Member: "GotDogs" problems with a trade, member backed out after shipping knives

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again, it doesn't affect your particular trade so why do you care what he does if it doesn't concern you?

yes, he broke a forum rule but last time i checked you're not a mod..

i guess well just wait and see. i think you just want your knife back...
 
Would you have had a problem with the trade if you hadn't seen that he wanted to flip the ZT? If the answer is no, then you shouldn't have a problem now.
 
If you want to reverse the deal because he lied to you, but sent the knives, then I won't trade with you, but possibly would with him. I think you are being petty here. However, you have the right to reverse the deal if that is what you want.
 
SnowCrash said:
"GotDogs", I do believe we both have a topic for this situation. Please post in your respective topic as I have not flooded yours with multiple replies. I only posted this thread to record the situation for the mods.

I do not plan on refusing your package or sending you your knife back unless there is something wrong with the knives I sent you. You have not received them yet so please do me a favor and check them once the carrier hands you the package.

I admitted to making a mistake however I in no way "scammed" you by posting your knife a day early.
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GotDogs said:
Lying is not a mistake. Lying is deliberate, Oh, I lied oopppsss my mistake? Is that what you will have us beliieve? Anyone who would like to see the email where SnowCrash admits to lying let me know. He couldnt delete that. John
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SnowCrash said:
I am posting this topic to record what has happened in a transaction between myself and "GotDogs".

The original trade was my 2 knives (Spyderco Military and Spyderco Gayle Bradley) for this member's zero tolerance (0551).

After we both agreed to a trade, all of our knives being LNIB condition, we sent them out and should both be getting them in tomorrow.

I made the mistake of listing the 0551 for trade along with another zero tolerance knife I had. I do not yet have the 0551 in my possession and just looked up the rule that says I cannot post unless I have the knife right away.

"GotDogs" found this post and emailed me, saying he is concerned. I replied saying not to worry because I have plenty of feedback to warrant me not ripping off another member for a kershaw knife when I've had plenty of deals that went in 4 digit dollars.

He told me to refuse his package tomorrow and he will do the same. I refused that because I do not wish to wait another 4 days to get knives back. I gave him two options:

  1. Accept the package, check condition of knives. if not satisfied, I will pay return shipping
  2. Paypal me $6 because I cannot refuse a package, as it is automatically put in my box. I cannot babysit my box for the carrier to arrive.

"GotDogs" refused both of these options and proceeded to email mods, and tell me I am scamming him.

As mentioned before, we are to be receiving both our sides of the deal tomorrow or the day after, and he is simply backing out on the grounds of "suspicion".

I accepted the mistake that I have made of posting a day before I received his knife, however he is not a mod and I expect the mods to handle this situation rather than a member.
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GotDogs said:
Lying is not a mistake. Lying is deliberate, Oh, I lied oopppsss my mistake? Is that what you will have us beliieve? Anyone who would like to see the email where SnowCrash admits to lying let me know. He couldnt delete that. John
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Let's just focus on the commonality to the story here. Both sides agree that there was an exchange of goods and both sides agree that said goods are as described (or atleast I've not seen anything to suggest otherwise.) That said, forum rules are VERY clear that any trade can be reversed for any reason. That means, everytime you make a trade on the forum and the other side is unhappy you have to be prepared to reverse. That's the end of the discussion here.

In this case, GotDogs feels he was lied to and wants to reverse the trade. I don't see anything nefarious or dubious about his stance. I've dealt with GotDogs twice on these forums and he's always been extremely honorable, honest, and fair. I don't believe that he'd arbitrarily decide to reverse a trade without good cause.

Insisting that he send you funds for return shipment is petty and speaks more to your character then anything else. Let's face it, you f*cked up and now you're facing the consequences. That's just fact.

To be frank, I am actually surprised this made it onto GBU; I would think Snowcrash would have the wherewithal to know this won't make him look good.

TL;DR

Return the man his goods and stop complaining about the $5-6 fee. GotDogs is a good guy so please don't make a jerk out of him.
 
GotDogs said:
I would have no problem at all, most of the traders parctice " Catch and Release ".
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so if you traded a knife to somebody and they subsequently committed a crime with that knife would you attempt reverse the trade based on your moral beliefs??

lmao, this is classic.

i think you regret trading your knife and that's the real truth.
 
There has got to be a better way to do business than this.
GotDogs, did you perhaps change your mind about the trade?

1. SnowCrash is not in violation of the rules. He was when he posted a knife not yet in his hands, but he removed that violation when told about it. I have had many reports of violations that the poster edited out before I got there. No harm, no foul.

2. Did SnowCrash lie about your trade with him? If not, drop it! You are not his personal chaplain.

3. SnowCrash, do you want my advice? When the package arrives, return to the post office with it, unopened, and tell them to return it as refused. Any other course of action will land you in a continuing drama with GotDogs, who is not going to let this deal go through. Give it up.
 
four_shore said:
so if you traded a knife to somebody and they subsequently committed a crime with that knife would you attempt reverse the trade based on your moral beliefs??

lmao, this is classic.

i think you regret trading your knife and that's the real truth.
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I am actually shocked at comments like this. The guy feels lied to, why are you dinging him for the dishonest behavior of someone else? Also, wtf does this have to do with a crime being committed? The action took place while he was trading (while it was in his power to change things). Obviously if Snow committed a crime it'd be too late.

