Bark River has taken $16,000 of My Money

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Bark River is not going anywhere, the quality, selection of knives and customer service is excellent. When people say don't buy anymore knives from MS it will not be MS who is paying the price, it will be his employees when they get laid off. The more people stop buying Bark River knives (which I don' think will happen) the more employees will be let go. So you can rip MS apart all you want but don't stop buying the knives, the only people hurt will be American workers.
P.S. I don't work there, I live 1000 miles away.
 
Bark River is not going anywhere, the quality, selection of knives and customer service is excellent. When people say don't buy anymore knives from MS it will not be MS who is paying the price, it will be his employees when they get laid off. The more people stop buying Bark River knives (which I don' think will happen) the more employees will be let go. So you can rip MS apart all you want but don't stop buying the knives, the only people hurt will be American workers.
P.S. I don't work there, I live 1000 miles away.

Is this your twist on "and the terrorists win"?

It is not like people will just not buy a knife if they have a need or a hankering. They will just buy from somewhere else. MS and his company loses, other companies benefit. Hopefully other companies employing other American Workers.
 
Bark River is not going anywhere, the quality, selection of knives and customer service is excellent. When people say don't buy anymore knives from MS it will not be MS who is paying the price, it will be his employees when they get laid off. The more people stop buying Bark River knives (which I don' think will happen) the more employees will be let go. So you can rip MS apart all you want but don't stop buying the knives, the only people hurt will be American workers.
P.S. I don't work there, I live 1000 miles away.

Not if his knives are imported like some have evidence of.
 
Hopefully other companies employing other American Workers.[/QUOTE]

Thats the problem, to many American knife companies are closing or just shipping the work overseas. As hard as it is, I try to buy products from American workers.
 
Not if his knives are imported like some have evidence of.

Having been to the factory on multiple occasions and seen in detail the assembly process, I'm secure in saying the knives are made in America.
12c27 is imported (obviously), and so are several of the woods used for handle materials. The manufacturing is definitely done right there in Escanaba though.
 
The VERY best part of this thread, and those like it, is that I get to see where people stand in ethics....and can readily add them to the list of those that I will NEVER buy from or sell to.....you made that list, Mr. Callahan!

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

It has nothing to do with ethics. If you completely take the stand that you will not deal with any company that has had some sort of complaint filed against them (legitimate or not), you are either going to be whittling the things you need or you'll choose to take a blind eye to the companies you choose not to investigate. I didn't say I agree with the way it was handled but the bottom line is he got the funds and I'd be willing to bet that you are driving something with parts made in a country that pays next to nothing to it's citizens or carrying a knife right now that has steel that originated in a mine that destroyed a rainforest or some other resource. Walkingdude is right, this topic has turn us against each other and the no reason for that.
 
Not if his knives are imported like some have evidence of.

I guess anything is possible, but I would have to see the evidence. I would think a disgruntled employee would spill the beans on that if he saw "made in China" on a blade he was grinding.
 
Unfortunately, a $16K claim may be too large for small claims court (just guessing) but too small to make it worthwhile to hire an attorney and pursue a lawsuit. I've only had two situations in which the legal system functioned to my benefit.

When my first wife had a miscarriage after we were rear-ended in an automobile I hired an attorney and we were awarded 3X our direct medical expenses. The attorney said the "market value" of the case was much higher, but we felt the offer was reasonable and settled out of court.

Years later, my first wife divorced me after a ski hill accident crippled me for five years. I employed an attorney who negotiated what I thought was a very fair settlement w/o my having to go to court.

Beyond those situations, though I have consulted attorneys on a number of other occasions involving financial or professional damages, it has never seemed that the legal system was geared to help me out. If you become involved in a fight with a large and powerful organization it may take your retirement savings (if you have any) to pursue your complaint. That's too big a gamble for most of us wage earners.

However, I do think it's fair game to take a conflict public. Indeed, in many situations, that may be your only realistic option. The only rule should be that you are careful not to misrepresent the facts of the conflict.

Concerning SS's conflict with MS, my own reaction is that I would be exceedingly careful about entering into any sort of agreement with MS, if I ever decided to do so at all. We all live by our reputation, and reputation is established more by word of mouth (or print) than by any other mechanism.

However, I like Bark River knives, and I feel no compunction to boycott the product based on my awareness of a single possible unethical dealing. As another forumite suggested, I just don't have the time or energy to thoroughly investigate every accusation of fraud that does not involve me directly.

But concerning going public, I saved my career at Los Alamos National Laboratory by going public on a case involving "fraud and abuse of funds". Briefly, several managers attempted to pirate a large $2M contract I was negotiating with General Motors. I successfully resisted the piracy, but was subsequently given a RIF notice by the managers who were involved. Though I found another job at the Lab, the RIF action led to loss of the $2M contract, which I had pursued and negotiated with competitively awarded "program development" funds. So management action made it appear that I had been unsuccessful in my use of the program development funds, whereas, if fact, middle management had first tried to confiscate the contract, and, failing that, had ditched the contract by riffing me.

So, I became a whistle blower and consulted an attorney. It was clear that it would take my life savings to pursue a case in court. But my attorney gave me one piece of advice that proved to be my salvation. "Be very careful," he said, "because the Laboratory will retaliate, and if you later take them to court they will say that their action couldn't have been retaliation because they didn't even know you were a whistleblower."

