Feedback on my Tanto design

[Sharp & Fiery]

I must also be clear. “China” doesnt bother me either M marcinek Damneddesigns .
It just seems like there are a lot of folders flooding the market that are made in China. Some of them are well made...just not my cup of tea.

 

[marcinek]

I must also be clear. “China” doesnt bother me either M marcinek Damneddesigns .
It just seems like there are a lot of folders flooding the market that are made in China. Some of them are well made...just not my cup of tea.

I get your point entirely. I would not buy a knife from China because its are where all the generic, trite titanium framelock flippers are made, and, apparently, nothing else. And I am bored to death with trite titanium framelock flippers.

If only generic, trite titanium framelock flippers were made in Belgium....I wouldn't buy a knife made in Belgium.

 

[Damneddesigns]

That's unfortunate . I have trouble spending money on quality ZT flippers made here in the USA. Have you ever made knives, pens, handles etc ? Or are you just a designer.

If I were interested in your knife I would be far more likely to spend $$$ on your design if it was made in the United States with quality materials versus paying for a design sent over to China.

I do own Chinese made products like my Spyderco Resilience or my 2 year old drill set from Harbor freight. But both products have an amazing value to cost ratio.

I probably couldn't afford to live the way I do if China didn't bring so many products 2 the market for the average consumer. However, when it comes to collectible items or tools such as knives , guns or watches I have the luxury to buy those items from where I please.

Best of luck either way. I am sure you will have success.

My first knife with M390 retails for 225 for the ti and 175 for a liner lock variant with $50 off retail while on pre order. The aim with China is to offer the best value possible and make product with the best possible material available to the average consumer. Those that have the money to spend on USA made knives or don’t like China made for a variety of reasons aren’t my target market but their feedback on design is equally important. I appreciate the skill and effort it takes to make a product as much as the next person and am not trying to compete with bladesmiths or actual knife makers. It’s aimed to be a mid tech production knife with full transparency on where and who it’s produced by.

So far, 2 of my designs have been prototyped and the first one went into production. Will be ready in a few weeks. My pen has undergone several revisions and prototypes (about 5) but I haven’t been satisfied so keep taking it back to the drawing board. Hopefully 6th times the charm

 

[Natlek]

Damneddesigns , I like the look of this knife .Nobody make women good in bed , good in kitchen + good looking you need to find one like that from what is available . BMW never asked me what kind of car I want ...They make car as they want and then wait for someone to find that that car is good for him and they will buy it . Same is with everything else , that s why there is milion different things /for same purpose/ so everyone can make choice . Point is .....I make knives as I like them not what someone else like/want .And then you look for people who will like what you make and they will buy it .People like same things for many different reason ...You must have found something in women you love ....and that maybe is not cooking ...bed.....or look . Good luck with your adventure

 

[danbot]

My first knife with M390 retails for 225 for the ti and 175 for a liner lock variant with $50 off retail while on pre order. The aim with China is to offer the best value possible and make product with the best possible material available to the average consumer. Those that have the money to spend on USA made knives or don’t like China made for a variety of reasons aren’t my target market but their feedback on design is equally important. I appreciate the skill and effort it takes to make a product as much as the next person and am not trying to compete with bladesmiths or actual knife makers. It’s aimed to be a mid tech production knife with full transparency on where and who it’s produced by.

So far, 2 of my designs have been prototyped and the first one went into production. Will be ready in a few weeks. My pen has undergone several revisions and prototypes (about 5) but I haven’t been satisfied so keep taking it back to the drawing board. Hopefully 6th times the charm

Thank you for this explanation. I clearly am not your target market, but I do appreciate the transparency even though I don't really appreciate the chosen path.
Just keep in mind that there is much more to "value" than price.
You are most definitely a talented designer of "products" and if you actually have a passion for knives, then I hope someday, when you grow tired of glorified gas station knives of questionable functionality, that you will produce something in your locality that you are proud to put your name on and not just a logo.

Then, I'll take two.

 

[Mistman68]

Personally I've had more QC issues w/domestically produced knives than Chinese knives.........

