Incredible custom strider!

Bladeandbarrel said:
Neil,
You are making a lot of assumptions here. If you or anyone ever asked me in person what I thought of this knife at this price I would share my views completely.
Congrats on selling it. I would run out and buy a lottery ticket if I were you.
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so now you went from personally insulting Mick, to his collectors and now to Neil? To suggest neil got lucky with this sale is an insult...as i am sure you know, Neil is one of the top dealers out there...and virtually every custom strider he puts up on his site (even those costing thousands) sells in minutes...

say what you will but the market is moving away from the makers you mentioned...and the gap between what strider can charge and what they can charge will only widen...just look at how much attention this thread got versus others from the makers you mentioned.

roger, your questions about the knife aren't offensive...can't say the same about your characterization of "strider apologists"

RL
 
I'm more into users, but I do check in often and take a look at the beautiful knives here. It sure does seem to me like Mr. Strider has come a long way in his craft in a relatively short time, and these knives pictures show this, at least to me. I agree with Kevin, who wondered what knd of reception these would get with someone elses mark on it. I like the second Strider much more than the Winkler (though I really like some of his, and generally like the rustic style, too).
 
notdos said:
Hi guys,
You can debate the styling or the engineering of a knife but the reality is that a knife is worth what someone is willing to pay for it. This knife sold for $4500, thus, it was worth $4500. Just because that statement is simple, does not make it facile.
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I disagree. It was worth $4500 to that person. Questions of value are a little more complex. I could pay you a thousand dollars for a pair of your old socks. That would mean nothing more than that - for some inexplicable reason - your old socks were worth $1k to me.

notdos said:
Will it be worth $4500 next week? Irrelevant.

Phillip :)
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It may well be irrelevant to you. But who are you to say it should be irrelevant to others? More than a few people consider the long term investment value of their knives - particularly multi-thousand-dollar single pieces - to be highly relevant indeed.

Roger
 
Kevin Jones said:
I was wondering how long before someone was going to bring up the "the knife is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it" claim.
Simply not true IMO.

Just because a sportscar that consistently sells for $125,000 in LA or Miami will only bring $25,000 in Grundy Va. doesn't mean that the sportscar is only worth $25,000 no more than a sportscar that consistently sells for $25,000 is worth $50,000 just because an individual is willing to pay that to be the first one on his block to own one.

An object is not always worth what a single individual is will to pay for it. People overpay for items everyday.
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Exactamundo.

Roger
 
RL said:
say what you will but the market is moving away from the makers you mentioned...and the gap between what strider can charge and what they can charge will only widen...just look at how much attention this thread got versus others from the makers you mentioned.

RL
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There IS a market that exists OUTSIDE THE market that you speak of...and it is populated by people hungry for the next Strider, the next Blackwood, the next tactical flavor-of-the-month....

It doesn't exist in a lot of the primary market, and you don't see that much of it at the higher end shows....so I would say what you know of the macrocosm market might be smaller than you think.

You may very well be a market maker in the microcosm market...but if you contrast how the Strider market balances with say, the Onion market, Bogi market, or Walker market...you will see a natural arc...coming to a market near you.

Let's just take a Dean El Diablo for example right now, that is selling for a very reasonable $2,000-$3,000. Dean is an AKI maker, at the top of his game, and is moving steadily UP....and the prices don't fall, at all, have not for over 8 years.....and he JUST did his first AKI....regardless of what you think, the last show had a 96% sell through rate...do you think the comparison will hold up, even if it is valid now(which I doubt).?


Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
RL said:
roger, your questions about the knife aren't offensive...can't say the same about your characterization of "strider apologists"

RL
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So, got any answers, or just standing pat with conclusory statements about how Mick really outdid himself?

"apologist"

  • a person who argues to defend or justify some policy or institution; "an apologist for capital punishment"
  • Apologetics is the field of study concerned with the systematic defense of a position. Someone who engages in apologetics is called an apologist or an "apologete".The term comes from the Greek word apologia (απολογία), meaning defense of a position against an attack. ...
  • synonym - vindicator

You find this offensive, how, exactly?

