dericdesmond
Gold Member
- Joined
- Sep 10, 2007
- Messages
- 15,533
Hello everyone, I just wanted to share my recent experience with bladeforum member Liu Kang.
I recently purchased a knife off of Liu Kang for $700 + and agreed amount of $20 for shipping and Insurancnce http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=717804 . I sent Liu Kang a USPS M/O for $720, he got it, then he shipped my knife.
Well I got the knife today, its SWEET, however, When I got it, I noticed that Dan only paid $8.20 for my package to be shipped, with NO insurance. Ok, not that big of a deal, everyone makes mistakes. Well I go to open the package and WATCH IT. I almost ganked myself on the exposed tip of my VERY sharp blade
The knife was jammed so tight into the box, that had he safely covered the tip with something, it would not of fit into the slightly smaller non flat rate priority box that he chose to use.
Well I send Dan this message
Me : "Dan, what gives? I paid $20 on top of your asking $700 to have my knife insured, yet you only pay $8.20 and do not insure it? Not only that but atleast 1/8 of an inch of the point was exposed, I seriously almost f****** ganked myself dude. That would of been some more un-needed $ spent on a trip to the Dr. With all your experience, I figured you would have more sense. Come on man.
Eric"
His immediate response is here
Lui Kang : "I didn't know you wanted insurance, I just scrolled down and saw that. Well, if you paid for it and it didn't deliver, I would have covered it out of my pocket. 98% of the time people don't ask for insurance. I HAVE NEVER HAD A PACKAGE NOT DELIVER! I'm sorry I overlooked that part. I've been very busy with lots of things on my mind, and didn't even look at that. But should it not have arrived, I would have paid you out of my own pocket. I wasn't trying to scam you, I'm not like that, I just made a mistake. Is everything ok with the knife?
Dan"
He then send this right after before I get a chance to reply to his first message.
Lui Kang : "I think the part that really threw me is that people usually ask how much insurance is but you already knew, didn't request for it separately, and just included it and stated you wanted it. I should have read it better, sorry.
Dan"
Well, he says he is sorry, yet he doesnt offer to refund the diff, that and he totally glosses over the safety issue. I reply with this
Me: "Dan, Im aware your not trying to scam me however, you are the type that pays attention to detail. So much so that you are sure to be very specific in all your listings whenever it comes to payment options. You do your best to squeeze every dollar out of transactions and Im not saying that in a bad way, I too try and maximize profits whenver given the chance. I mean, you over price paypal fees by charging 5% instead of the actual ramount, something paypal could ban your account for, on top of asking people to use the personal tab in order for you to avoid fees and not be put into a postistion where paypal could automatically withdraw funds from your account if for some reason a issue did indeed arise and the buyer made a claim against you. I mean you didnt even use the slightly larger prioirt flat rate box that would of been more suitable for this knife, instead you use the smaller free ones that go by weight, again something I can not blame you for however this knife had its point exposed becasue you could not cover the point if you wanted to use that box as there was no more room, I can provide pics to remind you if you want. Honestly, the exposed point frustrates me more than anything. Safety is first IMO, and I dont BS when I say I had a very close call. I mean, if I wanted to be a d*** I could of lied and said I cut myself, Im just being real with you so please do not get defensive. Instead of looking for excuses do the right thing and give me the $11.80 back that I paid you for Insurance/shipping and acknowledge that you know the point was exposed. You just brushed over that part in your last two emails.
Off to work.
Eric"
He replys to that message stating this
Lui Kang: "What is the point of paying for insurance? It is to insure that if you package is damaged or does not deliver, that seller then files something with the shipper to get the value of the item lost or damaged. So it is clear that you said in email for the knife to be $720 shipped and insured. That's a legal and bonding contract. You made the offer and I accepted. The funds were received and item was shipped. Now, should there have been a problem and the package not arrived, would you have held me responsible? If the answer is yes, then the package was insured. If you were going to say, no, not your fault, don't worry about it, you tried your best. Then I'll give you your money back.
So I will give you the option to answer that question honestly. Because I will no lie about that, if it did not deliver for any reason, and I checked my email and read that I had agreed to insure it and didn't, it would come out of my pocket, no questions asked.
If you check my feedback, I believe it is the highest on BF. Everyone trusts me because I deliver what I say I'm going to do. If I say I'm going to buy your knives, I do. If I say I'm going to sell you a knife, I do deliver what I say I am going to do.
