Frozen wood vs sarsquatch. The wood won, by a lot

Status
Not open for further replies.
I agree nothing unusual. That is why I suggested trying to put a more durable edge on it now that he knows this limitation.

Peter - is it 900 Celsius or 900 Fahrenheit?
 
New Blades said:
The damage seems minimal considering the edge and what was being cut.
Click to expand...

I'll try and get some better pics later on, I still haven't been to bed yet.

The damage is pretty bad, the worst i've seen on any of my busses.

BTW, got my boss street today, I love it!
 
PeterPHWS said:
secondly ... Jerry does not qualify his warranty by saying "only available to those with a factory profile" ... if you sharpen your knife to an edge you reasonably expect works best for your intended purpose you are still covered ... that I am sure is Busse's view and no doubt they will verify this in due course ... all warranty's on knives are not invalidated by simply your chosen method of sharpening ...
Click to expand...

jerry has pretty clearly stated the nature of the warranty, and it isn't "if you think it will work it's covered". If your modification is a direct cause of a failure where the knife would have otherwise not failed with it's original stock geometry, it's not covered unless manager discretion is provided. Jerry gave the extreme example of a knife edge brought down to .005", but the qualifier of "if your modification is what broke it" still remains.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6759861&postcount=12

Jerry Busse said:
ONLY if their modifications contribute to whatever failure your blade might experience. For example, if someone decides to grind their Battle Mistress primary bevel down to .005" before the edge and then their edge doesn't hold up under heavy abuse then the warranty on that portion of the knife would be void. Other unmodified portions of the knife like the handle, pommel, etc. are still covered.

We can only WARRANT the work that WE do.


Hope that helps, :thumbup:

Jerry :D


.
Click to expand...
 
in my opinion I don't think your modification was a direct cause of failure, it might have helped out a little, but you probably would have had problems with a comp-sarsquatch even with the factory edge... The competition edges are fairly thin, and in 20 degree weather or lower, chopping frozen logs... I haven't seen many user posts about those conditions, but its seem to be in one of the extremes where any knife is likely to fail.
 
richstag said:
I agree nothing unusual. That is why I suggested trying to put a more durable edge on it now that he knows this limitation.

Peter - is it 900 Celsius or 900 Fahrenheit?
Click to expand...

Good point ... if the US goes off F then it is F ... I am trying to remember the quench fig's off the top of my head ... but because we use C over here I think that's my mistake ...

On the points made by LVC ... my view is that Jerry needs to cover his back from the "Infi" detractors who occasionally turn up with micro lenses and show damage which is basically making a lot of fuss about nothing ... a "normal" guy using his best judgement for an edge and going out to do what the knives were made for ... I bet he is covered all the time :thumbup:
 
Last edited:
You'll be covered m8 there are no questions about that, just let Jerry know, mater of fact I bet before to long the Boss Hog will appear and will offer to take care of it for ya. And thanks for posting, I was planing a winter hike as well, and am gonna take my ash cg with me, I doubt anything will break that tank, but just in case I'd like to see how this will play out.
 
PeterPHWS said:
a "normal" guy using his best judgement for an edge and going out to do what the knives were made for ...
Click to expand...

a normal guy who has machining and metalurgy experience isn't same as a normal guy who has only ever used big box store axes that have 60 degree per side edge angles. The extremes of what people call "normal" makes for a highly variable interpretation of a warranty. I consider this material science, not subjective user experience. That's why I ask about the rc or janka hardness scale of frozen hardwood: the hardness of the material being cut largely determines the edge angle you should be using to protect you knife against damage. INFI is not adamantium, it has limits.

I think 230 is well within the warranty because the competition sar squatches were already thin, and I doubt he brought it down much thinner then was already factory.
 
PeterPHWS said:
Good point ... if the US goes off F then it is F ... I am trying to remember the quench fig's off the top of my head ... but because we use C over here I think that's my mistake ...

On the points made by LVC ... my view is that Jerry needs to cover his back from the "Infi" detractors who occasionally turn up with micro lenses and show damage which is basically making a lot of fuss about nothing ... a "normal" guy using his best judgement for an edge and going out to do what the knives were made for ... I bet he is covered all the time :thumbup:
Click to expand...

It would be Fahrenheit.
 
Last Visible Canary said:
a normal guy who has machining and metalurgy experience isn't same as a normal guy who has only ever used big box store axes that have 60 degree per side edge angles. The extremes of what people call "normal" makes for a highly variable interpretation of a warranty. I consider this material science, not subjective user experience. That's why I ask about the rc or janka hardness scale of frozen hardwood: the hardness of the material being cut largely determines the edge angle you should be using to protect you knife against damage. INFI is not adamantium, it has limits.

I think 230 is well within the warranty because the competition sar squatches were already thin, and I doubt he brought it down much thinner then was already factory.
Click to expand...

We are supposed to have the same warranty on the thin Busse's as are on the thick ones ... it is unlikely they go off what was the original grind ... if you take it to a logical conclusion ... if the edge was thicker or as thin as on the thinner knives he ought to be covered ...
 
In my view the knife should be covered by the warranty. However, the real question is is this typical for Busse blades that are sharpened to the same or similar angel? From what I have heard Infi performs better if you keep it at 40°.

Also one advantage of the titanium knives, like Mission MPK, is that the titanium is not affected by the cold.
 
Well the good part is that it won't take too long to fix it. :)

The bad part is that it happened. :(
 
I think the same on the fixing it front ... although I might want the blade checked out if offered the chance ... sometimes there are a number of variables worth checking ...

It is often hard to know whether it was a particular bit of wood/ice or is it the knife ??
Putting your mind at rest is a good thing ... although re-profiling the edge to a more robust convex curve and giving the knife a go again would be my first thoughts...

I am probably daft enough to have taken some of the wood and lugged it back to try again with the same knife re-profiled ... just to set my mind at rest and to tell myself it is all a learning curve on what is the best way to prep a knife for tasks like this...:D
 
Nuke41 said:
More proof that a knife makes a poor axe.
Click to expand...

Very true - a knife will not replace an axe through it's widest ranges of abilities. But, if you have the right knife, their capabilities overlap a lot more than some people will ever know (or admit). Plus the knife generally gives you much more versatility for other tasks.
 
PeterPHWS said:
We are supposed to have the same warranty on the thin Busse's as are on the thick ones ... it is unlikely they go off what was the original grind ... if you take it to a logical conclusion ... if the edge was thicker or as thin as on the thinner knives he ought to be covered ...
Click to expand...

not entirely. If you put the same edge that is on a bad onto a moab, the amount of force, especially torqueing when you try to wrench the blade out of the wood, will be considerably higher with the moab then you could apply to the bad.

I'm saying that the comp sar squatches have thin edges thus the knife here is probably close to a standard model because it is the same size and made for the same type of use. Jerry has tested this size knife with a thin edge and feels that it's worth putting into production with the full warranty. I would not assume that a nmfbm could maintain a bad type edge and grind geometry while chopping hardwoods; When jerry produces a battle mistress with a competition edge, then I'll say that jerry feels it's a reasonable edge for that type of knife and that similar sized knives with modified edges to match are likely to maintain warranty coverage.

I know I'm splitting hairs here, but it sounds like your implying that the warranty should cover more then it actually covers, that a person should be able to modify the knife in whatever way they think is "reasonable" and maintain the warranty, and that is way to broad of a description. some people think a .005 edge geometry is great for heavy choppers: until jerry produces one I have to assume that jerry doesn't and that it won't be covered by the warranty if you modify it as such.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top