Knives are not prybars!

collim1 said:
I agree.

I was brought up to use your knife carefully and protect your blade as much as possible.

What really kills me is all the talk about hard use and batoning in a survival situation. In a true survival situation the very last thing I want to do is dull my blade and not be able to resharpen it.

You better believe I would be very careful to preserve my edge and avoid unnecessary abuse.

I use my all my knives, but as cutting instruments only. I carry a multitool in addition to my knife everyday for the purpose of prying and cutting wire etc...

But I must admit the knife world would be pretty boring without all the torture test and hypotheticals we read about on BF. I certainly do enjoy reading about that stuff and watching the videos, some of it just makes me cringe.
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I agree, kinda ridiculous right? Especially considering there are pry bars in pretty much every garage and tool shed in america. I think it'd be fairly easy to procure one in a survival situation. If it was a wilderness survival situation I can't imagine having to pry anything small enough that a knife would work. You'd think a stick would be more useful for wilderness prying
 
Dpx hest II assault, woodsman, original all have prybars fashioned into birds beak style handle. Larger models have similar but not as prominent prys as well.
 
I use my Delica to pry off keycaps from telephones at work. Works really nicely. If I bend or break the tip it's my own damn fault.
 
I carry a Latshaw Pocketwrench/prybar paracorded on my belt loop all the time. The most useful tool I've ever bought that takes up hardly any space. I never pry with my knife because I have that on me , plus it has other features.
 
marcinek said:
Again, like I said earlier, part of the blame certainly lies on the goofballs who go prying with folders. I just think part also lies with the manufacturers who, coyly, say, "Our knives are heavy duty tanks".
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Honestly I think this is really nit picking. Its not false advertisement. Its marketing. And saying something is "built like a tank" isnt specific enough to hold the marketing slogan accountable for any specific purpose. You cant get mad at the company for "built like a tank" marketing for not surviving prying any more than you can for it not coming with a built in gun turret. People need to accept responsibility for their stupidity. Not only with prying with a knife but with taking the writing on the side of the box in an extremely literal sense. Do we next go to the supermarkets crying foul over hamburger with no ham in it? I also dont remember getting any sand in my sandwich I ate yesterday. My cola has no cola nor coke in it and I am still really upset that not a single Goldfish cracker in my box swims. Seriously, if anyone looks at the side of a box and reads "built like a tank" and takes it in the literal sense and then takes it upon themselves to attach a meaning to it when obviously none was expressed then they are the ones to blame. There is always a fine line between being taken advantage of and the person just being naive, ignorant or stupid. Possibly a combination of all three.
 
False advertisement and marketing hmmm. Red bull gives you wings lol. Nope they got sued for it and you can get money or some free red bull. Can somebody please sue zt so I can get a free one. 😜
 
Topcatpt said:
False advertisement and marketing hmmm. Red bull gives you wings lol. Nope they got sued for it and you can get money or some free red bull. Can somebody please sue zt so I can get a free one.
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PURPLEDC said:
Honestly I think this is really nit picking. Its not false advertisement. Its marketing. And saying something is "built like a tank" isnt specific enough to hold the marketing slogan accountable for any specific purpose. You cant get mad at the company for "built like a tank" marketing for not surviving prying any more than you can for it not coming with a built in gun turret. People need to accept responsibility for their stupidity. Not only with prying with a knife but with taking the writing on the side of the box in an extremely literal sense. Do we next go to the supermarkets crying foul over hamburger with no ham in it? I also dont remember getting any sand in my sandwich I ate yesterday. My cola has no cola nor coke in it and I am still really upset that not a single Goldfish cracker in my box swims. Seriously, if anyone looks at the side of a box and reads "built like a tank" and takes it in the literal sense and then takes it upon themselves to attach a meaning to it when obviously none was expressed then they are the ones to blame. There is always a fine line between being taken advantage of and the person just being naive, ignorant or stupid. Possibly a combination of all three.
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There are always degrees. Of course slogans can't be taken in the literal sense. But the fact that ZT claims their knives are "hard use" while not backing it up with their warranty policy leads one to think that they are more interested in selling the idea of hard use knives instead of actual hard use knives. Again, look at Strider. Strider claims their knives are "designed to survive use in the harshest of conditions." Regardless of what the knives can actually do, this is the same marketing pitch, yet Strider is the one who will stand by their "hard use" claim by not voiding your warranty if your knife is used for things other than cutting.
 