Now I have no ideal where your uncle got one for $385 but I'm not even going to buy that one. I paid way more then that. You can post that price on the forum and I'll bet you money that nobody will believe that, and I'm willing to bet that both Jerry, Garth, and Amy will also verify that it was never sold for that price. I'm not even making that much on BMs and that is why I don't have many anymore. They cost too much and you can't make anything off them. I actually make more money off a new fat game warden then I did on this knife. So if you are not happy with the transaction, please send back the knife and I will take it back no questions asked.
I packed that in the box I did because that's the way I do things. I would rather it very tight in the box as opposed to lose, because if it moves around too much, it will start cutting things within the box. I have never had a compliant before about my packing.
I don't feel you are happy with this transaction and so if you feel like you want to return this for a full refund, here is my mailing address:
Dan"
Wow, he has some nerve IMO. He does a real bad job at trying to bring in insignificant topics into the situation. I mean, If I just acknowledged that I maid a mistake and said sorry as he did, I wouldnt even need to be asked to refund the diff. Heck, I would of given him the diff and an extra $10 for a six pack to acknowledge I did indeed mess up. Not him.
I reply to that message with this
Me : "I stopped reading half way through. We will just have to get bf's opinion on the situation when I get some time.
Eric"
His reply
Liu Kang: "No need to, please put back in the same box and mark return to sender, if they reuse I will send you a return lable and you will get the funds back as soon as I get the knife. I don't want your money, I want the knife back. End of story!
Dan"
Yeah Ill get right on that bud
Ill be sure to use the same box as shown here (not). As you can see, the knife would not fit horizontally, and when I put it in as far as it goes diagonally, notice where the tip sits, imagine something to go over that and how much harder it would of been to cram it in. Honestly, I cant believe he even manged the way he did.
sitting diagonally, handle is as far down in the opposite corner as was sent to me.
here it sits horizontally
My response to his prior message
Me: "Its my knife now, seriously get a clue. If you were sorry about not insuring like you said you were, then you would of simply made right and gave me MY $ back but you think you have the right to justify it. Im gonna prove you wrong.
Eric"
I get a burr in my butt and sent him this right after
Me: "Oh and BTW, ask anyone you want about what my uncle paid for his knife. That is neither here nor there, it has nothing to do with what I was willing to pay, which was in fact $720. My issues with how you handled this transaction has absolutely NOTHING to do with what he paid for his so why did you even bring it up? My complaint wasnt wait I paid, its your willingness to admit wrong, say sorry, but not make it right. Oh last thing, my uncle has no reason to lie to me, nor do I to you. You talk about being honest yet you have tried to have me lie in the past so that card isnt gonna work (your lost nmsfno that you requested I lie to paypal over, telling them I didnt get it, remmber that?) I bet ya do. I have not ever giving you a single reason to believe I have bs'ed you. I actually spent a bunch of my time to help you recover that knife, obviously that is not takin into account. Its cool, you have showed your true colors. If you were truly sorry like you said yuo were, you would of understood and simply refunded $11.80. You still havnt acknowledge that the tip was exposed. Dont worry, Im gonna take a pic to better illustrate my point one I post in the feedback forum."
His response
Lui Kang: "I posted a knife for sale, I described it and listed a price. You agreed to buy it as the price, offered $20 for shipping and insurance. You got the knife, in a very timely manner. Are you not happy with the knife or how fast the transaction took place? If not what is the problem?
There was insurance on that package, should it not have arrived or been damaged, I would have to pay for it. You can take that to court and win, hands down.
So what's the problem? If you are unhappy, I have already offered you a complete refund, either take it or don't. I don't understand the problem. I prefer to have the knife back just so I don't have argue. Tell you what, I'll even pay for the stamp and the $1.50 for your usps money order ok? Please send it back, I'll even send you a shipping label so you don't have to pay for that. Lets undo this bad transaction and walk away.
Dan"
And that brings us to the present. Honestly, I dont see whats so hard to grasp, if you pay for something and do not get it, then you are worthy of a refund, atleast last time I checked thats how it worked here on Earth. It doesnt matter what spin someone trys and put on it, I paid for something and did not get it. I dont want to return the knife, I WANTED what was rightfully MINE, a whoppin $11.80 and a sorry for almost causing me a visit to the Dr.
This really is when I realized that he just was not getting it, the ultimate factor which led to this posting. Had he back his sorry up with actions then none of this would even be made public.
Lui Kang: "Now, should there have been a problem and the package not arrived, would you have held me responsible? If the answer is yes, then the package was insured. If you were going to say, no, not your fault, don't worry about it, you tried your best. Then I'll give you your money back. "
WRONG WRONG WRONG, thats not how it works! Thats just chaps my rear, I dont think Im off base, then again, I have been wrong in the past
Sorry for the novel guys. I just wanted to be sure and include all of our convo so nothing was misconstrued.
