Hard to see MAP as anything but price-fixing in sheep's clothing (i.e. price-fixing in such a way that you skirt existing regulations on such practices) when you see store policy like this example at BladeHQ: "*Disclaimer: There may be cases where we simply can't match a price (i.e. We cannot sell an item for less than our cost, or in cases where it violates MAP or universal pricing policies)." That guidance suggests they will NOT violate MAP to match a price, which is the antithesis of the so-called definition of MAP (Manufacturer ADVERTISED Price). They should have no fear selling at any price they see fit, as long as they do not advertise that as the standard, every-day price. But clearly, either they fear any deviation will cost them distribution, or they are hiding behind the perception of such fears to hold price. Many, many moons ago, I worked at a retail establishment that sold appliances and electronics. This establishment was known for making deals, as they were looking to increase their market share in an industry that was losing a lot of large players at the time. Even when we were told to burn margins down to (or even below) cost to make the sale, we were expressly forbidden to do so on any brand that utilized MAP. Doing so would jeopardize the company's contracts with those brands and effectively get it blacklisted from receiving product from those MAP companies in the future. People were let go if they deviated regardless of whether they went below MAP as a mistake or on purpose to get the sale.
Overpriced Japanese-made Spyderco folders with G-10 (nothing fancy): Stretch2 (ZDP-189): $233.97 Chinook4 (S30V): $224.42 Opus (S30V): $217.72 Karahawk Black (VG-10): $217.72 Tatanka (VG-10): $214.47 D'Allara3 (S30V): $211.22 Lil' Temperance3 (S30V): $211.22 Civilian (VG-10): $201.47 Karahawk (VG-10): $198.22 Police4 (K390): $188.47 Ouroboros (VG-10): $188.47 Q Ball (VG-10): $178.72 Roc (VG-10): $175.47
At those prices, the G-10 Japanese Spydies can only disappoint. The FRN Japanese Spydies are still winners. And supposedly a Police 4 will be offered with FRN scales in the distant future.
Probably beating a dead horse, but I don't get all the complaining about price increases. We'll all free to vote with our wallet. Re the Shaman, it could be that production costs are higher or it could be that demand went up and it made sense to increase the price. And all the reviews on the Shaman are fantastic. I'm likely not buying one (too large for me) but it still looks like a great knife at the new price. Consider this: if one of you complaining about prices has a Grimsmo knife you paid $600 for that is NIB, would you sell it to me for $650? The answer is "of course not." Demand has gone up and production is limited. That always translates to higher prices. Why should we be able to charge what the market will pay but not knife manufacturers?
Hi Rip, FYI, At Spyderco, our prices and margins are relatively fixed. We operate with enough margin to maintain our staff and grow steadily. We don't "charge as much as the market will bear". I know that is the conventional method in business, maximize profit, but we feel that to charge as much as the market will bear is biting the hand that feeds you. We don't raise prices because there is more demand, we just try to make more product, when possible. If it's not possible, then our customers have to wait until we can make more. Our vendors all have capacity. We try to keep them working, but we don't want to reduce quality to increase quantity. Just our ways, if you will. Quality knives are hard to build and a great deal of attention needs to be placed on maintaining a high level of quality, while still doing CQI, offer variety in design and materials and try to please our customers. sal
Thanks Sal. I didn't mean to imply any kind of behavior on Spyderco's part - was just speculating on how business typically price things. Unfair of me to suggest what Spydero may or may not be doing.
Thanks for the reply Sal. That kind of regard for the customers has proven very wise. Thanks for what you offer us. Possibly the best options in the industry. I just wish that you could avoid map . I feel that policy has been detrimental to some other companies. I ve always thought the value Spyderco offered for the price was one of the company s strengths.
Hi problem Rip, I just thought a peek into our core values might assist in your understanding of our company, which, I believe maybe different than many others. Hi Whp, Time will tell. We "hope" it's the best direction. If it's not, we'll adjust. We ALWAYS try to do the right things for the right reasons. Honor has a very high value for all of us at Spyderco. sal
@Sal Glesser I only have one complaint with the recent pricing changes and that is with some models seeing both a change in MAP & MSRP we are seeing ~%20 increase in price which is a pretty steep jump and we feel both the hits. I wish that this was something that could have been done separately to easy in the pricing changes.
Hi Pirate, Our prices change only when they have to. In some cases, we eat the increase for a year or so. In some cases, prices to us went up too much to eat. In some cases, The original price was estimated, but actual production came out more costly than estimated. If you can tell me some way that we can reduce costs without lowering quality, I'm all ears? sal
The price increase is significant, much more than the 8% I was expecting. Since the increase I have spent my $ elsewhere I took a fresh look at other knife makers and have voted with my wallet. Ill probably come back for Shaman sprint or when I forget the “good old days when prices were reasonable” For the time being... a 20% price hike is bitter pill to swallow
You will see 8.33% for any MAP increase and an average of ~20% for any that also saw a price increase and I hear @Sal Glesser it is just a hard hit to suffer both at the same time. I could talk about issues with MAP but those issues are not limited to Spyderco and is something that would be ideal to have input from the vendors who adhere to MAP.
Items like the Shaman are seeing ~20% price jump because items that got a price increase saw an increase of ~10% and combined with the change in MAP down to 35%.
Prices go up over time. Spyderco makes great knives so if I like a knife and the price is reasonable I'll buy it.
