Busse or Fehrman knives?

[Lycosa]

Can I have it??
MC to you!

 

[Mike Fitz]

There is an identical one on the Busse BST forum for what I bought mine for, so I'll give that to you instead.

 

[Lycosa]

Mike---OK! lol. I'm really hankering for my second Busse. It's about time!

 

[cmdr249]

My thanks to Vassili for posting the larger picture and describing the modifications to the GM.

No disrespect intended to you on that but mentioning the modifications that you made to your GW in your post before just "noting" its failure to perform (to your standards) would have saved a lot of speculation and debate.

Absolutely true that it's your GW to modify as you see fit but mentioning that it's a modified GW from the start and providing some more information in the beginning would reduce a lot of what occurred from pages 2 and 3.

 

[nozh2002]

I decide to measure actual angle. Thickness at the edge sholders - 4/64". Edge length - 8/64". So angle will be 2 * arcsin( 0.25 ). See math here:

Actual edge angle should be bigger then 30 degree because edge is convexed a little bit.

So this is my drastically altered paper thin edge.

Thanks, Vassili.

...middle aged mathematician...

 

[nozh2002]

My thanks to Vassili for posting the larger picture and describing the modifications to the GM.

No disrespect intended to you on that but mentioning the modifications that you made to your GW in your post before just "noting" its failure to perform (to your standards) would have saved a lot of speculation and debate.

Absolutely true that it's your GW to modify as you see fit but mentioning that it's a modified GW from the start and providing some more information in the beginning would reduce a lot of what occurred from pages 2 and 3.

I actually sad that it is not modified, but simple sharpened to 30 degree - thickness of the edge from factory cause it to look so wide, but as I described in my previous post - it is slightly bigger then 30 dergee.

Thanks, Vassili.

 

[Cobalt]

good. now that you posted this. 1/8 inch bevel is only at the very bottom of the blade. As you move to the tip the width gets greater and it is closer to 1/4 inch bevel from midpoint on. So what does that make your angle, definitely not 30 included. More like 20 or less which is where the damage happened. makes sense to you. the width of your bevel is not constant, like most well sharpened blades. Yours gets wider as you go towards the tip. Big problem there. Again a screwed up sharpening job?.

I decide to measure actual angle. Thickness at the edge sholders - 4/64". Edge length - 8/64". So angle will be 2 * arcsin( 0.25 ). See math here:

Actual edge angle should be bigger then 30 degree because edge is convexed a little bit.

So this is my drastically altered paper thin edge.

Thanks, Vassili.

...middle aged mathematician...

 

[nozh2002]

I just check same way edge on my MS which has factory edge - I did not sharpen it - 1/32" thickness and 1/32" edge lengch (width) - which mean 60 degree angel on the edge.

Thanks, Vassili.

 

[rpn]

i don't know what happened between page 2 and 4- seems the forum has taken a turn...

If you're still thinking buying a blade, I say start with a ratmandu off the forum and see what you think. very representative of the bussekin...stellar blade, if you don't like it, sell it- easy shmeezy

 

[Cobalt]

I just check same way edge on my MS which has factory edge - I did not sharpen it - 1/32" thickness and 1/32" edge lengch (width) - which mean 60 degree angel on the edge.

Thanks, Vassili.

If the edge width is 1/32's, then the width of that blade is 1/2 inch, which is impossible. The width of the edge of the GW at it's smallest might be 1/8 at best. And I doubt it. By midpoint it is closer to 3/16 to 1/4. The pics tell all. Oh and the indents on the damage pic you show are so small compared to the 1/8 inch width that they would not normally be visible. So why wold you bring it up unless you were up to something.

 

[cmdr249]

I actually sad that it is not modified, but simple sharpened to 30 degree - thickness of the edge from factory cause it to look so wide, but as I described in my previous post - it is slightly bigger then 30 dergee.

Thanks, Vassili.

Not playing a rules lawyer or being finicky, but your definition of modification may be different and the term is subject to interpretation

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/modified

mod⋅i⋅fy   /ˈmɒdəˌfaɪ/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [mod-uh-fahy] Show IPA Pronunciation
verb, -fied, -fy⋅ing.
–verb (used with object) 1. to change somewhat the form or qualities of; alter partially; amend: to modify a contract.

