Official 2013 Mini Knife KITH!

Go ahead and put me in.

I will get something together. I had an idea the other day that might be fun. If it doesn't work out, I can always do a katana or something:)
 
fast14riot said:
Also, a high quality CA glue works well for assembly on the minis, epoxy glue lines can be too big on the minis sometimes.
-X
Click to expand...

Hey Xander, I was goin through the previous mini knife kiths and I noticed that CA glue was used by a bunch of people for different things such as finishing wood handles, putting a light coat on top of a blade with a patina to help keep it from fading, to glueing the scales, handles etc. I was just wondering what is CA glue? Also is it ever used to put a nice finish or shine on the wooden scales/handles of full sized blades or for that matter any othe uses for it on normal blades? Just thought I'd ask cause it seems like nifty stuff and I think I may just have ta get me some :cool:

I also have one more question about how one goes about converting normal knives down to a certain scale or ratio, is there a math formula or does it really need to be that exact? Is it more of a "just make sure whatever size you choose to make you mine knife, just make sure all the fittings match that particular scale as well" ..thing? Thanks man, I'm really getting pumped about this kith, I tend to be a perfectionist so it should be interesting :D

Paul

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My youtube channel with some of my knives and other related vids.. www.youtube.com/Lsubslimed
 
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Paul,

CA (cyanoacrylate) is super glue. I prefer Loctite Professional Liquid glue, but just be sure to use a good quality. Yes, it is used as a finish sometimes on full sized knives, but it can be tricky to get looking good. It gives a super high gloss, mile deep shine.

Scaling down, how simple it is depends on how simple some math done "in your head" is. 1/4 scale is easy to figure, divide all dimensions by 4. For 1/5 (20% of original size) I double the original dimension and move the decimal to the left. So for 1/5 a 10" blade doubled = 20" then move the decimal to the left = 2.0". Again, 0.125x2= 0.250 -> 0.025.

Swords and larger items can be done in 1/25 scale easily by working in metric, taking the inch dimension and making it millimeters. 25.4mm to 1 inch. So scale would be 1mm/1in.

1/10 scale is also simple, just move the decimal one space to the left.


I urge first time mini makers to try and measure everything to keep it to scale, but once you have made a few it becomes easier to just wing it. I've been a model builder for 20+ years, working in miniature is easy for me, I'm also a trained metrologist, so these two backgrounds actually really help me out. By your 5th mini knife I suspect you will be able to just make one from scratch with minimal measuring.


-Xander
 
Hey all,

Im pretty excited about this project. I am wondering if a 1/4 scale friction folder would qualify? or maybe Id like to try hollow grinding on a 2 inch wheel, would that work for a "big bear" type 1/5 scale mini?
Another question I have is it ok for the HT to be done by someone else? I would try it myself with some 1084 but id rather make the mini out of stainless.
 
Yes, outsourcing things like HT is fine.

1/4 scale is just fine for smaller knives, I only really stress going smaller for those scaling down large bowies or swords and such. Ultimately it is up to the maker, but I try to make sure that these end up as miniature knives.

I've never made a loveless style so I don't know what an appropriate size wheel would be.


-Xander
 
Thanks for response Xander,
Metrology; that is a fascinating subject to me. Just got a unit recently for measuring Ra of Surface finish. Got my head spinning figuring out all the different methods of measuring surface finish.

I think ill shoot for a friction folder a little under an inch long closed. Anyone have any suggestions as to a particular model? Id like to make this an "exact" scaled down copy of something (copy of the profile anyway).
 
Thanx for not calling me a weatherman, lol!

I think you should find a knife that you really like, and make it. That size sounds just fine!


-X
 
Just a quick sketch...doubt i can pull off the bolster/handle compound curve..Ill most likely make it 1 pc.

The first knife show I ever went to my favorite table was Khalsa's. I just love his lines so ill try and pay homage to this design of his in the spirit of the KITH.
 
I see a lot of minis....and less than 10% are to scale. Oh, the length and width are OK, but the blade thickness scales out at around 1/2" thick on most minis.