Sometimes I feel US manufacturers sit on their laurels and expect the market to come to them while dumping out loads of crap. Do I feel better purchasing a sketchy US made product just 'cause it's made in the USA or a quality import? My preference is to buy domestic but I also like a decent ROI, therein lies the rub. There are a few US companies trying hard and I appreciate that, when quality and pricing come together 'it's a beautiful thing'. I'd also like to dump on Chinese products but that just doesn't make sense when quality is at least on par w/domestic products at 1/2 the price.

 

[Damneddesigns]

Damneddesigns , I like the look of this knife .Nobody make women good in bed , good in kitchen + good looking you need to find one like that from what is available . BMW never asked me what kind of car I want ...They make car as they want and then wait for someone to find that that car is good for him and they will buy it . Same is with everything else , that s why there is milion different things /for same purpose/ so everyone can make choice . Point is .....I make knives as I like them not what someone else like/want .And then you look for people who will like what you make and they will buy it .People like same things for many different reason ...You must have found something in women you love ....and that maybe is not cooking ...bed.....or look . Good luck with your adventure

Your message was uplifting, thank you!

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Just for some creative criticism from a designer’s perspective....

Without knowing the overall size, the blade looks very ‘tall and squat’. It’s not a bad thing per se’, but if the blade is 3” - 3.5” or so, it looks like it would feel very wide in the pocket (similar to a Manix 2). If the overall height isn’t that big, looks like the blade would be only around 2.5”. But this could just all be optical illusion, especially with the drastic angle on the tanto.

Either way, the blade ‘looks’ a tad too squat aesthetically for my preferences. But there is definitely a market out there for the overbuilt chisel look, and those that like it would eat this up.



Stretching it out definitely makes it look better, with a more usable blade shape. I know this probably varies quite a bit from your ideal for the knife, but I see this as a much more user friendly design.



The drop point makes a world of difference in this, from a usability standpoint. Has a bit too much belly for my taste, but as tall as the blade is, it kinda forces the belly size. Would probably make a great skinner at 3.25”.


Just to echo what a few others have said, a design - any design for any product - really needs to have some thought process to its purpose. There’s a design principle known as Gestalt (German word for form or shape), in which “an organized whole that is perceived as more than the sum of its parts”, which in Industrial Design boils down to form follows function. So while your knife may have sharp edges, and be physically able to cut things to one degree or another, without any thought to it’s end function, it may not do it well, or comfortably, or easily. If you design it with aesthetics in mind, first and foremost, it becomes more of an object of art than a usable tool.

A chef’s knife is shaped the way it is for a reason. You don’t see many tantos in a kitchen.
Good camp axes all have a similar basic shape that works well. You don’t see many hawks chopping wood.
A Delica, Griptilian, or Buck 110 are all great EDCs because their blade shapes are all versatile for, and lend themselves to, a myriad of uses - a Jack-of-all-trades if you will.

I think this is what people are getting at. They don’t see your blade shape as lending itself to any particular use, and are having a tough time seeing any versatility in it either. They can’t see any function behind the form. It’s ok if it’s just meant to be pocket jewelry, or to sit in a collection, as there is a place for that as well - if that’s its function. But usually, an object with that radical of a shape, has a very specific function it’s designed for.



By they way, just out of curiosity, what software are you working in?

^This. You have to think about the intended context of use. The how/when/where/what/why of its intended applications, and let those factors dictate the build of the knife for you. Aesthetic elements should come only after that stage. With information regarding the intended context of use not forthcoming and the design itself not showing any clear signs of considering such factors, it gives the impression that the design has been designed mostly to look neat. The question is not whether or not the knife can cut stuff--making a knife that can cut stuff isn't particularly difficult. It's another matter entirely to design a knife that will excel in its intended role.

 

[danbot]

Personally I've had more QC issues w/domestically produced knives than Chinese knives.........

Sometimes I feel US manufacturers sit on their laurels and expect the market to come to them while dumping out loads of crap. Do I feel better purchasing a sketchy US made product just 'cause it's made in the USA or a quality import? My preference is to buy domestic but I also like a decent ROI, therein lies the rub. There are a few US companies trying hard and I appreciate that, when quality and pricing come together 'it's a beautiful thing'. I'd also like to dump on Chinese products but that just doesn't make sense when quality is at least on par w/domestic products at 1/2 the price.