So, you see the situation. The only protection I could provide for myself was to become one of the best known whistleblowers at the Laboratory. I contacted the press and got significant articles published in the Los Alamos Monitor and The Albuquerque journal. Later I spoke at a joint meeting of the California and New Mexico state legislatures on Laboratory management problems. I continued my campaign for 6 years, and, at one point, was invited to give a talk to congress involving management issues at the Lab. Ultimately, I was able to retire at age 60 with relatively little professional damage.

Bottom line is: Going public with a management misconduct issue saved my ass at a time when no viable legal options were available to me.

I wish you luck SS. Your complaint sounds credible to me. Hope my post is not viewed as being wildly off topic. I felt that a little real world discussion concerning how to combat a case of fraud when available legal options are untenable might be useful.
 
This has actually been a rather sad representation of a knife community. Esav is most certainly correct. A witch hunt is the flavor of the day here in this thread.

Now BRKs are imported. Good grief.:jerkit:
 
It is a witch hunt, and many of the motivations are murky.

This has actually been a rather sad representation of a knife community. Esav is most certainly correct. A witch hunt is the flavor of the day here in this thread.


If it looks like a witch, sounds like a witch, and smells like a witch, well then...
 
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Look in a mirror witchhunter, and tell me that Mike Stewart is the only one being pilloried here., Stop playing the game for a moment, and think about what else is happening. (Hint: you are being used.)
 
Not if his knives are imported like some have evidence of.


It's posts like this that make me not jump on the "i'm not buying BRKT". And it's not the first time I've read blatent sillyness and inaccuracies in a witch hunt thread.

There was a saga awhile back where a dissatisfied customer aired a dispute on a forum. In this case the customer looked like a fool and mike appeared to resolve the issue. I thought of that incident when I found this thread.

My bark river knives are my favorite ones. I was hooked after the first one and I have many brands of knives. I am still dissapointed in this whole situation but there is nothing wrong with the quality of my knives.
 
It is a shame that the question of origin was injected. Snarlslayer's issue was enough, and combined with a complete lack of a response by the felon here and everything he said "over there" was enough for me.

The injection of origin thing doesn't sway me one way or the other. I won't buy another knife from him based on his treatment of Snarlslayer.

Don't buy knives from crooks.
 
Since I was the one that started this thread, I have some responsibility for it. Although I've already said it, I'll say it again in a different way:

I am not after retribution.
I got my money back.

Whether you choose to do business or not do business with Bark River-- at least have the intelligence to make that decision based on evidence that is documented.

Name calling, issuing accusations with no evidence and encouraging others to do so is childish behavior that, in my opinion, is just as abhorrent as Mr. Stewart's business tactics.

The people who have engaged in these things on this thread have made the rest of us look like fools and have turned an honest attempt at obtaining justice into a gang-rape.

Stop. Think.

It's like saying something like this: "That bastard swears too much!"

Steven Youell
 
The irony of this tread is that the guy who got screwed (SnarlSlayer) only made a few post and did get what he was asking, and was not the one lambasting Mike Stewart; in the meantime some forum members have taken it to the next level, and if there’s not some flaming going on here I don’t know what is.

No doubt all the pertinent data came out within the first dozen pages, and SS is not complaining about the outcome.

The fact that the moderators are letting this continue is a bit surprising to me. :thumbdn:




PS – Bravo Steve, we cross posted but your post says it all. :thumbup:
 
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Since I was the one that started this thread, I have some responsibility for it. Although I've already said it, I'll say it again in a different way:

I am not after retribution.
I got my money back.


Congratulations SS. You did what you had to do and it worked. :thumbup:
 
Look in a mirror witchhunter, and tell me that Mike Stewart is the only one being pilloried here., Stop playing the game for a moment, and think about what else is happening. (Hint: you are being used.)


If you genuinely think that I'm unable to decipher multiple texts and the variety of possible motives behind them, then you haven't been paying attention to my intellectually riveting posts whatsoever. :p

No matter what the competing agendas are here, Mike Stewart came across as a complete ass on his own forum when confronted with this issue. His record, which I have investigated since this issue arose, suggests to me that he likely deserves a little taste of witch hunt now and then. When bound and tossed in a vat of water, I wonder if Mike Stewart would sink or float.

(Just a little witch humor there. Please don't take that last line seriously.)

Edited to add: People in the knife community deserve to know whom they're supporting. In that regard, this thread has served a purpose beyond getting SnarlSlayer his money back. Yes, people have thrown around some silly accusations here, but some of the things that have come to light (for some of us) are easily verifiable. I'd rather the thread stand with its silliness than not be here at all. Heck, I vote it be stickied to the top.
 
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The fact that the moderators are letting this continue is a bit surprising to me.
Of course we let threads continue. That's what Bladeforums is here for, discussions. If you don't like the way a discussion is going, ignore it, or participate and say so.

I'd rather the thread stand with its silliness than not be here at all. Heck, I vote it be stickied to the top.
Why would we need to sticky the thread when it pops up to the top constantly anyway? Are you afraid that when the hysteria of the running of the pack is over, no one will want to remember how much fun you had?


* ****** **** ****** *

Steven Youell understood but I see others do not. This has nothing to do with how people decide to deal with Mike Stewart. On Bladeforums it has everything to do with how we deal with each other.

The obvious dishonesty of a few of the more off-the-wall accusations is a minor problem. The deliberate vulgarity and the hostility in dealing with others of different opinions here is toxic.

For someone here to say they will not deal with Bark River is up to them. For them to say they will not deal with someone who will deal with Bark river IS the witchhunt. Salem lives with the ignominy to this day. When will we learn better?
 
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