Changing edge geometry is certainly a modification

It is certainly your right to change your knife as you see fit but it putting it out as a representation of a "failure" or "weakness" also carries the responsibility of noting how you changed it prior to pointing out its perceived (by you) weakness.

The designer and manufacturer of the knife has already addressed your modification.

You bear the responsibility of making the modification and reporting that modification clearly from the beginning. You put it out as a general example by saying you didn't modify it. Your knife was changed and then, it is your opinion based on your modification and is unique in both aspects.

Regards.

 

[nozh2002]

Not playing a rules lawyer or being finicky, but your definition of modification may be different and the term is subject to interpretation

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/modified



Changing edge geometry is certainly a modification

It is certainly your right to change your knife as you see fit but it putting it out as a representation of a "failure" or "weakness" also carries the responsibility of noting how you changed it prior to pointing out its perceived (by you) weakness.

The designer and manufacturer of the knife has already addressed your modification.

You bear the responsibility of making the modification and reporting that modification clearly from the beginning. You put it out as a general example by saying you didn't modify it. Your knife was changed and then, it is your opinion based on your modification and is unique in both aspects.

Regards.

I do not want play terminology games here. I think if what you are saying official position of Busse, it should be stated by them directly. Because at leas I expect any knife hold 30 degree edge and if Busse different then it should be some warning - not for 30 degree edges.

And if you insist that resharpening is modification (and it always will change angle to some degree so your quote will be valid (and it will be valid even for using knife I guess - it does change edge does not it?), especially 60 degree Busse angle) then it should be warning - "do not resharpen".

Thanks, Vassili.

 

[hotrodKelley]

I just wanted to express my love of Busse knives again.

There is just something about them that is hard to ignore. They cover a wide range of categories that appeal to so many people also. Most of them are very collectible. All are limited in production. They are affordable. They come in all shapes, sizes, and color combos. You can bet your life on them.

I know that if I had to depend on one knife that could save my life, in any given situation, I would bet on a Busse Combat knife.

Plus being a part of the "Busse family" is fun, and is great overall for your collecting/using experience.

 

[cmdr249]

I do not want play terminology games here. I think if what you are saying official position of Busse, it should be stated by them directly. Because at leas I expect any knife hold 30 degree edge and if Busse different then it should be some warning - not for 30 degree edges.

And if you insist that resharpening is modification (and it always will change angle to some degree so your quote will be valid (and it will be valid even for using knife I guess - it does change edge does not it?), especially 60 degree Busse angle) then it should be warning - "do not resharpen".

Thanks, Vassili.

No, be responsible and forthright about what you do to something before you fault it.

If I thin an edge and it sustains damage it is likely my fault.

Point is, you induced it and then tried to imply that it wouldn't hold an edge.

This is what happen to my Busse Game Warden Blck/Tan G10

After few minutes on working with this wood

I was trying to get rid of many holes where crickets can hide from my dragon. It was not of course gentle cutting - I use it with force, but using only hands. However this is not steel pipe but wood. Dry wood of course, but you may see damage - areas of depression etc.

...I guess I was not patient enough to wait while it get sharpen back...

This is just an example, but in many cases I notice that Busse get dull relatively quick. Of course it is tough and may be used for steel pipe batoning as Noss4 shows - so to me this is steel you can always relay on and it will not break etc, but in terms of edge holding it is not the best obviously.

Thanks, Vassili.

No where did you mention that you had thinned and modified the edge. You only mentioned it after pressed for more information.

You have still failed to address other posters comments as well.

Regards

 

[nozh2002]

No, be responsible and forthright about what you do to something before you fault it.

If I thin an edge and it sustains damage it is likely my fault.

Point is, you induced it and then tried to imply that it wouldn't hold an edge.


No where did you mention that you had thinned and modified the edge. You only mentioned it after pressed for more information.

You have still failed to address other posters comments as well.

Regards

Well you can blame in this and that - I do not care. And change your tone you are not my principal and I am not your student.

It seems like we are in agreement that Busse got damaged at 30 degree edge on that wood.

