Canadian knife law specifics.

Probable cause is not sufficient to authorize a search of your person in Canada.

I wish people who don't know the law would stop posting about it.
 
Stab, I know the feeling, a SOG PE2 makes a great bread and butter knife for snacking on round loaves.

Welsh, Then what is sufficient? permission? a warrant? if you are speaking in regards to my earlier comment, then yes I understand that there are "Rights" involved, and yes my understanding of the law might be incorrect, by all means, I'm open to new info. But the reality is that depending on the situation, standing your ground may be seen as confrontational, and the officer might not like that. At which point you are relying solely on their professionalism. I've found that while I trust people to be professional, pushing them to that limit is a bad idea.
 
gadgetgeek said:
Welsh, Then what is sufficient? permission? a warrant?
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In order to search your person an officer has to either arrest you, or detain you for investigation.

Arresting you requires "reasonable and probable grounds" -- specific evidence -- to believe that you've committed a particular offence. On arrest the police can search you for evidence related to that offence.

Detaining you for investigation requires "articulable grounds" to believe you've been involved in a particular offence. On detaining you, police can search you if there is reasonable grounds to believe the search is necessary to protect officer safety, and only to the extent that search is necessary.

I realize this sounds a lot like "probable cause" but in fact the threshold for the police to search you is fairly high. In both cases they need to be investigating an actual offence. It can't be the suspicion of an offence. "If he's got a knife in his pocket, that's an offence" doesn't cut it. The offence has to exist before the search. Also, even the lower standard of "articulable grounds" requires more than mere suspicion: the police need actual evidence to connect you to an offence before they can detain you.

Here's a real world example: police get a report of kids waving a machete around in a park. Two officers attend the scene and observe, from a distance, a group of kids. One of the kids is cutting long grass with a machete. The cops drive around to the other side of the park and find a couple of the kids leaving. They stop them, question them, and take their backpack. They search the backpack as part of their investigative detention, for officer safety, and find a machete, as well as a number of other weapons including prohibited weapons.

In this case, charges were dismissed on several grounds. First, the search was held to be unnecessary to officer safety, as the kids could be separated from the backpack without searching it. Secondly (and more importantly), the court found that police were not investigating any particular offence. Possessing a machete in a park is not a crime, cutting grass with a machete is not a crime, and there was nothing to suggest the kids had any criminal purpose. There was no justification for an investigative detention, and no justification for the search, so the charges were thrown out.

Another real-world example: police are called to investigate a break-in. An officer stops a car near the scene. He notes a black duffel bag in the back seat and forms the suspicion that it contains burglary tools and stolen items. He asks the driver if he can look in the bag; the driver refuses to allow a search. The driver is not the owner of the car and is only able to give the owner's first name. The officer forms the suspicion the car is stolen. He orders the driver to get out of the car, and at that time sees that the driver has a knife in his pocket. He searches the driver and finds said knife, and also a Gerber multitool. He arrests the driver for carrying a concealed weapon, and then searches the black duffel bag and finds a quantity of drugs.

All charges against the driver were dismissed. The knives were held to be (a) not weapons and (b) not concealed; the search of the bag was thrown out because the arrest was made without reasonable and probable grounds to believe the driver had committed the offence of carrying a concealed weapon. Also (importantly), the court noted that the officer had not confirmed that the reported burglary had actually occurred, and therefore had no grounds to believe the driver was in any way connected to any particular offence.

That should give an idea of what's required for the police to search your person in Canada. "Probable cause" makes the standard sound very low. In fact, they need real evidence that an offence has been committed and that you're connected to it. Anything less is a fishing trip.
 
Very good useful post Welsh.

Although I did not use the correct term or definition, it does go in the direction of what I was saying...

Gaston
 
That's all well and good. And thanks for the extra info. I don't think we disagree as such. Each person has to take the realities of their circumstance into account.
 
Does this mean i can carry my native american made knife for tradition reasons and my sword of aragorn for cosplay and decoration
 
As long as you carry your treaty card, and your convention ID badge. But check your local regulations, many conventions do not permit blades with live edges, and carrying a sword may be considered a breach of the peace, depending on your location.

Basically, don't be an idiot.
 
