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Price is$300$250 ea (shipped within CONUS). If you live outside the US, I will contact you after your order for extra shipping charges.
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Edge Pro Matrix resin bond diamond stones
- Thread starter Diemaker
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I personally think it's too fine and really too aggressive for the stones. If you look back, the silicone grit (240-400?) only takes about 10-15 strokes to dress them, so it doesn't take much to renew them. As far as cleaning goes, you really don't need to get them spotless in order for them to cut well.so I would just do the thumb under warm water or alcohol deal and call it good until its time for dressing.
These are a stone/resin,after all that cuts well with lighter pressures than normal stones.
These are a stone/resin,after all that cuts well with lighter pressures than normal stones.
Wowbagger
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I had to really force myself not to reach for the comet like I would for a Spyderco ceramic rod.
I listened to the instructions with the Matrix and didn't go there.
Heck . . . I'm going to just freekin' relax and do a quick rinse and rub and let it build up a little.
Then try the paper towel a bit later and compare.
Really the only reason I went with the Matrix over my Aligner diamond 8,000 (which does a killer job) is that the round holes in the Aligner stone sucks when working on the tips of knives. Especially free hand. In other words part of why I got the Matrix is free hand touch ups of knife tips. I have yet to use it for that yet.
I hadn't tried Bar Keepers Friend on them before so good request. It works quite well at cleaning and does not affect the resin at all. I just used a small piece of paper towel and BKF and scrubbed for about 30-45 seconds before rinsing off with water on all three. By the third stone, the paper towel was getting pretty worn out. A scrubby sponge would probably work much better. To test if it would attack the resin I left a puddle of BKF on a stone with a piece of paper towel on it to help keep it moist for 9 hours, overnight. It rinsed right off and after scraping on the stone I can't find any difference in the resin. So it's official, BKF is a go for cleaning the stones. These are the stones I use when I just want to sharpen my knives, 1100, 2300, and 4k. They probably have sharpened around 15-20 knives since I last dressed them, and most of those knives are the kitchen variety so softer steel which marks the stones more. All I ever do is keep them wet when in use and rinse and scrub with my thumb before they dry after use. I am not going to finish cleaning them off since the dark marks don't make a difference and it doesn't bother me.
PS, brown aluminum oxide is what EP sells for these. It is half the price of silicon carbide, when buying it by the 50lb bag, and lasts much longer in use. The silicon carbide turns to a fine powder much faster, way more friable.
PS, brown aluminum oxide is what EP sells for these. It is half the price of silicon carbide, when buying it by the 50lb bag, and lasts much longer in use. The silicon carbide turns to a fine powder much faster, way more friable.
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I find the BFK powder is much better then the liquid,you should try just using your fingers and rub the powder on a Matrix stone that is wet,I find with not just the Venev stones but all the stones I use it on and it takes about 8 seconds of gentle rubbing and the swarf is gone and I don't use much just a very small pinch and that's it.
I actually like this because if I work it right I can get a series of grades as I level coarse to fine stones.
Wowbagger
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Thank you for taking the time to confirm BKF won't harm the Matrix stones.I hadn't tried Bar Keepers Friend on them before so good request. It works quite well at cleaning and does not affect the resin at all. I just used a small piece of paper towel and BKF and scrubbed for about 30-45 seconds before rinsing off with water on all three. By the third stone, the paper towel was getting pretty worn out. A scrubby sponge would probably work much better. To test if it would attack the resin I left a puddle of BKF on a stone with a piece of paper towel on it to help keep it moist for 9 hours, overnight. It rinsed right off and after scraping on the stone I can't find any difference in the resin. So it's official, BKF is a go for cleaning the stones. These are the stones I use when I just want to sharpen my knives, 1100, 2300, and 4k. They probably have sharpened around 15-20 knives since I last dressed them, and most of those knives are the kitchen variety so softer steel which marks the stones more. All I ever do is keep them wet when in use and rinse and scrub with my thumb before they dry after use. I am not going to finish cleaning them off since the dark marks don't make a difference and it doesn't bother me.
PS, brown aluminum oxide is what EP sells for these. It is half the price of silicon carbide, when buying it by the 50lb bag, and lasts much longer in use. The silicon carbide turns to a fine powder much faster, way more friable.
I don't want to wear you out with this but what's your off the cuff thoughts on Comet ?
(I don't have any BKF)
I'm more curious than serious about using it on the Matrix; like you said :
The Alox breaks down way too fast anyway so you get this option in grit size just fine. With the silicon carbide one charge will barely dress one stone sometimes, depending on the grit and how much dressing it needs. I have all kinds and sizes of abrasives to dress with. After all the newness has worn off I now just use the 240 alox that EP sells for everything but the 80 grit stone and the coarse sand for the 80.
