Just finished a spine whack test on my Buck Select.

[precisionshootist]

I don't understand some of the replies. Yes, I've watched many different Youtube videos and other sources clearly demonstrating high quality liner lock knives that will unlock with a simple impact, sometimes just to the palm of the hand. Are these videos faked? Do you think all the videos of people batoning and spine whacking the heck out of the Cold Steel folders without fail are faked? I believe I remember reading Michael Walker himself stating in order for the liner lock to be reliable the angles and hardness of the locking components have to be near perfect for the design to work. This requires hand fitting by someone who understands the principle of the lock. This is why the design does not work well for production folders no matter what the price point or quality of the materials used. In my thinking, any design for a mechanical device that has to be executed perfectly in order to be reliable is a flawed design and is workable only in theory but not in actual practice.

 

[ohen cepel]

The "Net Ninja" power is strong in this thread...........

I have that Buck knife, it's a great knife for the money. At to stabbing people backwards while I hang from a swing set on the 3rd Tuesday of a month, I don't know. Haven't tried it, but it works great for an EDC.

 

[cncpro11]

A liner locking knife if MADE CORRECTLY will fail open so it does not close. If it closes for what ever reason other than folding blade in to the frame and putting it back in your pocket/pouch it is made INCORRECTLY! How do you folks not get that? keepem sharp

PS I feel much better now, thanks

I would agree if a knife is being used as intended and the lock fails, then it is made incorrectly, but I don't think running around beating on things with the spine of my knife is the proper use.
Most common sense people get that.

 

[Insipid Moniker]

I got whacked in the spine before.
It hurt.

To test locks, I apply steady pressure on the spine of the blade.

This is the test that I tend to use as well, as it mimics the type of stress I'm more likely to put on a lock and runs a lower risk of damaging the knife. That said, I still feel like the spine-whack test gives some valuable data, but I'd rather watch someone do it to their knives than do it to my own.

 

[SPXTrader]

wow. Big red text and everything. My spine has been whacked.

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[Insipid Moniker]

I would agree if a knife is being used as intended and the lock fails, then it is made incorrectly, but I don't think running around beating on things with the spine of my knife is the proper use.
Most common sense people get that.

Seems like a basic strawman. Generally speaking, proper use of a folding knife isn't really going to put much stress on the lock, just like proper use of a car isn't going to put much stress on a seatbelt. Both are safety features that I'd rather not rely on, but I still want them to work right if I do need them.

 

[POCEH KOCEB]

It seems that you are taking this very personal. I am sure that it can be argued either way by either side as to the validity of this type of testing, but it seems that you are making this a personal thing. Why is that? The person that started this thread, and did the testing to his own knife hasn't had as much to say on this as you have. What gives?

Seriously ? You see it as a personal thing ? I'm only trying to show them how ignorant is to say something like this:

It's just that the test is worthless. It says nothing.

... or this:

Chances of the spine hitting something and the lock failing are slim to none.

Think about it: How can you say with absolute certainty that chance to hit the back of your blade is "slim to none" ? I worked for 16 years in hospital operating room environment, I was responsible for all of the equipment in over 30 ORs, the most used cutting tool were those special scissors we used there, but I used folder all the time, including in emergency situations when my pair of scissors were not around... Do you realize how dumb all this talk sounds to me since I was using my knife under operating tables to cut wires, ties, drapes, whatever else, hitting the blade here and there in equipment, frames, IV poles and so on (including on the back), and according to those geniuses when I needed to cut some wires I was supposed to check what the little book that came in the box sais about it...?

This type of mentality always amuses me... perfectly normal people entertain themselves with stuff that they think they have experience with only because they carry around $300 knife to open letters and cut some boxes with...
I connected terminals with knife's blade, started cars, did bunch of thing that are "slim to none" in the instructions how to use your knife, how can someone look at the failing lock and say: "It means nothing" ? It means that it failed, you have to be blind or something else not to realize what you are seeing.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating to abuse a blade, this is the funny part, I'm absolutely for using the blade in a normal way, just as intended by design but one cannot predict how the circumstances will have you using the blade, that's it...