Near as I can figure, I attributed no characteristics whatsoever to Strider apologists. Or do you simply find any criticism of this maker or his work inherently offensive? Just asking.

Roger
 
roger, just because i choose not to converse in a manner that is demonstrative of my lexiconic capabilities does not mean i need you to pull out a dictionary...

you might want to consult your dictionary before re-reading my post though...where did i say any "criticism of this maker or his work" was "inherently offensive"???? I said your characterization of the PEOPLE who like his work is offensive. Would you like me to look up the meaning of the words "people" and "work" for you? Perhaps I could draw a flow diagram delineating the difference between Mick's abilities as a knifemaker and the other "offensive" comments as well...let me know.

RL
 
RL said:
roger, just because i choose not to converse in a manner that is demonstrative of my lexiconic capabilities does not mean i need you to pull out a dictionary...

you might want to consult your dictionary before re-reading my post though...where did i say any "criticism of this maker or his work" was "inherently offensive"???? I said your characterization of the PEOPLE who like his work is offensive. Would you like me to look up the meaning of the words "people" and "work" for you?

RL
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Oooookay - how have I characterized the "people" who like his "work"? You are long on generalizations and short on specifics. Seriously - take your time, go through the handful of posts I have made on this thread and tell me what characteristics I have attributed to these people - positive or negative. No rush.


And I didn't assert that you found all criticism of the maker offensive - I asked if you did. I thought it might explain why you found my posts offensive.



Roger
 
RL said:
say what you will but the market is moving away from the makers you mentioned...and the gap between what strider can charge and what they can charge will only widen...just look at how much attention this thread got versus others from the makers you mentioned.
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RL - no one is arguing that Mick Strider & the rest of the tactical crowd doesn't have a strong wind behind their back. We're not arguing that this stuff doesn't sell. Of course it does. The question - and I hope you'll agree that it is a legitimate question - is whether this is a fad that is going to hurt collectors.

All the collectors here have seen makers, or entire trends, disappear over night. Some will mention the interframe folder bubble as a good example of a bubble where a lot of customers lost a total of tens of thousands of dollars.

I personally think that the Strider custom thing is a bubble, and a fad. As much as I respect the right of people to spend their money however they want, I still find it a bit disturbing to see it. For what it's worth, I also see bubbles in "our world", and we've seen a lot of discussions about this.

Add to that the controversy around Mick Strider's implied-but-never-quite-explicitly-mentioned fake special ops background, and the near cult following that Strider and a few others enjoy, and you'll understand that people will tend to be very dismissive of this type of work & of its pricing.
 
ok i ll do it what the hell is the steel and how was it treated
looks neat but i want to know as a maker my self
till someone comes up with more info i don't care

BTW is it interesting yes would i ever pay 4500 for it NO
and for the micks soo cool he gets more posts here crowd most of the posts have been back and forth bickering and that sure as hell doenst count as "real posting" about the knife to me
 
.. this afternoon, about 3pm, i had to pull two Eighth grade girls off each other fighting in the school parking lot.

And, day before yesterday i went to a funeral.
David
 
When the "art knife" bubble burst numerous collectors were left holding the bag on millions of dollars of seriously overvalued stuff. Much of it was very beautiful, but bought in an overzealous frenzy fueled by lack of buyer education, heavy promotion as "investment" and also egregiously priced out of this world. When collectors were getting 30 cents on the dollar for their items in the aftermarket they rebelled. Many quit knife collecting altogether. Most stopped supporting many of the dealers and makers that raked them over the coals. Lessons can be learned here. History has a nasty habit of repeating itself.
 