Thanks for the education! I have a quick question !
What If I carry a Knife sword in the Wilderness ??? Is it okay to carry it if I'm hiking or camping in the wilderness ? mountains ?
thanks
 
Abdel said:
Thanks for the education! I have a quick question !
What If I carry a Knife sword in the Wilderness ??? Is it okay to carry it if I'm hiking or camping in the wilderness ? mountains ?
thanks
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We already told you in the other thread that it's legal and not an effective defense against a bear or cougar.

Reading the way you compose sentences it appears you're European? And you're planning a trip to visit Alberta?
 
A very disappointing event in Quebec, Canada:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/shawn-soucy-riverside-board-knife-expelled-1.3556016

if any of you knife-nuts are in high-school, make sure you leave ur knife at home kids. When I was going to highschool way back, there wasn't such a strict rule and there some guys were actually showing off a couple of folders. Of course, if violent bullies were showing off their knives it would've raised a red flag, but just normal kids who would actually make use would be just fine. The knife involved looks to be a traditional slip-joint, which does not fall under prohibited weapon, and from the picture, the blade length seems less than 3 inches - seems like a legitimate tool. We've become so over-sensitive nowadays, and the ruling in this case is just ridiculous. Common sense and compassions out the door.

So what's the point? none of these legal discussions matter, even if you're not criminally charged by the crown, you can still be punished by some other body - in this case, the school board, but it could be anyone, like your employer, city, municipality, membership club, any sort of association or whatever it is out there with a bad perception towards knives.

Anyway, to each his own, but be very conservative IMO, this isn't the same Canada 10 years ago.
 
I want to know how they found it in his bag...
The rules they're allowed to search under trouble me more.
 
I don't think it specifies in the article, maybe one of his classmates saw it and reported it... The lockers are pretty close to each other so standing next to you it's fairly easy to see next person's belongings throughout the day, going to your locker between every class and lunchtime, etc.
 
Zaner01 said:
The Criminal Code defines prohibited weapons as follows:
""prohibited weapon" means

(a) a knife that has a blade that opens automatically by gravity or centrifugal force or by hand pressure applied to a button, spring or other device in or attached to the handle of the knife, or

(b) any weapon, other than a firearm, that is prescribed to be a prohibited weapon."

A knife that you can flip open by flicking your wrist is, therefore, a prohibited weapon.

The Shallot is not prohibited. It is an assisted opener, and because you have to apply pressure to the blade (rather than a device attached to the handle) for it to open, it is outside the definition above.

Flippers are not prohibited, either. You have to apply finger pressure to the flipper to get the blade partially open, before flicking the knife open. As long as the pivot screw is tight enough that the blade cannot be opened by centrifugal force alone, the knife is legal.

Note that you can take a perfectly legal knife and make it a prohibited weapon by loosening the pivot screw. So, as with most things in the Criminal Code, it's not just the specific knife that's illegal so much as how you use it.
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I've heard mix things about how you can carry a folding knife though and being a canadian citizen I'm quite shocked how not even I know which is true. So I'm looking here for help as not even the criminal code laws are helpful.

Is it true that you legally have to have a folding knife visible at all times in public places like a fixed blade ((like pocket click showing)) or can one just shove there pocket into a deep pocket with a pocket organizer along with wallet and stuff and not worry? Basicly I've heard if the knife isn't visible in some aspect it'd illegal just like a fixed blade must always be visible and sheathed. Idk if this is true or not so any help would be awesome I've been a little extra careful to always clip it now as I'm usually lazy and just like to stuff stuff into a jacket pocket or something and not worry about it till I need it again.
 
Fupse R. said:
I've heard mix things about how you can carry a folding knife though and being a canadian citizen I'm quite shocked how not even I know which is true. So I'm looking here for help as not even the criminal code laws are helpful.

Is it true that you legally have to have a folding knife visible at all times in public places like a fixed blade ((like pocket click showing)) or can one just shove there pocket into a deep pocket with a pocket organizer along with wallet and stuff and not worry? Basicly I've heard if the knife isn't visible in some aspect it'd illegal just like a fixed blade must always be visible and sheathed. Idk if this is true or not so any help would be awesome I've been a little extra careful to always clip it now as I'm usually lazy and just like to stuff stuff into a jacket pocket or something and not worry about it till I need it again.
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Nope. Knife laws are municipal. For example you can't have a visible pocket clip in Calgary or a visible knife in Montreal.