If there is one place to start on a mini, it is to get the thickness down to scale. If the scale is 4:1 and the full size blade is 1/4" thick, that makes the mini blade 1/16" ( .060) thick. This is easy to do and 1/16 stock is readily available. However, many minis made in 10:1 scale still have blades 1/16" thick. A 1/4" full size blade would be .025" thick at 10:1.

Next, handle thickness. Make the handle proportional to the blade. Again, the handles on many minis are 1-1.5" wide by scale. It is hard to work many materials in thicknesses of .025" to .060", but with selection of the right material, and careful sanding, it can be done.

Blade shape. Getting the bevels, clips, and plunges right at scale is also a trick.

The way to deal with most all mini problems is to make a full size drawing or photo, and then write all dimensions on it. Make a side chart with the scale dimensions. Use the full size drawing/photo as a reference when making the mini.
 
Timos: if you look at the pictures in my earlier post, the top left of the mini picture shows the calculations in scale. I then measured the blade, handle, height above and below the lines to plot out the profile. My mini drawing is lousy, but I have found cutting a bit big, then doing final shaping with the actual material more effective in getting a nice looking knife. I have adjusted every drawing I have made thus far once seeing the material in hand.
 
In my case , I do not know the actual dimensions of the knife I am scaling down. My method was to copy the image of a finished knife I estimate to be about 4 " closed. I loaded the image into a 1 inch scale in auto cad then just traced around the image. voila, quick little sketch that is pretty accurate. Perspective of the camera creates problems of course but the differences are negligible imo. This would work with illustrator or other "free" programs I would guess.
 
OK, my planer blade steel is D2. I will still do a second in 15n20, but I think the D2 will make a really great blade.

Here is what I looked up for HT to get RC63: I already did a soft annealing with the cherry red heating on a steel plate.

Stress reliving after shaping: 1200f for 2h, cool slowly to 930f, then air cool.

Hardening: 1815f for 60min, then quench in oil. I plan to use Canola oil unless I find out I need a specific oil.

I will see how it feels after this and see if it needs any tempering. Since these are display, I suspect it won't be needed.
 
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Sorry, I know Xander already answered this but I just a bit unclear about the converting. I was wondering is just dividing the length of the blade etc etc. by the scale you are goin for, for example 5:1 or 1:5 scale? (not sure what number goes one either side)..could I just divide all of the normal measurments my 5, and if it's a 1/4th scale, can I just divinde everything my 4? For some reason this doesn't seem right when it comes to ratios, just some of my math subconcious from back when I was in school kickin in or something. lol I guess I'm just looking for a proper formula to figure this out so that I can figure out the dimensions for any scale I happen to choose on my own. I'm pretty rusty with formulas etc but I can still do math lol ...I think so at lease :D lol jk
Thanks again! I obviously havn't started yet but I wanna be proactive so when the time comes that I do start, I don't have to ask while im in the middle of making it :)
-Paul
 
Yes, that is all there is to it. If the full size knife is 10" long, the 5:1/1:5 scale model is 2" long ( 10 divided by 5).

When giving scale size of the above example, there are two ways of stating it:
You can say the miniature is 5:1 scale, because the original is five times the size of the mini. This is a common way of stating things, but is not actually correct.
Or, you can say the scale size is 1:5, meaning 1 inch equals five inches. This is the architect's way of stating things, as it reflects a fractional representation of 1/5 size.

I and many others often use the two interchangeably.
 
Perfect! Thanks Stacy, thats just what I needed ta know. Now I'll be able to easily focus on trying ta get everything to size without making my head spin lol. I appreciate it :)

-Paul
 
Paul, also if you have access to a copy machine you can reduce the full size drawing too. 20% is 1/5 of original size, 25% 1/4, etc.


-X
 
Actually, only 1:5 scale is correct for a miniature or a map. For an architectural drawing it makes a big difference which way the numbers go. 5:1 scale is an actual measurement that would give you something bigger than the drawing, like this:
[youtube]oZZsPsnaFII[/youtube]

Picked up new handle material this weekend and should start on some minis soon.
 
This sounds like fun. I have a question about scale. I have searched and cannot find the specifications for various styles of knifes. Should I just choose a knife and use those measurements to determine the scale? Also, does the knife have to be usable, like having a H/T'ed blade? I'm in...if I can figure out what to make. :) :)
 
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