F.F. D2 better than INFI?

It's not only the steel that makes me buy INFI.
I would buy Busse even if INFI was only the second or third best steel on the marked.
I never noticed much difference between good blade steels anyway during normal use.
But I must say I'm more worried if I abuse any other blade than Busse.
That's why I don't have other brand blades anymore.
It is the unlimited trust in the blade abilities and the unlimited warranty that gives me the big joy when I hammer and pry with my Busse users.
And not at least the great design and the Busse community.
It's always more fun to share an addiction with a group of people that think alike. :thumbup:
 
asi said:
push cuts and slycing cuts - are different tests. and the tests I did, show not very much. I did not measured the weight to cut one piece during the tests, the geometry of the different blades were not identical and so on...

my cutting tests - just a small step forward (only for myself) to understand the influence of the geometry on the easy of cutting, some tryings in understanding of the steel influence, some investigations on handle ergonomics.

my opinion is following: due to the incredible service, warranty and the properties of the INFI the knives from BUSSE - are the best working knives. universal knives. the knives with great performance.

the other knives can beat the Busse knives in one or two tasks but overally saying - INFI - the best.

one more THANK to Busse family!
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This is not a question. And I turn my attention to Busse knives only because of your results, which may be not scientifically accurate, but still demonstrates INFI superiority over all other steels except one which only knife made from I know is that one you have. The question is not is the Busse has best knives on the market or not. It will be interesting to know if those knive will perform even better with FF may be applied to INFI or with CPM 10V?

Can you give few words about FF? You told me that this is based on FF welding, so is this equipment available and someone like Busse can try it or it was made for Diamond knives exclusevely?

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
This is not a question. And I turn my attention to Busse knives only because of your results, which may be not scientifically accurate, but still demonstrates INFI superiority over all other steels except one which only knife made from I know is that one you have. The question is not is the Busse has best knives on the market or not. It will be interesting to know if those knive will perform even better with FF may be applied to INFI or with CPM 10V?

Can you give few words about FF? You told me that this is based on FF welding, so is this equipment available and someone like Busse can try it or it was made for Diamond knives exclusevely?

Thanks, Vassili.
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I'm a little curious what benefits ff would have for a low carbon/low carbide steel, since its main advertised ability is to decrease carbide size, refining the grain pattern as much as possible.

I'm severely under educated in the subject, but that seems to be one of the first "waaa?" questions regarding ff and infi.
 
Last Visible Canary said:
I'm a little curious what benefits ff would have for a low carbon/low carbide steel, since its main advertised ability is to decrease carbide size, refining the grain pattern as much as possible.

I'm severely under educated in the subject, but that seems to be one of the first "waaa?" questions regarding ff and infi.
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Well I am also severely under educated on subject, so probably it will not be correct to discuss it for me. So far there are several reports on superperformance (sometimes misleading like incredible sharpness which I can do for INFI easy), but at least edge holding claims looks interesting.

I think this is enough to investigate, test etc. As it was stated Busse is commited to deliver best performance so this is clear challenge and worse to test and investigate IMHO. But so far I see only speculations. This is my point.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
This is not a question. And I turn my attention to Busse knives only because of your results, which may be not scientifically accurate, but still demonstrates INFI superiority over all other steels except one which only knife made from I know is that one you have. The question is not is the Busse has best knives on the market or not. It will be interesting to know if those knive will perform even better with FF may be applied to INFI or with CPM 10V?

Can you give few words about FF? You told me that this is based on FF welding, so is this equipment available and someone like Busse can try it or it was made for Diamond knives exclusevely?

Thanks, Vassili.
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The November issue of Blade has another article on F.F. D2. Google "stir welding"....apparently this is the process by which F.F. came from according to the article. The article also states there is a Friction Stir Research Laboratory at Brigham Young University where they conduct tests on the effects of stir welding on different steels and metals. There seems to be two different companies that make the equipment needed to stir weld. MegaDiamond and MegaStir.

The equipment and technology do not seem to be proprietary..only the specific process used by the current makers.
 
morrowj_98 said:
The November issue of Blade has another article on F.F. D2. Google "stir welding"....apparently this is the process by which F.F. came from according to the article. The article also states there is a Friction Stir Research Laboratory at Brigham Young University where they conduct tests on the effects of stir welding on different steels and metals. There seems to be two different companies that make the equipment needed to stir weld. MegaDiamond and MegaStir.

The equipment and technology do not seem to be proprietary..only the specific process used by the current makers.
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Yes this is my point - Busse, if it worse it, may also do Friction Inifing or Friction Hogging or something and bring us not less incredible results. I hope ASI also contribute because he is an expert in different types of welding.

Thanks, Vassili.
 
nozh2002 said:
Yes this is my point - Busse, if it worse it, may also do Friction Inifing or Friction Hogging or something and bring us not less incredible results. I hope ASI also contribute because he is an expert in different types of welding.