All right, off to go throw this new knife into some trees. Peace.
I recently purchased a knife off of Liu Kang for $700 + and agreed amount of $20 for shipping and Insurancnce http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=717804 . I sent Liu Kang a USPS M/O for $720, he got it, then he shipped my knife.
Well I got the knife today, its SWEET, however, When I got it, I noticed that Dan only paid $8.20 for my package to be shipped, with NO insurance. Ok, not that big of a deal, everyone makes mistakes. Well I go to open the package and WATCH IT. I almost ganked myself on the exposed tip of my VERY sharp blade
The knife was jammed so tight into the box, that had he safely covered the tip with something, it would not of fit into the slightly smaller non flat rate priority box that he chose to use.Well I send Dan this message
Me : "Dan, what gives? I paid $20 on top of your asking $700 to have my knife insured, yet you only pay $8.20 and do not insure it? Not only that but atleast 1/8 of an inch of the point was exposed, I seriously almost f****** ganked myself dude. That would of been some more un-needed $ spent on a trip to the Dr. With all your experience, I figured you would have more sense. Come on man.
Eric"
His immediate response is here
Lui Kang : "I didn't know you wanted insurance, I just scrolled down and saw that. Well, if you paid for it and it didn't deliver, I would have covered it out of my pocket. 98% of the time people don't ask for insurance. I HAVE NEVER HAD A PACKAGE NOT DELIVER! I'm sorry I overlooked that part. I've been very busy with lots of things on my mind, and didn't even look at that. But should it not have arrived, I would have paid you out of my own pocket. I wasn't trying to scam you, I'm not like that, I just made a mistake. Is everything ok with the knife?
Dan"
He then send this right after before I get a chance to reply to his first message.
Lui Kang : "I think the part that really threw me is that people usually ask how much insurance is but you already knew, didn't request for it separately, and just included it and stated you wanted it. I should have read it better, sorry.
Dan"
Well, he says he is sorry, yet he doesnt offer to refund the diff, that and he totally glosses over the safety issue. I reply with this
Me: "Dan, Im aware your not trying to scam me however, you are the type that pays attention to detail. So much so that you are sure to be very specific in all your listings whenever it comes to payment options. You do your best to squeeze every dollar out of transactions and Im not saying that in a bad way, I too try and maximize profits whenver given the chance. I mean, you over price paypal fees by charging 5% instead of the actual ramount, something paypal could ban your account for, on top of asking people to use the personal tab in order for you to avoid fees and not be put into a postistion where paypal could automatically withdraw funds from your account if for some reason a issue did indeed arise and the buyer made a claim against you. I mean you didnt even use the slightly larger prioirt flat rate box that would of been more suitable for this knife, instead you use the smaller free ones that go by weight, again something I can not blame you for however this knife had its point exposed becasue you could not cover the point if you wanted to use that box as there was no more room, I can provide pics to remind you if you want. Honestly, the exposed point frustrates me more than anything. Safety is first IMO, and I dont BS when I say I had a very close call. I mean, if I wanted to be a d*** I could of lied and said I cut myself, Im just being real with you so please do not get defensive. Instead of looking for excuses do the right thing and give me the $11.80 back that I paid you for Insurance/shipping and acknowledge that you know the point was exposed. You just brushed over that part in your last two emails.
Off to work.
Eric"
He replys to that message stating this
Lui Kang: "What is the point of paying for insurance? It is to insure that if you package is damaged or does not deliver, that seller then files something with the shipper to get the value of the item lost or damaged. So it is clear that you said in email for the knife to be $720 shipped and insured. That's a legal and bonding contract. You made the offer and I accepted. The funds were received and item was shipped. Now, should there have been a problem and the package not arrived, would you have held me responsible? If the answer is yes, then the package was insured. If you were going to say, no, not your fault, don't worry about it, you tried your best. Then I'll give you your money back.
So I will give you the option to answer that question honestly. Because I will no lie about that, if it did not deliver for any reason, and I checked my email and read that I had agreed to insure it and didn't, it would come out of my pocket, no questions asked.
If you check my feedback, I believe it is the highest on BF. Everyone trusts me because I deliver what I say I'm going to do. If I say I'm going to buy your knives, I do. If I say I'm going to sell you a knife, I do deliver what I say I am going to do.
Now I have no ideal where your uncle got one for $385 but I'm not even going to buy that one. I paid way more then that. You can post that price on the forum and I'll bet you money that nobody will believe that, and I'm willing to bet that both Jerry, Garth, and Amy will also verify that it was never sold for that price. I'm not even making that much on BMs and that is why I don't have many anymore. They cost too much and you can't make anything off them. I actually make more money off a new fat game warden then I did on this knife. So if you are not happy with the transaction, please send back the knife and I will take it back no questions asked.
