"Made in Sheffield" 1830-1930, A golden age ?

ed_is_dead ed_is_dead another enviable haul, your sources must be a closely guarded secret...Particularly like that Turner an elegant knife with a good long blade. Also, that you have the skill and nerve to fix it up to its rightful state :cool:
 
Will Power said:
ed_is_dead ed_is_dead another enviable haul, your sources must be a closely guarded secret...Particularly like that Turner an elegant knife with a good long blade. Also, that you have the skill and nerve to fix it up to its rightful state :cool:
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I have the ability to let my pernickety nature wreck a good knife too. Well, just the one so far, but it still stings!
The ghosts of previous owners take turns haunting my dreams:(

Glad you like the Turner Will, its Goldilocks size for most my use being a 2" blade and just under 3 closed. I dared to right the slightly obscured nail nick by grinding in nail relief, a passable downward slanting one like they used to do. Tricky to do when the knife is not apart.


 
Lovely Thomas Turner, Gonzalo.:thumbsup:

JonMcD JonMcD : two nice old knives. I like the hobo. :thumbsup:The info in the link ed_is_dead posted is pretty much word for word out of "Tweedale's Directory of Sheffield Manufacturers 1740 - 2013. Maybe you could narrow down a date by a search on the patent number?

ed_is_dead said:
Hey Will,
I see some examples in the first 100 pages of this thread which are breathtaking. The humble assortment I'm minding pales in comparison.
Re the colour difference between mark/pile I think it's intentionally done but am open to correction!
I have quite a few examples from Rodgers, Wade Wingfield and Rowbotham, Turner and others where the mark side is pale, especially so when it comes to ivory. The pile side being a warmer pick and mark side being pale. It does make sense in what you say as to how it might be that way but seems manufactured that way to my eye.
As misplaced as this notion is I always feel its kind of like yin/yang thing.

The Rodgers quill knife does seem to carry substantial age to it. Zero snap to it but is still a lovely user.
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Ed, I believe you are correct that the knives in question were manufactured with slightly different colouration on the mark and pile sides. However, I don't believe this was by design. The knives were made as tools and there was not a lot of effort put into matching the two sides. Perhaps Jack could comment on this??
You certainly have a great collection of Sheffield knives. In you post with the Humphrey's Radiant knives, the small 4 blade with the tip bolsters appears to be real tortoise shell, or spotted horn? I really like that one.:thumbsup:
 
danno50 said:
Lovely Thomas Turner, Gonzalo.:thumbsup:

JonMcD JonMcD : two nice old knives. I like the hobo. :thumbsup:The info in the link ed_is_dead posted is pretty much word for word out of "Tweedale's Directory of Sheffield Manufacturers 1740 - 2013. Maybe you could narrow down a date by a search on the patent number?



Ed, I believe you are correct that the knives in question were manufactured with slightly different colouration on the mark and pile sides. However, I don't believe this was by design. The knives were made as tools and there was not a lot of effort put into matching the two sides. Perhaps Jack could comment on this??
You certainly have a great collection of Sheffield knives. In you post with the Humphrey's Radiant knives, the small 4 blade with the tip bolsters appears to be real tortoise shell, or spotted horn? I really like that one.:thumbsup:
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Hi Danno,
The weird thing about it is the mark side is on most of mine are pale and pile side dark. On many markedly so.
Perhaps as mentioned it is the effects of uv and people may tend to store a knife mark side up??
What I'd like to know is what was the intent behind this aesthetic if it is (was) a thing!
The Harrison Brothers and Howson one your referring to is a beauty. In sunlight it appears to have a gold backing to the underneath of the slab sides, it sets it off.
Both the Hb&H and Humphreys have a slight burnt hair smell when touched with a hot pin so I'm guessing they were ripped off the back of some unfortunate tortoise a hundred and some odd years ago.
Have you any particular examples from your collection you might add here Danno?
 