On the other hand, talking about the 'test" for itself and the OP: I did this test as you can see from the video with the Zancudo. It unlocks with the slightest hit on the back, I mean, you cannot move the blade even an inch further past the straight line... Do I think this knife is good for nothing ? Absolutely not. For the intended purposes, I love the little Zancudo so much that I'm getting 2 more, one for my son and one, orange for myself, but after the test I would know that I'll have to be careful with it and to avoid situations when I have a chance to hit it on the back because it most likely will unlock, that's it, this is what the test shows, nicely done, inexpensive knife that you have to be careful with and don't push it too much...

And for someone to seat here and tell me that it's nothing, well I cannot help but laugh at such mainstream, there is no arguing on either site, inexpensive knifes could fail the test, IMHO everything that is over a $100 is poorly made if it fail it and there is no made up logic that should justify it, that's my opinion if I'm allowed to stand behind it, especially when you can easily see the proof if you try it with your knife... It's not personal, I'm having a lots of fun watching how the subject is changed and jokes are flying when there is no argument to present, but it's OK, it's only a forum, we all should have fun, right ?

Talking about fun and taking it easy, here is an idea: Do you want to turn the table, to go little bit further than the OP's question about the test ? Lets ask how many of those that argue against it are walking around with over $100 knifes that fail such horrible and meaningless test of hardly 3-5lb hit in the back of the blade, and everything will fall on its place, don't you think ? ... Let's see how fatal is 3-5lb hit in the "spine" for a knife of good quality and reputable maker ...

 

[POCEH KOCEB]

I don't understand some of the replies...

You don't understand it because obviously you are capable of processing what you observe and you are capable of carrying a normal conversation with someone that disagree with you without talking about mall ninjas and what's in the manual... Isn't hard to figure it out.

 

[Karda]

Lets start making this discussion about the subject matter and not about each other.
More bickering on this tiresome subject will only serve to close the thread.

 

[cncpro11]

Seems like a basic strawman. Generally speaking, proper use of a folding knife isn't really going to put much stress on the lock, just like proper use of a car isn't going to put much stress on a seatbelt. Both are safety features that I'd rather not rely on, but I still want them to work right if I do need them.

The car analogy is tired.
We aren't talking about a 2000 pound machine with hundreds of moving parts and thousands of outside variables that need to be perfect in order to get from a to b in wind, rain, ice, or ignorant or drunk drivers....it is a simple tool in my hand, and if I get cut with it, it is my own stupid fault. And I shoulda got a fixed blade.

Do they make fixed blade cars?

 

[Goosey]

Pfft, like POCEH KOCEB said, what's the point of a lock?

Why won't we all carry one-handed slipjoints or friction folders?

The lock stops the blade from closing. It provides a margin of safety.

So logically, to test the lock, you'd try to force the blade closed to see if it holds.





Doesn't seem like this should be something that is hard to understand.



Is smacking the spine of your knife on a table smart? I wouldn't do it myself. It's not something you should aim for.

If a knife fails a spine-whack test, is that completely useless information? No.






It seems like there are certain purists who refuse to acknowledge the usefulness of anything designed for "hard use", unless that "hard use" is merely forceful cutting ("if you can't do it with an Opinel, you shouldn't do it with a ZT 0560").

Probably some kind of backlash against the people who believe if you can't jam it in a tree and do 100 pull-ups on it, then stab it through a pig skull, it's junk.



Both sides should be more open in their opinions.

 

[SuzukiGS750EZ]

People just don't learn no matter how much we try and teach them... I feel like the general knife community doesn't grasp concepts quickly.

 

[fzla226]

That's kind of odd. I had a vantage avid a few years back and the lockup was midway with a stuff liner. It wouldn't disengage from spine wacks.