I am not into the futuristic combat type stuff but if any press is good press Mr. Strider has people talkin. bad or good he is in the limelight and the price's he is getting show this. like i said before if he can get it good for him
 
RL said:
say what you will but the market is moving away from the makers you mentioned...and the gap between what strider can charge and what they can charge will only widen...just look at how much attention this thread got versus others from the makers you mentioned.
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I gotta call BS on that one. What do you have to back up that statement? The knives of makers mentioned by Anthony are all highly sought after, with each of them selling out at shows within minutes and having three or more year delivery times on orders. Some were so backed up that they stopped taking orders. I don't agree that the market is moving away from them.
 
Hi RogerP!

My comments directed towards you were regarding "san mei" and "san mai."

I got the fool idea that the topic knife belonged to RL because he was very excited to post its pictures and start this thread and rare is the person who starts a thread about a knife here that isn't his or her own and whom isn't a photographer. My assumption was wrong.

You are correct that we're not forbidden from discussing relative values of knives and it would be counterproductive for top-tier collectors to stop doing so. It looked to me like the original poster was sharing images of a knife that brings him great pleasure (I incorrectly assumed it was his) and then be told what he should enjoy and how he should've spent his money instead of on the knife that made him happy.

Now if RL was into custom knives as an investor, the advice would be very sound. If he was into custom knives because the knives were either made solely for him or as a one of kind expression of a maker's talent and drive, it would be rude. Here, again, I'm making assumptions on RL's motivations. I'm also making assumptions that the tough love and alternatives suggested by others wasn't really needed based on the previous assumption that RL likes the knife for the way it looks and not for how it may rise or lower in resale value.

Hoping I was clearer this time around and that you feel better soon.
 
I recall an incident a few years ago... I was really thirsty... there was a vending machine full of cold beverages. The vending machine only accepted ones and all I had was a five. So I gave a guy my five for a one so I could get a coke.

I paid $5 for $1.

Does that mean that a dollar is actually worth five dollars?

Well that dollar, at that time was worth five bucks. But when one ponders an object's worth, especially when considering its investment potential, one should look beyond just the best bid. How deep is the market's bid? How broad is the demand base? How large is the pool of prospective buyers? How liquid is the asset? What relative value considerations would other prospective buyers consider?

All valid questions when considering a knife, or any other asset for an investment.

Sure, this knife is apparently worth $4500 to someone. Time will tell whether that will prove a sound investment for the knife's new owner.

Anyway, as I mentioned earlier I'd still love to see some shop pics. That's a big chunk of damascus that Mick forged! A heck of a piece of steel there...
 
RogerP said:
Now, somebody asked a good question that hasn't been answered - about Mick's forge, the steels used, the heat treating etc. This piece was also descibed as "san mei" - I assume RL meant "san mai" - so I would like to hear more about the steel that forms the blade core and those which form the outer laminated layer. Has Mick been forging for long? What are his experiences with forging carbon steel blades? Has he done so, or has he gone straight to damascus? Does he do his own heat treatment?
Roger
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somebody has to have answers. please!

thanks,
hans
 
brightred said:
somebody has to have answers. please!

thanks,
hans
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I've looked a bit on the Strider Knives website, and on their forum. I couldn't find any info on the steel in these knives, or even how/where/when Mick started making damascus except for one vague reference saying "Mick bought the company" when someone else asked. Mick "bought the company" is quite different from "hand-forged by Mick." So what is it? I'd be very interested to see how Mick went from grinder to forge, but if it is merely that he now owns the source of his material, and is therefore "making" it, that is much less interesting.


Edit: one other question. Why is it called "san mei" damascus? Usually, "san mai" refers to a construction with a core of steel A wrapped with steel B. Steel A might be a high carbon steel, left at high hardness, and the steel B might be a softer, more flexible lower carbon steel. In all the pictures on the TNK site I looked at (including the pictures in this thread) it is clear the knives are not made from a traditional san mai construction. They are simply "normal" damascus billets ground to shape.

Josh@Strider?
RL?
Neil O?
 
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