Pre-order for the new Kephart?

pre-order for the new Kephart?

  • Yes, start a pre-order

    Votes: 71 92.2%

  • No, bad idea

    Votes: 6 7.8%
  • Total voters
    77
That CAD drawing has me all giddy - it looks great, Nathan. What sucks the most is going to be the wait!

I like the looks of the classic Kephart design but I also find beauty in simplicity. This is going to be a hell of a knife.
 
Elgatodeacero said:
Will this knife have the tapered blade geometry and tang of the original?

https://www.knifemagazine.com/the-original-kephart-examined/
Click to expand...

That question popped in my head as well. However, I do think that would add considerably to the expense. CPKs haven't typically sported tapered tangs - at least not on the ones that I have or have been interested in. If that were to be added as a feature on this one though, I'd pay the extra for it.

As the drawing stands now however, it is an incredible value.
 
I have read posts on this forum from people who have Kephart style knives without tapered tangs and without the magical double convex blade shape, many seem to complain that they are handle heavy.
Maybe Ethan Becker will loan his original to CPK and they can scan it in 3D and make a true Kephart with upgraded steel. Wood handles and a leather sheath also seem mandatory.

I would pay extra for a true to form version.
 
Elgatodeacero said:
Will this knife have the tapered blade geometry and tang of the original?

https://www.knifemagazine.com/the-original-kephart-examined/
Click to expand...

No, I'm not trying to make it 100% historically accurate, I'm making a modern knife that achieves the original design intent but with modern materials and processes. It used to make sense to forge in a tapered tang because you got better utilization of your steel. But the material savings to forge in a tapered tang (in a modern and practically un-forgeable PM alloy) are more than offset by the unnecessary complexity of that operation. I could taper the tang. Or I can adjust balance characteristics in other ways.

The tapered tang is one of the most misunderstood and misused features on knives today. Once upon a time you could can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and the answer was they left it thick up where it could break and thinned it out where it didn't need to be to spread the material out. They were taking a glob of metal and mashing it out and it was a side effect of that manufacturing process. Today you can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and they'll inevitably answer "balance". You'll even see tapered tangs on choppers that would benefit from a weighted pommel to increase the moment of inertia, increasing both chopping power and balancing the heavy tip, because so many people add this feature as an element of custom craftsmanship without really thinking about how it applies to a particular design. The same is true for distal taper. A long thin sword might need distal taper to reduce tip weight and allow greater tip speed etc. A knife like this might benefit from reverse distal taper, putting some meat behind that point and thinning the middle of the blade. I don't want to duplicate a feature that is present in an old piece like this that is there as a side effect of the manufacturing process of drawing out the steel rather than truly aiding in the function of the knife.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
No, I'm not trying to make it 100% historically accurate, I'm making a modern knife that achieves the original design intent but with modern materials and processes. It used to make sense to forge in a tapered tang because you got better utilization of your steel. But the material savings to forge in a tapered tang (in a modern and practically un-forgeable PM alloy) are more than offset by the unnecessary complexity of that operation. I could taper the tang. Or I can adjust balance characteristics in other ways.

The tapered tang is one of the most misunderstood and misused features on knives today. Once upon a time you could can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and the answer was they left it thick up where it could break and thinned it out where it didn't need to be to spread the material out. They were taking a glob of metal and mashing it out and it was a side effect of that manufacturing process. Today you can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and they'll inevitably answer "balance". You'll even see tapered tangs on choppers that would benefit from a weighted pommel to increase the moment of inertia, increasing both chopping power and balancing the heavy tip, because so many people add this feature as an element of custom craftsmanship without really thinking about how it applies to a particular design. The same is true for distal taper. A long thin sword might need distal taper to reduce tip weight and allow greater tip speed etc. A knife like this might benefit from reverse distal taper, putting some meat behind that point and thinning the middle of the blade. I don't want to duplicate a feature that is present in an old piece like this that is there as a side effect of the manufacturing process of drawing out the steel rather than truly aiding in the function of the knife.
Click to expand...

I appreciate that explanation, Nathan, I don't think I knew that about tapered tangs - it certainly makes sense though. Personally, I don't notice too much difference, performance-wise, between a knife (average sized) with a tapered tang versus one with standard. However, I have always viewed it as a testament to the maker's craft as it isn't particularly easy to do.

The best production true-to-form Kephart out there - the BK-62 - is oft complained about being too thin in the handle. I suspect the tapered tang plays into that somewhat. I'm looking forward to your version, with your own design elements reflecting what modern knife making has to offer.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
No, I'm not trying to make it 100% historically accurate, I'm making a modern knife that achieves the original design intent but with modern materials and processes. It used to make sense to forge in a tapered tang because you got better utilization of your steel. But the material savings to forge in a tapered tang (in a modern and practically un-forgeable PM alloy) are more than offset by the unnecessary complexity of that operation. I could taper the tang. Or I can adjust balance characteristics in other ways.

The tapered tang is one of the most misunderstood and misused features on knives today. Once upon a time you could can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and the answer was they left it thick up where it could break and thinned it out where it didn't need to be to spread the material out. They were taking a glob of metal and mashing it out and it was a side effect of that manufacturing process. Today you can ask a maker "why did you taper this" and they'll inevitably answer "balance". You'll even see tapered tangs on choppers that would benefit from a weighted pommel to increase the moment of inertia, increasing both chopping power and balancing the heavy tip, because so many people add this feature as an element of custom craftsmanship without really thinking about how it applies to a particular design. The same is true for distal taper. A long thin sword might need distal taper to reduce tip weight and allow greater tip speed etc. A knife like this might benefit from reverse distal taper, putting some meat behind that point and thinning the middle of the blade. I don't want to duplicate a feature that is present in an old piece like this that is there as a side effect of the manufacturing process of drawing out the steel rather than truly aiding in the function of the knife.
Click to expand...
Thanks Nathan for explaining the tapered tang :thumbsup::thumbsup: I been under the impression it was a way to achieve the desired balance wanted on the knife. :rolleyes: Also thinking wow that seems like a lot work at the same time.
 
Xr6x said:
Thanks Nathan for explaining the tapered tang :thumbsup::thumbsup: I been under the impression it was a way to achieve the desired balance wanted on the knife. :rolleyes: Also thinking wow that seems like a lot work at the same time.
Click to expand...

It certainly can be. But it is a widely applied design element that is frequently counter productive when misapplied. Kinda like bad jimping or cosmetic fullers.

A Loveless hunter, with its thin hollow grinds are improved by a tapered tang. My knives are also improved by deliberate distribution of weight. I do this in a number of ways in a number of places, but one tool I use is careful skeletonization of the tang rather than tapering it. This difference is a reflection of the manufacturing process: milling rather than forging. But I do taper tangs some times, but when I do it is because of cosmetic considerations. This Kephart is not a cosmetic knife, it's a bush tool.
 
Last edited:
Looks great, Nathan. I like your approach 100%. Full utility with modern methods and steel.

Having both forged and ground tapered tangs on kepharts, I agree that they make sense for different reasons in different contexts. A kephart that balances right around (or just behind) the guardbump is a lovely thing, and there are at least couple ways to achieve that. A taper is pretty, but way more trouble than CNC'ing a chunk out of the middle as part of the profiling process.
 
Nathan the Machinist said:
This is a niche item and will be made in low quantities. I'm going to keep things as simple as possible. Simplicity is the key. One version.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply Nathan. I completely understand and had I of read your original post, I would never have mentioned a shorter blade.
Horace is smiling down on you. :)
I just wish I could afford one now. Maybe I'll be able to afford one on the secondary market if one ever makes it that far.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top