Chris Reeve Destrution Test On Youtube?

[nullack]

Hi Broos,

Seems your referring to the charpy v notch test for measuring notch toughness. In the standard charpy test no notch is cut and that looks at impact toughness. The third type as you outline is fracture toughness,but I consider that better tested by compact tension.

The plastic deformation of the samples was plain to see in the video. In that way I think its a good demonstration of the differences between yield strength and the different types of toughness.

 

[Karda]

I love these threads, as those that I need to put on ignore are obvious.

BTW, Karda have you done you own tests yet?

~puts on ignore~

adding the right ones sure makes this a very short topic

 

[Phil Elmore]

Indeed it does, indeed it does. I do think you were right in pointing out that a thread like this one really lays bare the characters of the people involved, though. Noss and his followers definitely come out the worse for wear.

 

[Karda]

Indeed it does, indeed it does. I do think you were right in pointing out that a thread like this one really lays bare the characters of the people involved, though. Noss and his followers definitely come out the worse for wear.

Agreed X 10
And i do believe that they keep this going, Just to keep the spotlight shining.

 

[Phil Elmore]

Well, yes; to people like that, any dissent is deemed heresy, and this is how they justify the vitriol hurled at any with whom they disagree. Fairly typical groupthink, really.

 

[Karda]

From an engineering perspective, how can you watch all that going on at once, and know what caused the failure? Standard practice is to isolate a behavior or failure mode to analyze it, not introducing multiple failure modes at once and then trying to figure out why it failed. This seems the opposite of what I know to be good engineering.

Most engineers use the charpy test to measure fracture toughness. This test is known to give widely varying results even when great attention to detail is used. Are you familiar with how fracture toughness can be obtained? I do not think having another misunderstood term bandied around all the time here will help anyone's understanding, especially one that is even more difficult to understand than the standard measure of toughness.

http://www.twi.co.uk/content/kscsw011.html

Very good points, all of it, and very well stated, broos!
Hits the Nail on the head about the type of testing noss4 does.
and why it is purely entertainment for notoriety.
BTW, i noticed noss4 excused himself again.

 

[Broos]

Hi Broos,

Seems your referring to the charpy v notch test for measuring notch toughness. In the standard charpy test no notch is cut and that looks at impact toughness. The third type as you outline is fracture toughness,but I consider that better tested by compact tension.

The plastic deformation of the samples was plain to see in the video. In that way I think its a good demonstration of the differences between yield strength and the different types of toughness.

Thanks for the reply. Every charpy test I've heard of uses notched specimens. Some with cracks in the notch, some without. Never with no notch. Charpy or Izod. none of these tests use multiple impacts - there is only one impact to failure, done to numerous specimens. With multiple impacts you will be testing something other than the technical definition of toughness. There are a number of different tests tailored to different materials, and I'm not aware of all of them, so I'm not trying to be antagonistic.

http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=2763

I am not aware of a real clear line distinguishing between the kinds of toughness you mention. Toughness itself is somewhat of a controversial topic with the scientists, so I did not think that the lines between them was clear and defined as you infer. My professors questioned the validity of using the charpy test to measure toughness without a very large sample size, and what we used the test to determine was the transition temperature, and the ductility of the specimen (20 years ago). If you have any good info on this please share.

I understand your last comment from a perspective that you can tell the difference between deforming and brittle failure, but once you deform the steel you are no longer testing the factory knife - you are testing a damaged knife that has been work hardened and likely otherwise damaged. You would then be testing how well a damaged knife holds up to continued hammer blows. It will give you an indication of the wisdom of hitting your knife repeatedly with a hammer, but I don't think it will tell much more than that.

 

[Kiah]

Indeed it does, indeed it does. I do think you were right in pointing out that a thread like this one really lays bare the characters of the people involved, though. Noss and his followers definitely come out the worse for wear.

Well, yes; to people like that, any dissent is deemed heresy, and this is how they justify the vitriol hurled at any with whom they disagree. Fairly typical groupthink, really.

I haven't read this entire thread, so I'll take these last two quotes as an example, since I'm fairly certain every other post of yours in this thread is pretty much the same. This also pertains to the thread you locked.

You continue to refer to anyone with a differing opinion on this matter as "Noss's followers". Implying that anyone in disagreement with you is a mindless sheep only looking for some idol to latch on to. Do you you really feel that you are the only one who can form their own opinion on this, and everyone else is either a supporter of you or a minion of Noss?

Believe it or not, most of us can think on our own without your or Noss's will being considered. Your posts in these threads are redundant. Refer to everyone in disagreement as a follower or worshiper, and remphasize your point with everyone who does agree.

The "heresy" comment is priceless. Labeling anyone not in agreement as a zealot, while reffering to those people as morally repugnant is a wonderful hypocrisy. Noss seems to be staying out of these threads for the most part. You on the other hand can't seem to get enough. It begs the question Phil, who exactly is looking for followers?

 

[Phil Elmore]

You're free to assume things. Lots of people do.

 

[greater]

I don't know about all this hoopla I hear going back and forth but I am thankful for Nosse's knife tests they are very useful.

Thank you very much Noss I do learn from your tests and I really enjoy browsing your website from time to time. I hope you enjoy what you do and encourage you to keep on going if you do.

 

[greater]

Furthermore Noss your website introduction, explainations, and presentations, and are one the most honest and straight forward I have seen anywhere.

