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Does Sanrenmu Produce Any of Their Own Stuff?
- Thread starter RedLynx
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So if you search Google for Ganzo 710 etc. the first commerce site is Fasttech. This seems to be the main outlet for these brands.
Search their offerings and they claim to have Benchmade. Spyderco as well as a few SOG, Buck etc. Everyone is either a trademark infringement or counterfeit.
The "Benchmades" even had a butterfly logo even though the models were nothing like any current BM offering.
So in a nutshell; do what you want with your money but buying these knives directly affects the US economy as you condone and encourage China to rip-off every idea, copy write or trademark that they can these days. Even the Mini Cooper I am told.
Beside I don't understand the "I know it is low quality but I can't afford quality" reasoning. That is a BS copout. I can't currently afford a CRK knife but I can afford a well made Kershaw, Benchmade etc. that is in my price range.
Search their offerings and they claim to have Benchmade. Spyderco as well as a few SOG, Buck etc. Everyone is either a trademark infringement or counterfeit.
The "Benchmades" even had a butterfly logo even though the models were nothing like any current BM offering.
So in a nutshell; do what you want with your money but buying these knives directly affects the US economy as you condone and encourage China to rip-off every idea, copy write or trademark that they can these days. Even the Mini Cooper I am told.
Beside I don't understand the "I know it is low quality but I can't afford quality" reasoning. That is a BS copout. I can't currently afford a CRK knife but I can afford a well made Kershaw, Benchmade etc. that is in my price range.
I buy a lot of knives from FastTech, the fakes that they sell are of a quality and look that you would have to be severely deluded to buy, the Benchmade "thing" doesn't look like any Benchmade I've ever seen, I don't think I've seen a Spyderco sold on there, Buck, yes a few that were probably made for Buck originally and they kept on producing, not something I would buy.
SanRenMu sell a great many knives, I don't know of one that is a direct copy of an existing American made knife, the 763 that had the Axis lock is now the 7063 and is made in liner lock and Axis lock versions.
Don't get them mixed up with Ganzo who make Benchmade copies or Navy who copy Spyderco knives, SanRenMu employ their own designers as do Real Steel, another up and coming Chinese maker that is targeting the $50 - $400 sector of the market.
I know that there is a great feeling on this board that the Chinese are stealing the money from American manufacturers, a lot of those manufacturers that go to China to get knives made to sell alongside American made products. The Chinese produce a superb knife for not much money and your makers know it.
For me the American made knife is just overpriced for what it is. After your makers profit then add shipping costs add import duty to that then another 20% on the top for VAT, (our GST) then even a low end American made knife starts to get expensive, that's before the U.K. store adds their profit and costs.
One American made knife that I bought was a Buck Omni Hunter and it was awful. Plastic handle that felt like it should have come out of a cracker, backlock with a spring so strong it takes two hands to close and that cost me the equivalent of $65, really put me off. then I bought a Kershaw Chive and what a difference in quality, the price was about the same. Compare those two to an Enlan EL-01 or an Enlan EL-05 both of which together come to $30, enough left for two SanRenMu's, a 9051 and a 9054, all built to a very high standard.
When it comes down to value for money American makers have a way to go to beat the Chinese makers.
SanRenMu sell a great many knives, I don't know of one that is a direct copy of an existing American made knife, the 763 that had the Axis lock is now the 7063 and is made in liner lock and Axis lock versions.
Don't get them mixed up with Ganzo who make Benchmade copies or Navy who copy Spyderco knives, SanRenMu employ their own designers as do Real Steel, another up and coming Chinese maker that is targeting the $50 - $400 sector of the market.
I know that there is a great feeling on this board that the Chinese are stealing the money from American manufacturers, a lot of those manufacturers that go to China to get knives made to sell alongside American made products. The Chinese produce a superb knife for not much money and your makers know it.