 

[fzla226]

I would agree if a knife is being used as intended and the lock fails, then it is made incorrectly, but I don't think running around beating on things with the spine of my knife is the proper use.
Most common sense people get that.

Personally I can think of a lot of uses for a knife where I might put a lot of pressure on the lock. I don't see the problem with testing a lock to get an idea of its capabilities and strength.
A spine wack test sounds kind of dumb because you're not often going to be doing it intentionally but you could replicate it in use by accident . Accidents tend to happen and good safety tends to prevent injury.

 

[SuzukiGS750EZ]

Personally I can think of a lot of uses for a knife where I might put a lot of pressure on the lock. I don't see the problem with testing a lock to get an idea of its capabilities and strength.
A spine wack test sounds kind of dumb because you're not often going to be doing it intentionally but you could replicate it in use by accident . Accidents tend to happen and good safety tends to prevent injury.

A whack is a sudden harsh impact. I can see putting it under a table and pulling up with some Pressure, but a whack test will dent the lock and otherwise cause a perfectly functioning knife to get damaged. Do you test your cars airbags for effectiveness by crashing it the day you buy it? Why not? You need to see how they'll hold up in the event of a future crash... Think of a lock as a safety and not as something that turns the knife into a fixed blade. A safety on a gun is meant to deter accidents from happening, but the truth is the brains the person has and the safe handling practices of the firearm are a better safety. Treat any folding knife as a folding knife. I've never even had a Swiss Army knife close on my hand, you guys must cringe at the though of your fathers and grandfathers lockless knives back in the day.

 

[Goosey]

Do you test your cars airbags for effectiveness by crashing it the day you buy it?

The company does it, they are required to by law if they want to sell the car to people. I don't spine-whack my own knives, but if someone else does it I'll accept their data for what it is... data. If someone tells me a particular knife easily fails a spine-whack I will keep that in mind. It's more useful data than watching Noss trying to baton concrete, the difference being I'd expect a knife to stand up to a reasonable whack on the spine, if it easily fails something is probably wrong with it, whereas I already know exactly what will occur when batoning concrete.

 

[cncpro11]

Personally I can think of a lot of uses for a knife where I might put a lot of pressure on the lock. I don't see the problem with testing a lock to get an idea of its capabilities and strength.
A spine wack test sounds kind of dumb because you're not often going to be doing it intentionally but you could replicate it in use by accident . Accidents tend to happen and good safety tends to prevent injury.

If you replicate it in use, then you are not practicing good safety.
I have been trying to think of a scenario where I would use a knife in such a way that it would suddenly turn over in my hand and smack itself on the spine really really hard and can't for the life of me come up with a single one.

 

[Monofletch]

The spine on my RAT 3 has never failer me no matter how hard I whack it!!

 

[Insipid Moniker]

The car analogy is tired.
We aren't talking about a 2000 pound machine with hundreds of moving parts and thousands of outside variables that need to be perfect in order to get from a to b in wind, rain, ice, or ignorant or drunk drivers....it is a simple tool in my hand, and if I get cut with it, it is my own stupid fault. And I shoulda got a fixed blade.

Do they make fixed blade cars?

You failed to address the point at all. Simple or complex, safety features are there in case of accidents. They don't make fixed blade cars, but they do provide public transportation. You don't have to wear your seat belt and you're less likely to be involved in a motor vehicle accident on that. But it's less convenient than just jumping in your car. Kind of like how throwing a folder in your pocket is more convenient than carrying a fixed blade, if I can stretch a 'tired' analogy.

 

[pvicenzi]

You failed to address the point at all. Simple or complex, safety features are there in case of accidents. They don't make fixed blade cars, but they do provide public transportation. You don't have to wear your seat belt and you're less likely to be involved in a motor vehicle accident on that. But it's less convenient than just jumping in your car. Kind of like how throwing a folder in your pocket is more convenient than carrying a fixed blade, if I can stretch a 'tired' analogy.

So, should we drive our cars into walls in order to test te seatbelt?