Benchmade steals the spyderhole

The reasons I ended-up with Spyderco for my first good folder were that I preferred the hole over the stud and I wasn't all that enamored of the axis-lock. This new offering of Benchmade's looks good. Since it would seem BM came by the use of the hole honestly, I might tend to put this one on my list. Don't know anything about the steel, tho. What are its characteristics compared to my favourites: 154cm, ats-34 and vg10?
 
All benchmade said was that they reached an agreement with spyderco.

The agreement could have been, Hey Spyderco we'll fight this in court and Spyderco knew they wouldn't win.

That could be the reason why the usually talkative spyderco factory reps (not just Glesser) have been curiously silent on this thread. They spoke up about about the Blackwood holes and the cold steel design that looked like a civilian. They backed off on the Blackwood holes and Benchmade gives them no credit...why? because the patent expired. Spyderco stopped Benchmade from using the hole in an attempt to call it a trademark, after Benchmade honored their patent for years. That's why the Ascent got an oval hole. There is nothing dishonorable about using a good idea after the patent expires...it's called business in Western society.

The fact the hole as a trademark can be beat in court may be why other companies have been using the hole also.

Spyderco's patent has expired thus their hole is in public domain. Their claim of a trademark is tenuous at best. They've put out plenty of fixed blade knives w/o it. They're true trademark is the spyder...not the hole. We all know that.

By the way, the hole was used by scagel in the 1940s...just a different shape.

One-hand opening with a bandit was around since the late 1960s, spyderco just used a hole instead.

Clips on knives have been around since about the 1940s, they just weren't popular because the clip was for a shirt pocket. Spyderco just made it for the pants.

Serrations have been around a long long time.
 
I'm glad to know were not going to see a big fight over this and I hope its an amicable agreement.

I still don't see why Benchmade, who make great products, would want to look so much like another company, but whatever.
 
As much as Spyderco fans want everyone to belive that the hole automatically makes everyone think "Spyderco", that just isn't the case. They have licensed their "trademark" hole so many times that its more a rental unit than a residence. Face it, there are a lot of non-Spyderco knives out there wearing holes. Why a knife company would license their trademark to other knife companies is beyond my grasp. Money? I go back to their trademark being a rental.
 
If I remember correctly, when Spyderco licences the hole to custom makers they charge almost nothing for it. They don't license it to other companies, though they may have in the past.
 
If its legal and it makes for a better EDC, then I am all for it. I like the hole better than the oval for purely aesthetic reasons. If BM "stole" it, bad on them. I tend to believe the patent expiring makes this a moot point, however. As an opening device, I believe I could make a knife (crappy one) with a hole and be safe, legally. I like both companies, so I hope it was a friendly agreement.
 
The agreement could have been, Hey Spyderco we'll fight this in court and Spyderco knew they wouldn't win
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brownshoe, that doesn't sound like much of an "agreement"
 
Brownshoe is doing nothing more than supposing, just like many others here. He might be right, he might be wrong. I would tend to think it is the later, but I don't know any more than he does.
 
"...the hole was used by Scagel in the 1940s...just a different shape."

Brownshoe I may not be a Geometry Whiz, but I'm pretty certain that there is only one way a hole can be shaped.
 
Halfneck said:
"...the hole was used by Scagel in the 1940s...just a different shape."

Brownshoe I may not be a Geometry Whiz, but I'm pretty certain that there is only one way a hole can be shaped.
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Lol, this whole thread is filled with references to oval holes, comet-shaped holes, round holes, and you're pretty certain there's only ONE way a hole can be shaped?
 
SilverFoxKnows said:
When did Sal say he wouldn't license the round hole? I thought I saw him say, not that long ago, that Boker had been given permission.:confused:
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Yeah... Boker's 2006 damascus model uses the round opening hole.

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The description of it on Boker's web page (www.bokerusa.com) reads:

"2006 Damascus * * * NEW * * *

"Masame Tsukuri" is the Japanese term for forging Damascus steel like wood grain. In Europe, it is called "Wild Damascus", which is used for the first time for this special annual knife. The structure is a natural result of the forging process, rather than an embossing die (tool). The connoisseur of the international cutlery industry will recognize that we used the patented Spyderhole®. Our friends at SPYDERCO in Colorado granted exclusive permission to use it for our annual Damascus knife. That you, Spyderco! Specially selected 300-year-old root wood from a nut tree, air-dried 10 years, is equivalent to our standards for an exclusive collector's series. Presented in a wooden gift box. Limited to 999 pieces worldwide. Overall length 7". Blade length 2 3/4". Weight 4.8 oz."​
 

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It's nice that Boker mentions Spyderco in their add, but when I look at that knife with a hole and "Boker" written across the blade it's just one more example of the hole not being Spyderco's trademark. Boker even calls it "the patented Spyderhole®", as I understand it there is no patent on the hole, just the trademark. Whatever, I'm done here.
 
EDCeeker said:
Don't know anything about the steel, tho. What are its characteristics compared to my favourites: 154cm, ats-34 and vg10?
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It appears very similar to the steel in the Byrd knives (presumably with 1% more Chromium), but is run 3-4 points lower on the rockwell. The Byrd steel is easy to sharpen and holds an edge better than AUS 8, not to mention it takes a really great edge. My EDC G-10 Cara Cara hasn't been sharpened in 2 weeks and still shaves and push cuts newsprint over an inch from where I hold it, though admittedly with fairly light use. No signs of corrosion either. I have my doubts about the Benchmade steel performing as well because it is so much softer. Compared to the others listed, it isn't going to be as wear resistent, but is easier to sharpen. It also should take a much better push cutting edge than ATS 34/154 CM, though VG-10 gets wickedly sharp when there's no burr. I prefer lockbacks, so I think I will stick with my $22 Byrd for my affordable G-10 folder, as opposed to about double for this Benchmade liner lock. The only Benchmade that really interests me now is the Rukus which I used in a passaround and really liked, but I would like to hear Spyderco's take on this whole situation.
 
Hey thats right, I have that model too, didn't even think of it, mine has the hole too not an oval...nice pic by the way, hoping to get a Surefire G2 soon...
 
The frn handled models had round holes just like the AFCK did at first. I had an Eclipse with a round hole, that was a while back.
 
gunmike1 said:
Compared to the others listed, it isn't going to be as wear resistent, but is easier to sharpen. It also should take a much better push cutting edge than ATS 34/154 CM, though VG-10 gets wickedly sharp when there's no burr.
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That's what I was looking for. Thanks!
gunmike1 said:
I prefer lockbacks, ...
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I kinda like the lockback on my Delica 4, but I'm comfortable with the framelock on my CRKT S-2, as well. I wouldn't mind giving a linerlock a try. From the picture, I think I like the looks of that new BM and think I might give it a try. Would prefer one of my favourite steels, but I don't know as I'm going to let that stop me.
 
my local cutlery had this knife in stock today.

... besides the mini-grip why does every benchmade seem bigger than its specs would tell us ?

this knife is cool! good heft and a thick liner lock and sleek coated blade. personally i would prefer uncoated, but i am definately planning to get this in the near future.
 
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