For me the American made knife is just overpriced for what it is. After your makers profit then add shipping costs add import duty to that then another 20% on the top for VAT, (our GST) then even a low end American made knife starts to get expensive, that's before the U.K. store adds their profit and costs.
One American made knife that I bought was a Buck Omni Hunter and it was awful. Plastic handle that felt like it should have come out of a cracker, backlock with a spring so strong it takes two hands to close and that cost me the equivalent of $65, really put me off. then I bought a Kershaw Chive and what a difference in quality, the price was about the same. Compare those two to an Enlan EL-01 or an Enlan EL-05 both of which together come to $30, enough left for two SanRenMu's, a 9051 and a 9054, all built to a very high standard.
When it comes down to value for money American makers have a way to go to beat the Chinese makers.
To answer the original question, yes. I own the 605 which is a great little knife. Cost me 10 bucks, great design with the finger choil. Some things that surprised me were the centering and lock up, both which were very good. The only thing lacking was really the finish. But for 10 bucks... C'mon. A smokin deal if you ask me.
That is so funny, I didn't see the knife either. These look very similar to some $3 knives I bought from a cheap vendor in the city. Cheap, but decent enough and I don't care if I lose it. I love "proper" knives, but I have an affinity for fun little <$10 knives 20th out researching where they come from. Definitely hate when they pretend they're genuine though.
Knives are similar to firearms in that for the most part they tend to retain most if not all of their
original value over time, once in a while appreciating for certain models due to scarcity and demand. This is true of American, European and Japanese knives. I don't see this ever happening
with the current Chinese knives since the only thing they drives the demand for them is the low price and nothing else.
original value over time, once in a while appreciating for certain models due to scarcity and demand. This is true of American, European and Japanese knives. I don't see this ever happening
with the current Chinese knives since the only thing they drives the demand for them is the low price and nothing else.
The SanRenMu M1 used to cost about $11 from FastTech, they are no longer made in the original smooth black Micarta. Prices have nearly doubled (about $20 now) for those that are still available from dealers stock. There is a new model, the 9051MUC-GPH -
Shown here with the 9055MUC-GHJL another slipjoint.
They have gone over to the Chinese characters for San Ren Mu, 三 仁 沐 or Three Blade Wood, clearly these are meant more for the home market.
Information leaflet inside one of the new box packaging, different to the sliding clamshell and card type.
The original GA-763 Tan G10 and the GB-763 Black G10 are about the same, stopped production and the price has gone up for those remaining.
Enlan EL-01D with the rosewood scales has more than doubled at one dealer because of this model being discontinued. Exduct want nearly $30 for one, I'm pleased that I bought a couple for $13 a year or more ago.
People recognise a good knife and there are some really good SanRenMu's, A knife is worth what anyone is willing to pay, the EL-01D is too much money for me from Exduct but their stocks are dropping, when he first raised the price he had a couple of hundred in stock, now it's 10.
Anyway to answer the original post. Yes SanRenMu make their own designs. They have one model using an Axis lock at the moment, not like any Benchmade model in looks, I'm not saying it's right to take designs and copy them but there are a lot more Ganzo's and Enlan's sold with the Axis lock than there are SanRenMu's, I have two and they are the best of all the Chinese copies, the Omega spring tension is just right unlike Enlan's and Ganzo's which I've had to strip and adjust the spring.
Anyone who won't buy SanRenMu or other Chinese knives because they are Chinese is really missing some great knives. I can see the argument and you are perfectly entitled to your views, as I am mine.
