultralight long distance hiking.

My longest trip has been two weeks. So I'm not a long distance backpacker. Nor would I dare to tell a distance backpacker what to carry until I had some experience in that style of hiking.

If I ever tried one of the triple crown trails I certainly wouldn't be taking my 10" chopper, or my hatchet. I'd probably just take a SAK.

Yes, the deodorant thing is a little odd...

Just a comment on the Utra light bashing. It is tit for tat.

He goes out of his way to be derogatory to the carrying of his perceived unessential gear.

A lot of the U.L followers are very vocal about their disdain for the prepared and over geared. They blend gear carrying with philosophy like a religion. If you don't believe it is like heresy to a lot of them. (lots in B.C.)

I have met so many daytrail runners that talk like they are experienced woodsman because they hamster wheel as fast as they can on maintained trails. How many see very little except their feet and the next step.
They look at the gear and sneer.
This bothers a lot of people that have multi-faceted real outdoor experience.
I have followed a lot of the U.L. ideas within reason but common sense dictates to be a little more prepared IMOP.

I also realize that he is talking about the A.T. trail but his methods of shipping and chasing his gear so he can goretartedlylite cheapens the actual experience. Wonder if he has any lost mail or shipping delays.

He is like an 18th century spoiled brit on safari, using the postal system as his porters!! his method is going beyond caching and resupply.

Love the participant vs spectator quote. very valid.

Here endeth the rant, man that felt good.
 
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thats all cool if you want to be super ul but you should never count on borrowing from others to save you in a jam. most ultra light campers i have run into on trails are very selfish people and i have only met a few who havent made fun of me for carrying a heavy pack and having a knife
 
I don't have any problem whatsoever with the guy being an ultralight hiker. That's fine and dandy.
Sometimes, when I want to have a little home away from home in the woods, I carry a bunch of crap. Sometimes I go with a bedroll and a knife. When I was younger I was gone for days and weeks at a time. Today, I have responsibilities and being gone for days and weeks at a time "camping" (it's the only way people understand what I do) is something that isn't possible. Maybe three to four days AT MOST is what I can stay gone now. So don't tell me about how he's some kind of hero for "doing something most of us can only dream about". Anyhow, getting side-tracked...

What irritates me about this guy is this statement, right here:

"If I need a knife I wait until the next town or borrow one from someone I run into."

It's not even about him not carrying a knife. But the very premise of this statement is telling of his mentality: "I'll save a bunch of weight and if I need something, I'll just borrow it from someone else."
At what point did it become everybody else's responsibility to supply him with stuff he deems "unnecessary"?
I
f he doesn't need something, he doesn't need it at all. If it isn't important enough to pack, it isn't important enough to borrow.

I'm a kind person. If a person saw me off trail and said: "Hey, man, I packed my knife..but I forgot my stone and my blade's as dull as a liberal, you got a stone?" I'd lend him mine in a heartbeat. Might even sharpen his knife for him.
If a guy says: "Hey, man, I forgot to pack my knife--can I borrow yours?" I'll explain that I don't loan knives because of a hard lesson I learned and offer to cut what he needs cut for him.

But when some pontificating little shit preaches the uselessness of a knife, then turns right around and says: "But if I need one I'll just borrow one" he can kiss my ass. Either you need it or you don't.

Am I saying you must carry a knife? It's up to you. But don't get pissy because you don't think they're worth carrying, then ask a guy to borrow his and he tells you to take a flying effing leap.

It's this very kind of mentality--ESTABLISHED TRAIL OR NOT--that causes SAR members to have to be called away from their families at 2 am in the morning.

Ultralight hikers are fine by me. Kitchen Sink hikers are fine by me, too. Because I've been one of both at some time or another. But being prepared is everybody's responsibility. Leaving behind things that might save your life in favor of luxuries is begging for trouble.

that really irritated me too. :grumpy:
 
Deoderant is probably a good firestarter.

No, it's not. In one of my posts above I dealt with that. Out of fairness to the ultra light clown, I decided to test it. Not only will it not take a spark from a Going Gear firesteel, even when crumbled, but it won't even light with a Bic lighter.

Nope. Not only is it not a good fire starter, it can't be used as a fire starter at all.
 
btw, Bob, the Barbies are an investment. :D

LOL!:D

I know they are, Kismet, and some are worth quite a bit of money. It's just that, well, somehow I just can't quite get into them.:D

Now, the full size living ones, that's another story. I've tried to collect the full set.;)
 
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