asdf12345 said:
There are always degrees. Of course slogans can't be taken in the literal sense. But the fact that ZT claims their knives are "hard use" while not backing it up with their warranty policy leads one to think that they are more interested in selling the idea of hard use knives instead of actual hard use knives. Again, look at Strider. Strider claims their knives are "designed to survive use in the harshest of conditions." Regardless of what the knives can actually do, this is the same marketing pitch, yet Strider is the one who will stand by their "hard use" claim by not voiding your warranty if your knife is used for things other than cutting.
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What you are failing to understand, and I will make one last clear, plain and simple attempt at communicating the facts, is that -

ZT DOES NOT ADVERTISE ANY USE OF THE KNIFE OTHER THAN CUTTING -

ZT WILL HONOR THE WARRANTY IF YOUR KNIFE FAILS WHILE CUTTING.

Some should read the actual marketing texts to understand what is really being said buy the company, and what is being quoted as customer testimonials.

And finally, in closing , the person that theoretically spurred all this ignorance by prying OSB sheet from a 2x4 with his ZT0562 found that the lockbar insert was loose, and in fact his abusive use of the knife did not break it.

Best of luck in your cutlery pursuits.

mqqn
 
asdf12345 said:
There are always degrees. Of course slogans can't be taken in the literal sense. But the fact that ZT claims their knives are "hard use" while not backing it up with their warranty policy leads one to think that they are more interested in selling the idea of hard use knives instead of actual hard use knives. Again, look at Strider. Strider claims their knives are "designed to survive use in the harshest of conditions." Regardless of what the knives can actually do, this is the same marketing pitch, yet Strider is the one who will stand by their "hard use" claim by not voiding your warranty if your knife is used for things other than cutting.
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What is written in the warranty and what they actually honor are two different things. Most warranties have a pretty generic base and its purpose is mostly to protect the company from people abusing the warranty. It allows ZT to have a certain amount of discretion when determining abuse. Regardless I have NEVER had ZT deny a warranty claim. I have sent modified knives, abused knives and knives with problems of no fault to anyone but myself and they have never once denied me even when i tried to take responsibility and pay for any repairs. So from my perspective you have to do some really stupid to have them not honor the warranty. And if you are simply going by what is written in the warranty papers you will find they dont follow it to the letter. I think people are really getting hung up on written words and arent taking into consideration what actually takes place in reality. In fact I have heard of strider denying warranty claims more than I have ZT. Because with strider you may get them to correct a problem with a knife if you can convince them there was a problem to begin with. I cant tell you how many times in the past they have used the "its made that way on purpose" excuse. Their current site isnt any indicator but many moons ago a large portion of their website was a FAQ rooted in telling customers why they are wrong about their assumptions as to how their knives are made. Also the term "hard use" is a matter of interpretation. Some will look at hard use as a blanket statement in which they will assume the knife will never fail no matter what they do to it. I think that to be a bit unrealistic. When i read hard use, I read that their knives are built more robust than the majority of knives made in the same price bracket. Which i think they live up to that. I think what we are seeing is that if any company good bad or otherwise leaves any hanging threads of any kind any where there will always be someone searching to pull that thread and unwind the sweater so to speak if for no other reason but because they can. I amount it to the same type of thinking that has some people seeing the lack of a wet floor sign or a steaming cup of coffee as a pay check. If you want to find fault in something you WILL find fault in something. And I think customers using loose marketing terminology against a company is actually worse than the company using loose marketing to begin with. Your common sense and logic should play a bigger role in your desire to lay blame just because you can.
 