There is no single over riding rule for the whole country.
 
k1ssthecook said:
Hello, I cutrently work in law enforcement, and there is some massive misinformation on some of these posts. First of all, conceal carry of anthing that can be construed as a weapon is criminal. The only exceptions I can see would be a traditional folder/SAK, etc.

Second, you all are forgetting S.88 of the Criminal Code which states that a person is not allowed to possess any weapon (or imitation thereof) that is dangerous to the public peace. This means that carrying anything that can fit into the definition of being a weapon is illegal. Furthermore, if it is concealed it is even more illegal (this includes backpacks).

SO, carrying your rambo knife in the city is a bad idea, because there is no reason why one should carry such a blade in the city. I carry a knife every day, and find that they are invaluable tools. I carry a native, or pm2 on my day to day business. They aren't uber tactical and aren't offensive. I woild recommend any number of folding knives for a completely legal edc blade.

Fixed blades aren't necessarily illegal either. An izula in a belt sheath is something I would consider reasonable, but that depends on context. If you are a law abiding everyday guy and you have a knife, then have a great time. If you are caysing issues and are carrying a knife, then you are going to make some new friends...
Click to expand...
k1ssthecook said:
Hello, I cutrently work in law enforcement, and there is some massive misinformation on some of these posts. First of all, conceal carry of anthing that can be construed as a weapon is criminal. The only exceptions I can see would be a traditional folder/SAK, etc.

Second, you all are forgetting S.88 of the Criminal Code which states that a person is not allowed to possess any weapon (or imitation thereof) that is dangerous to the public peace. This means that carrying anything that can fit into the definition of being a weapon is illegal. Furthermore, if it is concealed it is even more illegal (this includes backpacks).

SO, carrying your rambo knife in the city is a bad idea, because there is no reason why one should carry such a blade in the city. I carry a knife every day, and find that they are invaluable tools. I carry a native, or pm2 on my day to day business. They aren't uber tactical and aren't offensive. I woild recommend any number of folding knives for a completely legal edc blade.

Fixed blades aren't necessarily illegal either. An izula in a belt sheath is something I would consider reasonable, but that depends on context. If you are a law abiding everyday guy and you have a knife, then have a great time. If you are caysing issues and are carrying a knife, then you are going to make some new friends...
Click to expand...
Hello I had this long humors but honest message as I wanted to ask you something but because I'm typing on my phone I accidently clicked report instead of post reply, I hope you will forgive me and that nothing goes wrong with your post as it's very informal and well it shouldn't have been reported I apologize again.

I'll cut straight to the question this time. I was told by a friend of mine that if my pocket knife ((a folder obviously, benchmades, victorinox, sogs, and a few others I have a growing collection)) aren't visible then it's a Criminal offense. So I've been extra careful now when putting my knife back to make sure the clip clips to my pocket and stays visible. I'm not sure though if this is true and would like clarification. Do pocket knives have to be visible too like a fixed blade does on one's sheath at all times? Or can one just lazily dump his folder into the bottom of his pocket or jacket pocket on these insanely cold weather's? 🥶 I always carry a pocket knife with me as they are so useful but the last thing I want to do is end up doing something illegal so I eagerly await your reply.

Thank you for being so helpful by the way 😁 stay safe and have a great day.
 
Danke42 said:
Nope. Knife laws are municipal. For example you can't have a visible pocket clip in Calgary or a visible knife in Montreal.

There is no single over riding rule for the whole country.
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Is that American law? I may be mistaken but I could have sworn this was a canadian thread. It said so on the Google link 😓edit: I skimmed that I'm sorry a little sleep deprived I just noticed the Canadian named places, I never knew canada was so diverse too in laws I had read that it was supposed to be equal all through out the country
 
Danke42 said:
Nope. Knife laws are municipal. For example you can't have a visible pocket clip in Calgary or a visible knife in Montreal.

There is no single over riding rule for the whole country.
Click to expand...
Mind telling me how to research then whether it is supposed to be visible or not based on where I am? Currently I'm in bc but who knows in the future, I'd like to be able to know what the laws are so I stay on the correct side.
 
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