For me, it's not about quality or price when it comes to China. I do like and respect many foreign knife companies. My issues with China cannot and should not be discussed here, but I do not give them a pass on knives just because I like them.

 

[marcinek]

^This. You have to think about the intended context of use. The how/when/where/what/why of its intended applications, and let those factors dictate the build the knife for you. Aesthetic elements should come only after that stage. With information regarding the intended context of use not forthcoming and the design itself not showing any clear signs of considering such factors, it gives the impression that the design has been designed mostly to look neat. The question is not whether or not the knife can cut stuff--making a knife that can cut stuff isn't particularly difficult. It's another matter entirely to design a knife that will excel in its intended role.

Nailed it. As usual!

 

[marcinek]

Just keep in mind that there is much more to "value" than price.

Particularly when one can buy a similarly priced knife with similar materials designed by someone who took into consideration how the knife will function.

 

[marcinek]

Particularly when one can buy a similarly priced knife with similar materials designed by someone who took into consideration how the knife will function.

And a poorly designed knife doesn't become magically "worth it" by including a trendy steel.

Tell you what, for $200 even, you can buy my new XTreme Marcinator. Its a rectangular prism of un heat treated M390 with a smiley face drawn on it with a Sharpie. For an extra 10 bucks I will customize the branding. Draw a bunny or something...whatever you like. Made in America!

 

[Damneddesigns]

OK, so in summary, some like the design, some hate it, some don't buy chines, some do, 1 was really upset that I didn't spend years honing my skills before putting something in front of them. Appreciate all the input. I will admit, I haven't handled a whole lot of knives, I live in a country where I can't freely carry and don't have the need for the functionality of a knife so I CANNOT design a knife for any intended functionality. Hence I asked what my design seems like it will be bad at. So far, no one has addressed this specifically. Of course the intention is to make a good knife else I could make G10/ D2 variants to retail at $30 but without specific feedback, I cannot improve. This reminds of me how you need experience to get a job and also a job to gain experience. It's a catch 22.

I 3D printed the design, ergonomically, it's good, there are a lot of things like action and related to it opening and closing etc that have been taken care of at design or will be controlled during production. Here's it beside my sheepsfoot a Spydie Tenacious and a Steel Will Cutjack.







So I'd love if I get some constructive criticism instead. What makes this design gas station or non functional or outright useless to some?

 

[Damneddesigns]

Particularly when one can buy a similarly priced knife with similar materials designed by someone who took into consideration how the knife will function.

Like which ones?

 

[marcinek]

Like which ones?

Well, aafter about 5 seconds of Googling I found this

https://www.knifecenter.com/item/BM...in-plain-blade-black-g10-and-aluminum-handles

 

[danbot]

OK, so in summary, some like the design, some hate it, some don't buy chines, some do, 1 was really upset that I didn't spend years honing my skills before putting something in front of them. Appreciate all the input. I will admit, I haven't handled a whole lot of knives, I live in a country where I can't freely carry and don't have the need for the functionality of a knife so I CANNOT design a knife for any intended functionality. Hence I asked what my design seems like it will be bad at. So far, no one has addressed this specifically. Of course the intention is to make a good knife else I could make G10/ D2 variants to retail at $30 but without specific feedback, I cannot improve. This reminds of me how you need experience to get a job and also a job to gain experience. It's a catch 22.

I 3D printed the design, ergonomically, it's good, there are a lot of things like action and related to it opening and closing etc that have been taken care of at design or will be controlled during production. Here's it beside my sheepsfoot a Spydie Tenacious and a Steel Will Cutjack.

View attachment 1191344


View attachment 1191347 View attachment 1191359


So I'd love if I get some constructive criticism instead. What makes this design gas station or non functional or outright useless to some?

It seems like a lot of handle for a little bit of blade. It looks like it would excel as a gasket scraper type of utility blade, but it would be too thick to make a good cardboard cutter. it's kind of in limbo between a utility knife and a (more or less) single purpose knife.

Hope this helps.