Ed
I honestly do not believe that there was any aesthetic intent behind the differing colours on the covers. However, I had thought that the nicest piece of material was usually placed on the mark side of the knife?
I believe it was quite common practice to place a thin gold foil under real tortoise shell to set it off. It really does set it off nicely.
I will have to look back through this thread and see what I have already posted. I do not have a lot of Sheffield knives.
Dan
 
I don't believe this congress meets the age range in the thread title, apologies in advance , it still represents the excellent quality vintage Sheffield knives are known for. 3 7/8" closed, thin and light in the pocket.
DOkeWlQ.jpeg

MXDU8Q4.jpeg
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iTRQppa.jpeg
 
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I very much agree with Dan on the Stag Ed, Sheffield at that time would not look at the Knives as we do this day, we value the early Sheffield's as found Treasures, where as they in their day were a tool quite simply, but I am not telling you anything you don't already Know, possibly a little more care when it came to the Pearls and the more expensive higher end Sportsman / Gentleman Knives as seen earlier in the Thread.
I have enjoyed your latest showing immensely kind Sir!

Nice addition Rob! as Dan said - two nice examples of Stag textures, Popping one side and trenching on the other! :D :thumbsup:
 
Campbellclanman said:
I very much agree with Dan on the Stag Ed, Sheffield at that time would not look at the Knives as we do this day, we value the early Sheffield's as found Treasures, where as they in their day were a tool quite simply, but I am not telling you anything you don't already Know, possibly a little more care when it came to the Pearls and the more expensive higher end Sportsman / Gentleman Knives as seen earlier in the Thread.
I have enjoyed your latest showing immensely kind Sir!

Nice addition Rob! as Dan said - two nice examples of Stag textures, Popping one side and trenching on the other! :D :thumbsup:
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Appreciat your wisdom Campbellclanman;)
I am not hanging my hat on this hypothesis, rather it just seemed to be a readily identifiable trend I've seen in my humble wee collection of users in both stag, bone and horn.
Perhaps I might take a group shot of these examples I have and flip them over for giggles.
What was odd about it for me is there seemed to be a conscious effort on some to match stag characteristics pile vs mark but then again I have stag examples with popcorn on mark and smooth on pile so I'm flummoxed:) Nothing new there, I've loads of questions about lots of things in the Sheffield knife arena.
Glad you enjoyed the few I've posted lately, hopefully my enthusiasm doesn't appear like post bombing the thread!
 
rockman0 rockman0 Very impressive and tidy condition too, as you know it's been greatly admired in the Saturday Stag thread. Dating stuff is hazardous....but some indicators may help: can such a pattern be found in contemporary catalogues? But there again, plenty of knives could be one offs, commissions etc as a full Congress is not to everybody's taste, thus it would not be in any catalogue. My yardstick would be QUALITY and this knife has a lot of it which to me suggests it could fit into the era. This is not to say that there were no quality Sheffield knives after say 1930 but they are a lot scarcer.

Post 1918 witnessed many fundamental changes - the Great War killed significant numbers of young men in the industry and those who returned found they could use their skills in the automobile and electrics industries that mushroomed in the English Midlands. far better pay, prospects and conditions. The old cutlers would eventually die off with many less apprentice replacements, additionally, the old conservative paternalism of owners was now hopelessly out of place to meet new attitudes and challenges, thus investment evaporated and the steady inexorable decline in market significance and quality set in. Relying on historic reputation became their extended lifeline. 1930 is also a significant cut-off point as the general world economic depression began to set in and exacerbate the industry's woes.

Still, a fine example with very nicely fitted quality Stag. Not matching but that is a modern concern and not mine, provided both sides are beautiful I couldn't care less if they're different!

Regards, Will
 
danno50 said:
Very nice Rob.:thumbsup: I like the stag on both sides.
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Thanks, Dan. I'm enjoying the different stag:thumbsup:
Campbellclanman said:
I very much agree with Dan on the Stag Ed, Sheffield at that time would not look at the Knives as we do this day, we value the early Sheffield's as found Treasures, where as they in their day were a tool quite simply, but I am not telling you anything you don't already Know, possibly a little more care when it came to the Pearls and the more expensive higher end Sportsman / Gentleman Knives as seen earlier in the Thread.
I have enjoyed your latest showing immensely kind Sir!

Nice addition Rob! as Dan said - two nice examples of Stag textures, Popping one side and trenching on the other! :D :thumbsup:
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Thanks, Duncan, appreciate it :thumbsup:
Will Power said:
rockman0 rockman0 Very impressive and tidy condition too, as you know it's been greatly admired in the Saturday Stag thread. Dating stuff is hazardous....but some indicators may help: can such a pattern be found in contemporary catalogues? But there again, plenty of knives could be one offs, commissions etc as a full Congress is not to everybody's taste, thus it would not be in any catalogue. My yardstick would be QUALITY and this knife has a lot of it which to me suggests it could fit into the era. This is not to say that there were no quality Sheffield knives after say 1930 but they are a lot scarcer.