Now if you think that this is unreasonably thin edge then tell what edge you think is proper to INFI, because to me this is something new. To my knowledge 30 degree is standard and usual angle for blade.

Thanks, Vassili

 

[cmdr249]

Well you can blame in this and that - I do not care. And change your tone you are not my principal and I am not your student.

It seems like we are in agreement that Busse got damaged at 30 degree edge on that wood.

Now if you think that this is unreasonably thin edge then tell what edge you think is proper to INFI, because to me this is something new. To my knowledge 30 degree is standard and usual angle for blade.

Thanks, Vassili

Your read of my tonality is an impressive ability.

We are in agreement that you damaged your edge, nothing more. You modified it and therefore you are responsible for the result due to your modification.

I think case and point is made:

The reprofiled edge on that knife is ridiculously thin and the statments made about INFI, based on this drastically altered edge, are completely irresponsible!!!. . .

If we thought that paper thin edges were the best performance geometry for INFI, we would be putting them on ourselves.

As for edge holding, we are still the only manufacturer to have cut over 2,700 pieces of 1 inch hemp rope in a "LIVE" demonstration at BLADE Show 1999. . . NO other manufacturer has even attempted to duplicate this test.

It's been almost 10 years of waiting. . . .

So, while we're waiting for this to happen. . . .

Let's Drink!!!! :thumbup:

Jerry



.

Prima facie.

No more. Done.

 

[nozh2002]

Your read of my tonality is an impressive ability.

We are in agreement that you damaged your edge, nothing more. You modified it and therefore you are responsible for the result due to your modification.

I think case and point is made:


Prima facie.

No more. Done.

You point is:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
I modify Busse Game Warden blade by resharpening it to 30 degree angle and it got damaged as result of this, which is completely my fault because I should not resharpen Busse to 30 degree angle.

Every damage caused to edge after modification it by resharpening to 30 degree is my responsibility. I should not complain about edge holding after modifying it - resharpening to 30 degree.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Your point is taken. No more. Done

Thanks, Vassili.

 

[1kimo4u]

I asked on a couple other forums and got no responses. I was told this was the place to come. Nice forum BTW.

I am new to the quality knife arena. I have had a Cold Steel Trail Master for years, and recently picked up a Recon Scout. The Recon Scout says made in China which means its time for a new brand of knife.

I am looking for a hard use knife, and want something that will last a life time of abuse. I live in Wyoming, and go to Montana often in wooded areas.

A friend of mine has a new Fehrman Final Judgement with two sheaths for $375 that I am thinking about buying. It is in the same price range as a Busse of the same size so I want to buy once, cry once. I cant afford expensive knives. I am used to have $2000 custom 1911's and Browning Hi Powers, just never high end knives.

All responses welcome, help a noob out.

P.S. If there is something you dont want to post here, feel free to e mail me.

dbltap45acp@hotmail.com

a equivilent size busse (ffbm, cgfbm, nmfbm) will cost you more then the fehrman final or extreme judgement. goodluck on your knife quest!

 

[Grimspoon]

nozh2002, as far as I'm concerned if the knife isn't in factory condition then it's modified. You didn't lightly sharpen your blades, you put a ridiculous edge on them.

The failing which you've experienced is not the fault of the knife, manufacturer or steel used. It's the fault of the user and the modifications that were applied. The blame rests entirely on you.




If you had started off this conversation with "look at the retarded things I've done to my knives, and now they're broken..." nobody would be arguing with you.

 

[Cobalt]

Well you can blame in this and that - I do not care. And change your tone you are not my principal and I am not your student.

It seems like we are in agreement that Busse got damaged at 30 degree edge on that wood.

Now if you think that this is unreasonably thin edge then tell what edge you think is proper to INFI, because to me this is something new. To my knowledge 30 degree is standard and usual angle for blade.

Thanks, Vassili

no we are not in agreement and your full of crap. You treat others like they do not exist and are beneath you. the fact is that what you do and say is all wrong including your testing results. You cannot answer my comments because you have no where to go. your ANGLES are closer to 20 DEGREES and you know it. Actually considering that the edge is nearly 1/4 inch in width where the damage is, those indents are not very big. Quite impressive..You have instigated this crap in the past against Busse and INFI and your trying to do it again. ...