 

[marcinek]

So I'd love if I get some constructive criticism instead. What makes this design gas station or non functional or outright useless to some?

What is its function? And not just "to be sharp." As a slicer, it is too thick and obtuse. Its a folder so it doesn't chop. It looks pointy so it might penetrate.

Is that what it is for? It might function for that. Except that we, and most importantly you, know nothing about how ell the lock will function. And I am not stabbing a folder with a mystery locking mechanism.

 

[marcinek]

...t without specific feedback, I cannot improve. This reminds of me how you need experience to get a job and also a job to gain experience. It's a catch 22.

Except, all that you need to do to learn more about how to make a useful knife is to use knives. We have been telling you that over and over.

 

[gazz98]

How I would change your tanto knife.

1. Lose the tanto blade or offer another option. I prefer straight back, drop point, or wharncliffe/sheepsfoot.

2. Like Danbot said, maybe 3/8s inch more blade. The blade to handle ratio is off to my eye. Blade looks a tad short.

3. I'm in the minority on this forum when it comes to spending $ on a blade, but I tend to stick to $150 and under on a blade. $150 got me a PM2, ZT 350, BM Bugout, etc. Those are fancy enough for me. I understand I will never own a Sebenza, midtech, custom, etc. I'd rather put $ toward a handgun or AR build. Your normal retail is out of MY price range. Which means I would appreciate a D2/VG10 + G10/micarta version.

4. I never got on the Ti or carbon fiber handle bandwagon. I find them slick. I'm a G10, micarta, or even FRN is fine by me.

5. Where it is produced doesn't matter to me as long as QC is being followed. Bad crap can come from anywhere.

6. Put some thought into the pocket clip. I don't recall seeing a pic of it. Not too long, not too short. Keep it simple and preferable adjustable for tip up and tip down to keep both camps happy.

I also like the thumb ramp. I'd keep it.

I also understand you won't be able to manufacture a ton of options at this point. But you did ask ...

Good luck on knife!

 

[Damneddesigns]

How I would change your tanto knife.

1. Lose the tanto blade or offer another option. I prefer straight back, drop point, or wharncliffe/sheepsfoot.

2. Like Danbot said, maybe 3/8s inch more blade. The blade to handle ratio is off to my eye. Blade looks a tad short.

3. I'm in the minority on this forum when it comes to spending $ on a blade, but I tend to stick to $150 and under on a blade. $150 got me a PM2, ZT 350, BM Bugout, etc. Those are fancy enough for me. I understand I will never own a Sebenza, midtech, custom, etc. I'd rather put $ toward a handgun or AR build. Your normal retail is out of MY price range. Which means I would appreciate a D2/VG10 + G10/micarta version.

4. I never got on the Ti or carbon fiber handle bandwagon. I find them slick. I'm a G10, micarta, or even FRN is fine by me.

5. Where it is produced doesn't matter to me as long as QC is being followed. Bad crap can come from anywhere.

6. Put some thought into the pocket clip. I don't recall seeing a pic of it. Not too long, not too short. Keep it simple and preferable adjustable for tip up and tip down to keep both camps happy.

I also like the thumb ramp. I'd keep it.

I also understand you won't be able to manufacture a ton of options at this point. But you did ask ...

Good luck on knife!

Thank you. These are great points.

1. A lot of people actually like the tanto so I'm keeping it, I did try another option like one of the images posted with a thinner profile and bigger belly but 20 odd people I asked, preferred the original. I'm doing this drop point version too.



2. It's hard to increase the blade without increasing the handle since it sits inside with 2 mm to spare before hitting the pocket clip. I don't know how others manage this, something I definitely need to learn.

3/ 4. The sheepsfoot I did comes with M390 and a liner lock variant with Micarta or Cf/g10 hybrid scales. Retails at 175, $50 off on pre order. This is a framelock with cf inserts so i'm not doing a liner lock variant unfortunately.

5. Tuya actually does a great job, you can see the Hive or kingsman reviewed by a bunch of youtubers. I hope they do a similar or better job with mine.

6. This is what the pocket clip looks like



Thank you for the feedback. I hope I can improve aspects of it that as I design and learn.