The politics of the issue don't concern me. A lot of people here have a negative opinion towards Chinese knives in general, especially ones that are "inspired" by popular knives. I own several fakes including a Hinderer and a Strider. Both are well made knives with great designs and cost me under 50 dollars each. I use them every day and enjoy carrying them. I don't really care if the designs are not original. I don't buy knives to make a political statement. I buy them because I like using them. To Craytab who says people who buy clones are hurting the hobby, get off your damn high horse. I would never in a million years pay 500 for a Strider or 600+ for a Hinderer. By purchasing a 50 dollar imitation of a Hinderer, I am not taking money out of anyone's pocket. I like the designs but there is a limit to how much I will spend for a tool. That doesn't make me any less of a knife enthusiast. If you are going to say that someone like me is hurting the hobby, then never buy another Kershaw, Spyderco, Buck, Kabar, Ontario, Benchmade, AG Russell, CRKT, or any other brand that produces any knives in China. If my purchasing of a few knives is so detrimental to the hobby, then the giant companies who have their products produced in the same factories where clones are made are doing much worse than me.
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I and many others don't have any problems with knives or anything made in China. That is not what this thread is about and several of you are making that assumption, which is wrong. I own and like several knives made in China from several companies including the Enlan EL-01.
This is what I and many others have a problem with. By owning counterfeit knives you are part of the problem. There is a big difference in a design not being original and an out right fake. The fakes do hurt this hobby.
If by high horse you mean I am not willing to rip off American companies by buying fakes and counterfeits then yup my horse is much higher than yours. Most people here have a much higher horse. Most people in the world have a much higher horse. And yes, you are hurting the hobby by supporting thieves. Why don't you go ask the designers if you knowingly buying fakes is hurting the US knife business. The company that gets faked the most is Spyderco. Over in the Spyderco Sub forum Sal answers questions regularly on this subject. Please go enlighten yourself.
Yes, you are less of an enthusiast by supporting the counterfeit market and you are hurting the hobby. To think otherwise would be ignorant.
This doesn't even make sense, kind of like supporting counterfeiting.
It is clear you like your counterfeits as in almost all of your 9 post here since November you have defended the practice in some way. Needless to say we will never agree.
Unfortunately not, the cut-out for the thumbstud access is one side only, however with an after market thumb-stud and a Dremel a lot of things are possible. KnifeKits and MidwestKnifeSupply sell a few different types.
To stay on topic, it's not clear that counterfeiting has any relevance to Sanrenmu.
It appears that Sanrenmu has some pretty unique designs, in addition to designs styled closely after popular brands originating in other parts of the globe. Their newer slipjoint knives are very nice, and as far as I can tell, are unlike anything else on the market. The whole morality angle is a nonsensical distraction pulled up selectively for whatever reasons, often, it seems, to express some kind of bigoted/racist/nationalist anti-Chinese sentiment. Under some high brow guise, of course. Which hold up about as well as selective morality usually does.
The bottom line is that Sanrenmu knives are good. Not without flaws (such as right handed bias, etc.) They're very inexpensive by virtue of being gray market items. One can certainly buy non gray market Sanrenmu knives, branded with the names and designs of familiar brands available in the West.
It appears that Sanrenmu has some pretty unique designs, in addition to designs styled closely after popular brands originating in other parts of the globe. Their newer slipjoint knives are very nice, and as far as I can tell, are unlike anything else on the market. The whole morality angle is a nonsensical distraction pulled up selectively for whatever reasons, often, it seems, to express some kind of bigoted/racist/nationalist anti-Chinese sentiment. Under some high brow guise, of course. Which hold up about as well as selective morality usually does.
The bottom line is that Sanrenmu knives are good. Not without flaws (such as right handed bias, etc.) They're very inexpensive by virtue of being gray market items. One can certainly buy non gray market Sanrenmu knives, branded with the names and designs of familiar brands available in the West.
I should have done it myself earlier, but thanks for pointing this out. This isn't a "do you like or dislike Chinese knives thread. I own several Chinese knives, both designed and made there and designed here but made there, and I like them all, both in quality and price... nothing wrong with a good Chinese knife.
mcfuggle, whilst I appreciate your points, if I don't necessarily agree, there is a difference between a company producing one's own designs in China (which the U.S. companies you listed do) and a company producing another company's designs, well, anywhere. Separately re your "same factory" comment, if Payday and Salted Nut Rolls are produced in the same factory, I don't hurt the Salted Nut Roll bottom line by buying my Paydays.