The attitude presented on your site may be humorous and somewhat sarcastic but it also reveals underlying strong moral values that are unfortunately very very hard to find.

Don't let dull, boring, money grubbing deadheads with zero sense of humor discourage you.

 

[greater]

I would like to donate some money to your cause Noss. After reading this thread I am also contemplating sending you a knife for one of your tests. It would have to be reeeeeeeeeeeal darling of the knife community something popular and hypeee.

I want to see how long it takes for you to smash it to shit and please post it. Knifemakers beware your knives may be top quality, but take care not to make any outlandish claims about them in hyped up advertisements.

 

[Phil Elmore]

I would like to donate some money to your cause Noss. After reading this thread I am also contemplating sending you a knife for one of your tests. It would have to be reeeeeeeeeeeal darling of the knife community something popular and hypeee.

I want to see how long it takes for you to smash it to shit and please post it. Knifemakers beware your knives may be top quality, but take care not to make any outlandish claims about them in hyped up advertisements.

This is a great illustration of the problem.

 

[Morales]

I haven't read this entire thread, so I'll take these last two quotes as an example, since I'm fairly certain every other post of yours in this thread is pretty much the same. This also pertains to the thread you locked.

You continue to refer to anyone with a differing opinion on this matter as "Noss's followers". Implying that anyone in disagreement with you is a mindless sheep only looking for some idol to latch on to. Do you you really feel that you are the only one who can form their own opinion on this, and everyone else is either a supporter of you or a minion of Noss?

Believe it or not, most of us can think on our own without your or Noss's will being considered. Your posts in these threads are redundant. Refer to everyone in disagreement as a follower or worshiper, and remphasize your point with everyone who does agree.

The "heresy" comment is priceless. Labeling anyone not in agreement as a zealot, while reffering to those people as morally repugnant is a wonderful hypocrisy. Noss seems to be staying out of these threads for the most part. You on the other hand can't seem to get enough. It begs the question Phil, who exactly is looking for followers?

Thanks kiahs for this post (while thanking you for it, makes me one of Noss's disciples or worse), this thread has been filled with a LOT of useless, meaningless, redundant posts. I wish it would be in W&C so there'd be some fun parts in it.
And thanks to broos and nullack as both of you are trying to talk about the tests in a sensible, nonhysterical way and adding some value to this thread.:thumbup:

 

[Lycosa]

Will this Thread die Now?

 

[Morales]

Will this Thread die Now?

Though I'd like to see a discussion of the different types of toughness, I hope it does. It's already smelling...

 

[greater]

Smart Phil quoted me and stated

Quote:
Originally Posted by greater
I would like to donate some money to your cause Noss. After reading this thread I am also contemplating sending you a knife for one of your tests. It would have to be reeeeeeeeeeeal darling of the knife community something popular and hypeee.

I want to see how long it takes for you to smash it to shit and please post it. Knifemakers beware your knives may be top quality, but take care not to make any outlandish claims about them in hyped up advertisements.


Smart Phil says "This is a great illustration of the problem."

I disagree this is an illustration of supporting a great community service that would inform and enlighten the common working man as to what should be expected from various types of knives in different situations. For example if one knife fails a simple 3 lb hammer baton test in a workshop what would happen if someone needed to rely on it for making firewood in a below zero environment where the blade would be even more prone to cracking.

It might be a great cutter but I would hate to have it fail on someone who's life may have depended on it because it's advertising gave him the impression it would be up to the task if needed.


__________________

 

[greater]

I say get the right tool for the right job. How is one going to know what the right tool is if every manufacturer is allowed to promote their tools as the tool that can do it all. I get the impression your leaning toward allowing most advertising claims by manufacturers to remain unchallenged by anyone.

That is not my idea of freedom or common sense. If someone advertises their knife as very tough and someone like Noss is able to cause it to fail relatively easy, who is the one that failed to meet the consumer's need or expectations?

This same kind of mentality of not challenging popular impressions and hype (ie less than truthful) is the same type of garbage that has got this Country into an economic recession

 

[STAGE 2]

In other words, I was defending the man by pointing out that he is not as big a "dumb@ass" as the poster in question thought him to be, because he is not necessarily throwing away his own money to engage in his knife-breaking. But of course you are so rabid to defend him that you view any and all comment from anyone not solidly in your camp as some sort of vast conspiracy of trolling and defamation.

Ah yes. Its inconceivable that anyone could have any other interpretation from the statement of a man who has consistently bashed Noss in this thread and started an entirely different thread for the same purpose.

How silly of me not to see that you were coming to his rescue

 

[STAGE 2]

Indeed it does, indeed it does. I do think you were right in pointing out that a thread like this one really lays bare the characters of the people involved, though. Noss and his followers definitely come out the worse for wear.

I posted this in practac but I think it has equal if not more bearing here. From your own website....

Elmore, speaking without hesitation as though having spoken on the subject many times, said, “I wish that they would argue with me about my actual opinions. I am prepared for that, but most of my critics have issues not with what I’ve said and what I do, or don’t do, but with what they think I've said and what they think I do…or don't.”

So here you are complaining that people don't discuss issues with you, but merely engage in ad hominem attackes about who you are or what they think you've done.

Ironically, every single one of your posts here, and even better, your other entire thread was devoted to Noss the person, with commentary on the people who may find his tests useful.

Me thinks thou doth protest too much.