Thanks, Vassili.
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it has yet to be proven whether FF is actually that good. It can cut, but there is no data on edge toughness yet compared to other similar edge profile D2 knives. I won't put my money on the FF bank until I see more conclussive testing.

Also, I still do not see where FF is Forging at all. It is localized high heat treatment with no tempering. There is no pressure involved as in a hammer forge. This process heats steel to just under melting by friction, then cools it. Even hot rolling does more forging than this IMO. No slam of FF intended but the name is a misnomer.

Also, if FF on INFI precludes the INFI heat treatment, I will pass, as I don't think there is anyway to best the INFI process at this time.
 
during friction stir welding process steel is mixed almost like liquid. but this mixing occurs under the temperature of solidus.

FF proces - combines heat treatment and forging. the grain sizes and phases distribution can be controlled by adjusting of the FF parameters. the cooling speeds during FF proces are high enougth for the heat treatment of the D2 steel (as an air hardening steel). so high hardness and small grain sizes can be achieved by the FF process. but which properties will the blade has?I didn't test the blades, so I cannot answer this question.
 
asi said:
during friction stir welding process steel is mixed almost like liquid. but this mixing occurs under the temperature of solidus.

FF proces - combines heat treatment and forging. the grain sizes and phases distribution can be controlled by adjusting of the FF parameters. the cooling speeds during FF proces are high enougth for the heat treatment of the D2 steel (as an air hardening steel). so high hardness and small grain sizes can be achieved by the FF process. but which properties will the blade has?I didn't test the blades, so I cannot answer this question.
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Thanks!

I hope you got some INFI from Busse Company Store today...

Thanks, Vassili.
 
hey, actually a have a honey moon right now.... :)
and the wedding cake has been cut with my muddy meaner :) that was a great test for the infi - 125 pieces of cake for 125 guests :) :)
 
asi said:
hey, actually a have a honey moon right now.... :)
and the wedding cake has been cut with my muddy meaner :) that was a great test for the infi - 125 pieces of cake for 125 guests :) :)
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Wow! congratulations!

Vassili.
 
asi said:
hey, actually a have a honey moon right now.... :)
and the wedding cake has been cut with my muddy meaner :) that was a great test for the infi - 125 pieces of cake for 125 guests :) :)
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I am pretty sure that the warranty does not cover gross abuse like that.
:eek:
 
Cobalt said:
Also, I still do not see where FF is Forging at all. It is localized high heat treatment with no tempering. There is no pressure involved as in a hammer forge. This process heats steel to just under melting by friction, then cools it. Even hot rolling does more forging than this IMO. No slam of FF intended but the name is a misnomer.
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interesting... I was under the impression that the friction was applied at great pressure by the stir stick's face. once the metal was brought to near melting point, it provided less lateral resistance as the stir stick was moved across the surface, but there was still a great deal of force applied by the stick....


but then I may have misread the friction "welding" process description, and have interpreted the pressure being applied to force the two peices of steel together as being applied perpedicularly by the stick itself...
 
Last Visible Canary said:
interesting... I was under the impression that the friction was applied at great pressure by the stir stick's face. once the metal was brought to near melting point, it provided less lateral resistance as the stir stick was moved across the surface, but there was still a great deal of force applied by the stick....
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how much force does it take before a stir stick plunges right through near molten steel? not much I think? You think this is more force than Hot Rolled steel sheet? I don't
 
Cobalt said:
how much force does it take before a stir stick plunges right through near molten steel? not much I think? You think this is more force than Hot Rolled steel sheet? I don't
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ah gots a stir stick in the outhouse....
 
Jerry Busse said:
Holy Oinkin' Prodigal HOG!!!!. . . . Welcome back HOG!!!. . . . We've missed ya!!!. . . . .Time to drink!!!!Jerry.
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tried to trick me again huh :grumpy:

prod·i·gal
Pronunciation: 'prä-di-g&l
Function: adjective
Etymology: Latin prodigus, from prodigere to drive away, squander, from pro-, prod- forth + agere to drive -- more at PRO-, AGENT
1 : characterized by profuse or wasteful expenditure : LAVISH <a prodigal feast> <prodigal outlays for her clothes>
2 : tree chopping hog-
3 : recklessly spendthrift <the prodigal prince>
4 : yielding abundantly : LUXURIANT -- often used with of <nature has been so prodigal of her bounty -- H. T. Buckle>
 
Cobalt said:
it has yet to be proven whether FF is actually that good. It can cut, but there is no data on edge toughness yet compared to other similar edge profile D2 knives. I won't put my money on the FF bank until I see more conclussive testing.
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I beg to differ sir......there is some. The same article I referenced earlier and the preceding article in Blade have data you are referring to. I would gladly scan and post the articles if they would be of interest.
 
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