There is a reason crowbars don't fold.

On the other hand, who cares what people do with their property?

If you don't want to read stupid stuff, why read general?
 
asdf12345 said:
There are always degrees. Of course slogans can't be taken in the literal sense. But the fact that ZT claims their knives are "hard use" while not backing it up with their warranty policy leads one to think that they are more interested in selling the idea of hard use knives instead of actual hard use knives.
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Wow! 127 posts and the concept of marketing is almost realized. Now we just gotta get you to read what ZT is actually saying.

mqqn said:
What you are failing to understand, and I will make one last clear, plain and simple attempt at communicating the facts, is that -

ZT DOES NOT ADVERTISE ANY USE OF THE KNIFE OTHER THAN CUTTING -

ZT WILL HONOR THE WARRANTY IF YOUR KNIFE FAILS WHILE CUTTING.

Some should read the actual marketing texts to understand what is really being said buy the company, and what is being quoted as customer testimonials.
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And look! Here is a post that does just that!
 
Who said prying falls into the category of hard use? I think that was made up by some uber tacticool wanna be hard ass high speed operators. Almost every knife company out there states clearly that prying is ABUSE and not hard use.

Show me in some literature of ZT that prying is considered 'hard use' or that being 'built like a tank means' you can pry with it.

You can't hold a company to some arbitrary standard that you apply to it.

That's would be like complaining that Benchmade's Gold Class knives don't contain actual gold in them...




Then again, I'm just ZT's #1 fanboy so don't let my logic make you forget that.
 
Jens Schuetz said:
the warranty is usually in the box and can only be read after you gave them your coin already.
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Jens Schuetz said:
Legally binding regarding the actual purchase can only be what is known before the payment is made.
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Jens Schuetz said:
The purchase contract is done once they say what you get what they want for it and you make the payment and receive the product.
Backsies aren't legal.
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You can't be serious. They are not hiding the warranty from you. You can ask the company or vendor what the warranty of the product is before you buy. It is not some secret. Imagine walking into your favorite knife store and asking the person at the desk what the warranty is on that ZT knife and them saying, "I can't tell you. Once you buy the knife there is a piece of paper in the box that has the warranty on it". Ridiculous.
 
craytab said:
Wow! 127 posts and the concept of marketing is almost realized. Now we just gotta get you to read what ZT is actually saying.



And look! Here is a post that does just that!
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So you admit that ZT integrates vague, meaningless testimonials into the marketing pitch in order to avoid making any claims themselves, while not covering under warranty knives that have been used for tasks that their own marketing implies is possible.

Why intentionally give the false sense that your knives are strong when your company admits in writing that the knives are not built for uses requiring a strong knife?

Why use sleazy and hyped-up marketing if your warranty doesn't show that the company itself believes in their own product?
 
asdf12345 said:
So you admit that ZT integrates vague, meaningless testimonials into the marketing pitch in order to avoid making any claims themselves, while not covering under warranty knives that have been used for tasks that their own marketing implies is possible.
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Show me where 'built like a tank' and 'hard use' implies prying?


Again I say, HOW DARE Benchmade marketing imply that their Gold Class knives have gold in them. We should sue!
 
Scurvy092 said:
Show me where 'built like a tank' and 'hard use' implies prying?


Again I say, HOW DARE Benchmade marketing imply that their Gold Class knives have gold in them. We should sue!
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Like I said, it's extremely silly to make the comparison to product names. That's as stupid as saying Zero Tolerance knives should literally have zero tolerance when it comes to QC, which of course is not the case.
 
Next we will be hearing complaints from the peanut gallerynthat their "hard use" knife did not live up to the marketing when its application in the bedroom is a disastrous failure.
 
asdf12345 said:
Like I said, it's extremely silly to make the comparison to product names. That's as stupid as saying Zero Tolerance knives should literally have zero tolerance when it comes to QC, which of course is not the case.
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Believe it or not that argument has been brought up numerous times which also explains some of the lack of "tolerance" on the subject.
 
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