I will have to get some powder BKF and Comet to try, I checked last night and we don't have any. What I like the most about forums is learning new things, and me answering questions about something I make is part of it so please don't be shy about asking questions. A lot of what brought me here was so I could have direct contact with people using these stones to better understand what you like and don't like about them and why. Like most any product there are a bunch of compromises made, most don't involve $, and the better I understand how they are used the better I can adjust those compromises.
By the way. The pass-around kit of Matrix stones is set to return in a week or so, so now would be a good time to try it out if you are interested, meaning anyone that meets the rules. It would save me $15 in shipping if it goes from the current tester to the new one vs back to me first. It's sitting on a shelf here most of the time so there is no time limit for testing.
I finally got some dry BKF and Comet to try. The dry BKF was used on the top right and bottom right ends, the Comet was used on the center-right end, wet BKF on the left ends. All were done with about 15-20 seconds of rubbing with my finger or thumb. If anything I think the Comet might work a hint faster but since it has bleach in it that rules it out at my house. I'm on a sceptic so no bleach and no fabric softener!!! I think this is the best way to clean these stones that I have tried so far, definitely better than alcohol. I will keep doing this as a long term test to see if it has any effect on how they work and let EP know. A big thanks to Wade for the question about using BKF. By the way, these stones didn't work any differently after cleaning them. The little bit of metal coloring the resin doesn't affect how they work.
Stones are 1100, 2300, and 4000 at the top.
A bit of an update. Ben already knew about using the cleansers to clean the stones and has been recommending it.
Stones are 1100, 2300, and 4000 at the top.
A bit of an update. Ben already knew about using the cleansers to clean the stones and has been recommending it.
Last edited:
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Nice comparison! I noticed that after I cleaned them too, as I ended up doing one more knife. They would have to be dang near black b4 actual NEED to clean.Another plus for the Matrix.
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That's going to be a rather large jump, depending on your intent. The Matrix 2300 is roughly equivalent with a Shapton Glass 6000 grit stone. The Matrix 4,000 much finer still.
Going from plated to resin bond with the same grit is a jump so I am pretty sure 1k plated to 2300 resin is too big, definitely too big straight to the Matrix 4k. Do you know the micron rating of the CKTG 1k?
Im trying to rework my progression of stones for my S110v knives, i had been working through a fairly ridiculous progression that involved finishing with a chosera 10K stone a shapton 16k glass stone then stropping.
the diamond matrix stones just seemed like a much better fit than the above mentioned method. CKTG doesnt have a micron rating on their diamond plates that i have been able to find anywhere but for the price those things have been awesome, i normally use the 140, 400 and 1k.
Unfortunately i have not been able to find a micron rating for their diamond plates. what would you suggest for a proper progression using the matrix stones?
Matrix stones: 1100, 2300, 4K?
David Richardson
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Have to agree with the others - no way you'd want to go to the 4K. Even the 2300 seems questionable. I haven't used those CFTG diamond plates in a while. If I recall they're pretty rough. The grit numbers don't really compare. I would expect the EP 650 matrix to leave smaller scratches than the CTKT 1K.
Speculation I read on the CTKG forums is that the 1K plate is 15 micron. If that's true (big if), you could maybe progress to the 2300 matrix stone. But, the diamond plates leave deeper scratches. Surface mounted vs. embedded in matrix - you have more exposed grit to cut the metal. I'm guessing you'd want the 1100 matrix stone.
I'll dig out my 1K CFTG plate later this week and see how it looks relative to the EP Matrix stones. The next two nights are booked for me so Thurs in the earliest I could give it a try.
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Speaking strictly for myself and fully realizing that everyone's taste is different, I see no reason to go higher with S110V.
(Call me lazy but I think you could make a good argument for stopping at 400.)
Have a look at this thread for some thoughts:
https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/optimal-grit-for-s110v-pm2.1454565/
Like any full set of stones they are designed to work together, from coarsest to finest. You may be able to start with the 1100 Matrix after the CKTG 1k. Using very little pressure on the last few strokes of the 1k would help. For the price of return shipping, around $15, you can try out the full Matrix pass-around kit. This should answer all of your questions about them.
I finish all of my knives with the 4k then strop. I recently tried my kitchen santoku at a Matrix 650 but it cuts chicken noticeably better at 4k so back it went to 4k.
Grit sizes vary so much I like to talk microns for accuracy. But the difference in bonds is as extreme as it gets.
David Richardson
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It's more a matter of how much material you want to remove and how much work you want to do. The course diamond plate tear up the edge quite a bit and a lot of material has to be removed to get back to a smooth edge.
The glass 16K is a 0.92 micron stone. I would only strop this with a 0.5 micron compound or less. Are you stropping for burr removal or to polish?