Critiquing~Is there really a problem?

RogerP said:
In this case, the lashing out has come after much poking by the party in question. I actually thought STeven showed pretty good restraint up to that point.

Roger
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bdws1975 said:
my comments didn't really contribute.

sorry for the deletion.

Brett
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I also thought STeven was showing restraint.
bdws1975 started throwing out insults to collectors in general with post #16 of this thread (above) which he appropriately deleted but then continued. Seems some come here just to start conflict. :confused:
 
Kevin Jones said:
I also thought STeven was showing restraint.
bdws1975 started throwing out insults to collectors in general with post #16 of this thread (above) which he appropriately deleted but then continued. Seems some come here just to start conflict. :confused:
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I wasn't here to start conflict and should not have posted.

I apologize for my intrusion and will delete my posts.

I would be happy to discuss my issue in private rather than air it here.

Again, sorry for my intrusion,

Brett
 
bdws1975 said:
I wasn't here to start conflict and should not have posted.

I apologize for my intrusion and will delete my posts.

I would be happy to discuss my issue in private rather than air it here.

Again, sorry for my intrusion,

Brett
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Accepted Brett.
We are trying to be more civil to one another here, myself included.

Thanks
 
Don Cowles said:
This is the thread that sticks in my mind when I consider posting a knife here. I guess I *am* intimidated.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=364411&pp=20
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Don,

I don’t write “flatter than a pancake” anymore.;)

This is a tough one…sorry…..I guess I don’t feel compelled to comment on everything anymore. If you want to post pictures of your work without me chiming in…I'll shut up::thumbup:....

It is pretty sad that you *are* intimidated to post your work.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Very good example Don, and those are the sorts of threads that people like myself, who are starting out making their first few knifes, see and which stick in our minds. There's a good reason a vast majority of us knife makers who arent "big names" and in books and magazines etc dont post here, even when we post a lot in the knife makers forums. When people like Don and Bruce Bump are intimidated to post here, just think how us makers just getting our feet underneath us feel?

At a knife show (NCCA show in marlboro) last november I had with me some knives I was working on and I had a Collector (note the cap letters) tell me point blank that my blades will never be worth anything so there's no reason for anyone to ever buy anything I make. It took a lot of restraint to just walk away and not start an argument about how everyone's got to start somewhere. Instead I took a walk to the otherside of the show room, had a great conversation with George Dailey, Paul Jarvis, and Jim Siska, got some good critiques of what I can do to make my blades better and what I was already doing that was good.

I think that's the general 'perception' of this forum versus the maker's forum in general.
 
Justin.Mercier said:
I think that's the general 'perception' of this forum versus the maker's forum in general.
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Pretty accurate "perception"....I would call it the reality of the situation. Not a lot of buyers over in the "Maker's" Forums proper, compared to here, either.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
There isn't much you can do with an empty skull, with no skin and nothing inside,... except, hit with a hammer and watch it bounce around. :D
 
Tai Goo said:
There isn't much you can do with an empty skull, with no skin and nothing inside,... except, hit with a hammer and watch it bounce around. :D
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If your name is Tai, you can fill it full of smoke.:D

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Justin.Mercier said:
Very good example Don, and those are the sorts of threads that people like myself, who are starting out making their first few knifes, see and which stick in our minds. There's a good reason a vast majority of us knife makers who arent "big names" and in books and magazines etc dont post here, even when we post a lot in the knife makers forums. When people like Don and Bruce Bump are intimidated to post here, just think how us makers just getting our feet underneath us feel?

At a knife show (NCCA show in marlboro) last november I had with me some knives I was working on and I had a Collector (note the cap letters) tell me point blank that my blades will never be worth anything so there's no reason for anyone to ever buy anything I make. It took a lot of restraint to just walk away and not start an argument about how everyone's got to start somewhere. Instead I took a walk to the otherside of the show room, had a great conversation with George Dailey, Paul Jarvis, and Jim Siska, got some good critiques of what I can do to make my blades better and what I was already doing that was good.

I think that's the general 'perception' of this forum versus the maker's forum in general.
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Justin,
Kudos to you for not stooping to his level. Just because someone buys knives doesn't really give them a right to be a dick, or stifle a new maker. If he wants to get down and dirty in the shop, he is welcome to do so, but until then, he can continue standing on the other side of the table, which we both know is not where we want to be, but where he is forced to live.