Post 1918 witnessed many fundamental changes - the Great War killed significant numbers of young men in the industry and those who returned found they could use their skills in the automobile and electrics industries that mushroomed in the English Midlands. far better pay, prospects and conditions. The old cutlers would eventually die off with many less apprentice replacements, additionally, the old conservative paternalism of owners was now hopelessly out of place to meet new attitudes and challenges, thus investment evaporated and the steady inexorable decline in market significance and quality set in. Relying on historic reputation became their extended lifeline. 1930 is also a significant cut-off point as the general world economic depression began to set in and exacerbate the industry's woes.

Still, a fine example with very nicely fitted quality Stag. Not matching but that is a modern concern and not mine, provided both sides are beautiful I couldn't care less if they're different!

Regards, Will
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The history of Sheffield cutlery is long and interesting, it is hard to nail down dates, I was thinking the "oil the joints" stamp came along after 1930 but I'm wrong about a lot of things :)
The different stag provides a change of scenery with a flip:thumbsup:
Thanks, Will, I appreciate your comments and compliments :thumbsup:
 
rockman0 said:
I don't believe this congress meets the age range in the thread title, apologies in advance , it still represents the excellent quality vintage Sheffield knives are known for. 3 7/8" closed, thin and light in the pocket.
DOkeWlQ.jpeg

MXDU8Q4.jpeg
kiRiUAf.jpeg
iTRQppa.jpeg
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Campbellclanman said:
Ed, you could Bomb the Thread every day with thos great Knives- we all would love that I am sure! 😀 :thumbsup:
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Loving that Rockman, the blade combo being about perfect for my average usage. The Stag is really awesome!

Campbellclanman, with that in mind I'll put a few more up in the hope more folks post their's:)










W. Green is perhaps Walter Green, son of Green and Green's Edward Arthur Green who used the grinders tm that was later sold to Herbert Robinson. Could be way off but that's as close as I can get a match in Tweedale's.
It's a real tank with very thick blade stock used on the main. The snap is tremendous and I love the stag.
Love to hear from anyone who can confirm or deny my hunch on who W. Green was.
Intrestingly it has a secondary blade from a "Mappin & Co but I cannot find a listing for one in Birmingham.
 
ed_is_dead said:
Loving that Rockman, the blade combo being about perfect for my average usage. The Stag is really awesome!

Campbellclanman, with that in mind I'll put a few more up in the hope more folks post their's:)










W. Green is perhaps Walter Green, son of Green and Green's Edward Arthur Green who used the grinders tm that was later sold to Herbert Robinson. Could be way off but that's as close as I can get a match in Tweedale's.
It's a real tank with very thick blade stock used on the main. The snap is tremendous and I love the stag.
Love to hear from anyone who can confirm or deny my hunch on who W. Green was.
Intrestingly it has a secondary blade from a "Mappin & Co but I cannot find a listing for one in Birmingham.
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Another handsome knife my friend :) :thumbsup:

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W. Green

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Green & Green
 
Although I don't own any Sheffield knives, let alone this old, I've been enjoying this thread since page 1.
It really opened my eyes about the history of knives older than appr. the 1960's.
Thanks to everyone who contributed to this excellent on going history lesson.
 
rockman0 said:
ed_is_dead ed_is_dead I'm with you my friend, these 2 blades combined are my favorite. They cover my most common cutting needs best. :thumbsup::thumbsup:
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Rockman the thinner edge and slim profile of that knife makes it very useful imo. The big whittler I posted above took quite some time to establish an edge on the main so thick was the steel. If bet I had a knife like yours it would be shaving in under five mins if I found a similar one blunt.
Here is an old John Nodder 4 blade (congress?) I slimmed down to two blade as the right handed owner had worn all but the left handed blades to mere stumps.



The thin blade stock means it slices deliciously and sharpens so easily. The addition of a sharp pen blade makes yours the "prefect carry" but I do love a manicuring blade:)
 
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