I packed that in the box I did because that's the way I do things. I would rather it very tight in the box as opposed to lose, because if it moves around too much, it will start cutting things within the box. I have never had a compliant before about my packing.
I don't feel you are happy with this transaction and so if you feel like you want to return this for a full refund, here is my mailing address:
Dan"
Wow, he has some nerve IMO. He does a real bad job at trying to bring in insignificant topics into the situation. I mean, If I just acknowledged that I maid a mistake and said sorry as he did, I wouldnt even need to be asked to refund the diff. Heck, I would of given him the diff and an extra $10 for a six pack to acknowledge I did indeed mess up. Not him.
I reply to that message with this
Me : "I stopped reading half way through. We will just have to get bf's opinion on the situation when I get some time.
Eric"
His reply
Liu Kang: "No need to, please put back in the same box and mark return to sender, if they reuse I will send you a return lable and you will get the funds back as soon as I get the knife. I don't want your money, I want the knife back. End of story!
Dan"
Yeah Ill get right on that bud
Ill be sure to use the same box as shown here (not). As you can see, the knife would not fit horizontally, and when I put it in as far as it goes diagonally, notice where the tip sits, imagine something to go over that and how much harder it would of been to cram it in. Honestly, I cant believe he even manged the way he did.
sitting diagonally, handle is as far down in the opposite corner as was sent to me.
here it sits horizontally
My response to his prior message
Me: "Its my knife now, seriously get a clue. If you were sorry about not insuring like you said you were, then you would of simply made right and gave me MY $ back but you think you have the right to justify it. Im gonna prove you wrong.
Eric"
I get a burr in my butt and sent him this right after
Me: "Oh and BTW, ask anyone you want about what my uncle paid for his knife. That is neither here nor there, it has nothing to do with what I was willing to pay, which was in fact $720. My issues with how you handled this transaction has absolutely NOTHING to do with what he paid for his so why did you even bring it up? My complaint wasnt wait I paid, its your willingness to admit wrong, say sorry, but not make it right. Oh last thing, my uncle has no reason to lie to me, nor do I to you. You talk about being honest yet you have tried to have me lie in the past so that card isnt gonna work (your lost nmsfno that you requested I lie to paypal over, telling them I didnt get it, remmber that?) I bet ya do. I have not ever giving you a single reason to believe I have bs'ed you. I actually spent a bunch of my time to help you recover that knife, obviously that is not takin into account. Its cool, you have showed your true colors. If you were truly sorry like you said yuo were, you would of understood and simply refunded $11.80. You still havnt acknowledge that the tip was exposed. Dont worry, Im gonna take a pic to better illustrate my point one I post in the feedback forum."
His response
Lui Kang: "I posted a knife for sale, I described it and listed a price. You agreed to buy it as the price, offered $20 for shipping and insurance. You got the knife, in a very timely manner. Are you not happy with the knife or how fast the transaction took place? If not what is the problem?
There was insurance on that package, should it not have arrived or been damaged, I would have to pay for it. You can take that to court and win, hands down.
So what's the problem? If you are unhappy, I have already offered you a complete refund, either take it or don't. I don't understand the problem. I prefer to have the knife back just so I don't have argue. Tell you what, I'll even pay for the stamp and the $1.50 for your usps money order ok? Please send it back, I'll even send you a shipping label so you don't have to pay for that. Lets undo this bad transaction and walk away.
Dan"
And that brings us to the present. Honestly, I dont see whats so hard to grasp, if you pay for something and do not get it, then you are worthy of a refund, atleast last time I checked thats how it worked here on Earth. It doesnt matter what spin someone trys and put on it, I paid for something and did not get it. I dont want to return the knife, I WANTED what was rightfully MINE, a whoppin $11.80 and a sorry for almost causing me a visit to the Dr.
This really is when I realized that he just was not getting it, the ultimate factor which led to this posting. Had he back his sorry up with actions then none of this would even be made public.
Lui Kang: "Now, should there have been a problem and the package not arrived, would you have held me responsible? If the answer is yes, then the package was insured. If you were going to say, no, not your fault, don't worry about it, you tried your best. Then I'll give you your money back. "
WRONG WRONG WRONG, thats not how it works! Thats just chaps my rear, I dont think Im off base, then again, I have been wrong in the past
Sorry for the novel guys. I just wanted to be sure and include all of our convo so nothing was misconstrued.
All right, off to go throw this new knife into some trees. Peace.
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