***edit: This response is in reference to the collector who Justin was referring to, and shouldn't be taken as any kind of hard line between collectors and makers or any "us" vs "them" kind of attitude. Its just advice on how to not get discouraged by someone thoughtless and rude who has probably never lived in his shoes.***
 
Don brought up a good post to prove a lot of points.

To bad he got kicked for it with Kohai's comment "It is pretty sad that you *are* intimidated to post your work." I think anyone would be intimidated by Don's rude reception and hijacked thread.

It's obvious that Kohai likes attention even more than he claims TaiGoo does. I'd classify Tai as an imp, and Kohai as mean.

There is a big difference between being honest and being mean. If I called a woman flat as a pancake, she'd be insulted, however if I said she was not well endowed and that's cool because I like her small rounded rump, nobody would be insulted. If her chest was bigger, she wouldn't have that nice rump. In Don's thread, the term "flat as a pancake" is used as a derogative term for his knife. However, a flat knife fits into Don's sheath concept of easy pocket carry. You have to give a little, rounded swelled handle...to get a little, easy pocket carry of a fixed blade. That's called a design trade off. But guess Kohai may not know as much about knife design as he thinks he does.
 
David Schott said:
Justin,
Kudos to you for not stooping to his level. Just because someone buys knives doesn't really give them a right to be a dick, or stifle a new maker. If he wants to get down and dirty in the shop, he is welcome to do so, but until then, he can continue standing on the other side of the table, which we both know is not where we want to be, but where he is forced to live.
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David,

I agree with you that ENCOURAGING new makers is important, and simply, is a good thing to do.

However, the tone that you are setting with what YOU write emphasizes an unnecessary and counterproductive line between maker and collector/buyer. Many collectors HAVE made knives, and equipped with this understanding of what it takes, have chosen to never make another.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Kohai999 said:
If your name is Tai, you can fill it full of smoke.:D

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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Here, let me rephrase it for you,... I also left out the word "thick".

There isn't much you can do with a THICK empty skull, with no skin and nothing inside,... except, hit with a hammer and watch it bounce around,... or maybe put a candle inside. :D
 
satisfying it may be for some....a post from Brownshoe will ALWAYS be like swimming in a pond of sewage.....full of bacteria, virus and refuse.

If you want proof, do a search.

There was no slam towards Don, no need, there was only qualified contrition.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Face it folks!

You just can't keep a good SKULL down! :D

image.php
 
Kohai999 said:
David,

I agree with you that ENCOURAGING new makers is important, and simply, is a good thing to do.

However, the tone that you are setting with what YOU write emphasizes an unnecessary and counterproductive line between maker and collector/buyer. Many collectors HAVE made knives, and equipped with this understanding of what it takes, have chosen to never make another.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
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This is true, but I cannot picture someone who has tried their hand at making knives turning around and with that knowledge,stifling and insulting a new maker at a show unless they are simply being a dick, and in that case should/can be treated as such.

I think one of the best things collectors can do is to try their hand at the process, because it helps with their choices in designs they send to makers as well as helps them appreciate the "hidden" work they are paying for, but might not be visible in the final product. In the end, it helps them and the maker.

I think the counterproductive line between maker and collector only occurs when collectors or makers don't take the time to show a mutual respect for one another. Collectors who stifle new makers rather than encourage them widen the line between how makers view collectors. This happens in the same way as when makers view collectors as milling sheep with cash-in-hand rather than as the source for much of what allows them to continue pursuing their craft.

My comment was specific to the incident. 99.9% of collectors would never do what Justin described and would probably be pissed to overhear it at a show.
 
If some of you guys were really interested in getting more new people turned on about forged knives, you might want to consider the extent to which you might completely be turning them off, when the newbies see threads like this on the "premier" forged online discussion site.
 
David Schott said:
.....I think one of the best things collectors can do is to try their hand at the process, because it helps with their choices in designs they send to makers as well as helps them appreciate the "hidden" work they are paying for, but might not be visible in the final product. In the end, it helps them and the maker.
.......My comment was specific to the incident. 99.9% of collectors would never do what Justin described and would probably be pissed to overhear it at a show.
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David....I agree with you on the making point....and most, if not all, collectors that I know worth regard, have made at least one knife from scratch.

I was not personalizing your comment....but it is a prevalent thought between both makers and collectors and as such, should be discussed and put aside...we are all human.

TaiGoo said:
Face it folks!

You just can't keep a good SKULL down!
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Tai, if you accept that we are alike, as you mock me, you mock yourself....and you CERTAINLY publicly flout your lesser qualities...which fail to promote you or your work.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
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