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They make knives that have a knock off axis lock. This is a counterfeit axis lock as it is referred to as an axis lock but they did not ask benchmade for the rights to the patented design or the use of the trademark. If it were a US company doing such a practice they would get sued as it is against the law here.
Further, as I have said before, we don't know where the lines are between all the Chinese companies making it hard to determine which company is involved with doing what.
No discussion of morality or racism needed. It comes down to law here in the US. Laws that are meant to protect intellectual property and legitimate businesses. There are plenty of folks around here who loath the thought of buying any knife from China just because it is Chinese. All the while almost everything else they own is made in China or elsewhere. I am not one of these people and nor are most people who have commented here. I don't think this is an anti China nonsensical distraction we are talking about here. I have no problem with knives from China, as I have said before in this thread. The Enlan EL-01 is a fantastic large budget flipper (I believe Enlan and Bee are subsidiaries of SRM). What I do have a problem with is the patent infringement, fake trade marks, and out right counterfeits that come from China, or any country for that matter. Everyone should have a problem with that. It hurts our hobby to a great degree.
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Thanks Shecky,
As most of you can hopefully tell, this is neither a SRM bash thread or a Chinese knife in general bash fest. I was genuinely interested in whether SRM made their own stuff since so many posts are about their rather too close for comfort designs in other areas. I appreciate a good Chinese knife the same way I do a good one from France, New Zealand, Australia, Russia, Poland, or any of the other non-U.S. markets from which I buy.
Basically I am with Craytab if I read him correctly: No counterfeits for me (knowingly) but I am happy to buy a good product from any non-U.S. country including China. I understand and respect fellow members who won't touch it. Maybe there are some who won't touch any foreign market, that's okay too. But I can't be a U.S.-centric knife consumer, because I've found good, affordable designs elsewhere.
As most of you can hopefully tell, this is neither a SRM bash thread or a Chinese knife in general bash fest. I was genuinely interested in whether SRM made their own stuff since so many posts are about their rather too close for comfort designs in other areas. I appreciate a good Chinese knife the same way I do a good one from France, New Zealand, Australia, Russia, Poland, or any of the other non-U.S. markets from which I buy.
Basically I am with Craytab if I read him correctly: No counterfeits for me (knowingly) but I am happy to buy a good product from any non-U.S. country including China. I understand and respect fellow members who won't touch it. Maybe there are some who won't touch any foreign market, that's okay too. But I can't be a U.S.-centric knife consumer, because I've found good, affordable designs elsewhere.
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You have summed it up correctly!
Right, I kind of got used to American jobs being lost when it was Japan being allowed to destroy our Machine Tool and Automobile industries in the '80s. I don't like it but being a blue collar schmoe I'm kind of forced to get my Chinese clothes at Wally World. That problem needs different solutions.
Sorry.
As to Sanrenmu making their own designs. It seems they do so more than many other similar(?) companies mentioned.
Well here's an example...
The Buck 371 is actually a design by Ganzo or vise versa.The Buck Nobleman is actually a version of a knife by Sanrenmu.I gather when it comes to outsourcing knives from China the manufacturer has dibs on the design.Or a contract is made allowing the actual manufacturer of the product in China to sell their offering of it.Just as Buck claims their Chinese knives to be in 440A or even 420J2 no.... Chinese comparative steels are used.
The Buck 371 is actually a design by Ganzo or vise versa.The Buck Nobleman is actually a version of a knife by Sanrenmu.I gather when it comes to outsourcing knives from China the manufacturer has dibs on the design.Or a contract is made allowing the actual manufacturer of the product in China to sell their offering of it.Just as Buck claims their Chinese knives to be in 440A or even 420J2 no.... Chinese comparative steels are used.