Put yourself in his shoes: you trade someone a knife, your end hasn't arrived yet but he's already off trading his side to someone else. Now where does that leave you if he decides to trade your end off and his side doesn't arrive/arrives in bad condition/etc? I mean, we operate based on honesty here. I really am shocked that someone would ding GotDogs on this.

Esav Benyamin said:
There has got to be a better way to do business than this.
GotDogs, did you perhaps change your mind about the trade?

1. SnowCrash is not in violation of the rules. He was when he posted a knife not yet in his hands, but he removed that violation when told about it. I have had many reports of violations that the poster edited out before I got there. No harm, no foul.

2. Did SnowCrash lie about your trade with him? If not, drop it! You are not his personal chaplain.

3. SnowCrash, do you want my advice? When the package arrives, return to the post office with it, unopened, and tell them to return it as refused. Any other course of action will land you in a continuing drama with GotDogs, who is not going to let this deal go through. Give it up.
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I think this is sage advice. I mean, this can easily have been avoided if Snow just agreed to return the knife and called it a day. I have a sinking feeling though that there is more to this; the 0550 may well be on its way to someone else by now.
 
i don't think anybody needs to be banned. I think one member made a small mistake (not severe) and another member is making a mountain of a mole hill.
 
ooitzoo said:
I am actually shocked at comments like this. The guy feels lied to, why are you dinging him for the dishonest behavior of someone else? Also, wtf does this have to do with a crime being committed? The action took place while he was trading (while it was in his power to change things). Obviously if Snow committed a crime it'd be too late.

Put yourself in his shoes: you trade someone a knife, your end hasn't arrived yet but he's already off trading his side to someone else. Now where does that leave you if he decides to trade your end off and his side doesn't arrive/arrives in bad condition/etc? I mean, we operate based on honesty here. I really am shocked that someone would ding GotDogs on this.




I think this is sage advice. I mean, this can easily have been avoided if Snow just agreed to return the knife and called it a day. I have a sinking feeling though that there is more to this; the 0550 may well be on its way to someone else by now.
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i guess we can agree to disagree but it sounds like the general consensus is not in gotdogs's favor.

maybe you should read some of the previous posts, lots of people are "dinging" him for this.

that same "sage" advice that you agree with, is coming from someone who knows how ridiculously childish gotdogs can be. snow is being advised to return the knife to save himself the grief of dealing with dogs.

and "wtf" it has to do with a crime (analogy) is morals and apparently dogs is the moral police (although i beg to differ based on personal experience).

ed (esav) already came in as the voice of reason and i agree with him as i generally do.

hope it all works out.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
There has got to be a better way to do business than this.
GotDogs, did you perhaps change your mind about the trade?

1. SnowCrash is not in violation of the rules. He was when he posted a knife not yet in his hands, but he removed that violation when told about it. I have had many reports of violations that the poster edited out before I got there. No harm, no foul.

2. Did SnowCrash lie about your trade with him? If not, drop it! You are not his personal chaplain.

3. SnowCrash, do you want my advice? When the package arrives, return to the post office with it, unopened, and tell them to return it as refused. Any other course of action will land you in a continuing drama with GotDogs, who is not going to let this deal go through. Give it up.
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Thanks Esav, I will do as you recommended. I will drive to the post office and refuse the package, although I see no reason to do so. I hope that this member does the same and I no longer have to deal with him sending me millions of emails.

I talked to him through email for as long as possible but then he threatened to tell on me here to the mods and "ruin me and my reputation, so I will never be able to trade on these forums again". I felt the need to post the story here for all to see and know I am not "scamming" anyone out of any knives.

Thank you all for your time and I hope we can put my mistake behind us, whether severe or not.

I will refuse the package tomorrow and go on with my life. "GotDogs", I recommend you do the same.
 
I would really love for a mod to make a ruling on what constitutes the trade reversal rule. My understanding is that either side can ask for a deal to be reversed for any reason. That's my interpretation of "no deal is complete unless both sides are happy". Am I wrong? If so, what is the acceptable threshold?
 
Banning requires way more than this. Reverse the trade and all is well. Laugh it off and forgive each other.
 
He was lied to and doesn't want to deal with a liar.
Whether the lie was about the deal or the color of the sky makes no difference to him, he was lied to.
 
four_shore said:
i guess we can agree to disagree but it sounds like the general consensus is not in gotdogs's favor.

maybe you should read some of the previous posts, lots of people are "dinging" him for this.

that same "sage" advice that you agree with, is coming from someone who knows how ridiculously childish gotdogs can be. snow is being advised to return the knife to save himself the grief of dealing with dogs.

and "wtf" it has to do with a crime (analogy) is morals and apparently dogs is the moral police (although i beg to differ based on personal experience).

ed (esav) already came in as the voice of reason and i agree with him as i generally do.

hope it all works out.
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If it's all the same I'd like to address your statement piece by piece.

The consensus, in this case, is irrelevant in my opinion; sometimes standing up for what's right means standing alone. If the consensus stands against the rules then I will stand in the minority.

I've dealt with GodDogs and he's been straight forward and honest. If you experienced otherwise then by all means please tell me. I've not seen anything to suggest that he's been childish or the moral police (again I've just not seen it). If you want to share said experience than I am happy to listen but I've simply not seen it.
 
Looks like I don't have to refuse the package after all. I was just pleasantly surprised with this message:



[color=red]REMOVED[/color]

1:35 AM (1 minute ago)

to me
Stick the ZT up your ass, I am keeping the package REGARDLESS and you and Four_Skin can Blow me!!
 
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