Bad Rip off by KEN LEUNG aka “Shadymethods”

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I'm not out to scam anyone and I think my reputation proves that. The name "ShadyMethods" was just an inside joke with friends back when I never thought I'd get this far into the hobby. I also never refused a refund. I've messed up more than a few times in the past and I always offered an apology and cash back, but only when I screwed up. With all due respect, I just don't think it's fair to me to take the knife back when there's no proof that there's anything wrong with it. I carried it myself with no issues.

I don't know what you like in a knife. If you had asked about the action or detent before, I would have gladly told you. You need to ask questions before, not react to it after. I wasn't rushing you or forcing you to buy it right away, and I certainly wasn't forcing you to pay F&F. I gave it as a option because you gave me an offer that was more than $150 off my list price and I was doing my best to work with you.
 
Hta_evo8 said:
Then, he starts claiming that the frame is out of alignment with the blade. I know that's not the case so I ask for proof on 2/26/18. He never gets back to me and now he opens up a GBU thread over a month later.
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In fact you agree to a return if I can prove that there’s no detent. I sent you the picts in 2 different emails and follow up with a third one asking if you’re going to give me a refund. How convenient that these last 3 emails got lost.
As far as the frame, it MIGHT be out of alignment just from eyeing it, but I could be wrong, I’m not a knife maker
I have 2 knives on Teflon washer, the Lionsteel SR2 and correct me if I’m wrong but the half track is as well. So I know what a proper functioning knife on Teflon washers feels like.
For all I know this one may have something different altogether[/QUOTE]

Old email I found:

ybodpm LY <LYBODPM@msn.com>
Mon 2/26/2018, 5:54 PM

I'm calm enough now to take a closer look at it.
There's NO detent because the nipple on the detent bar that's supposed to fall into the hole drilled into the blade and catch it does not line up. The frame of the knife, front and back look slightly out of alignment. SO YES THIS A DEFECTIVE UNIT.


I don't know. You seemed pretty sure of yourself here. The knife has a light detent so the detent hole drilled for the ball probably doesn't allow ball to sit inside as deep as the Shiro.
 
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I refrain myself from pointing out the obvious all this time but...
What a Novel idea
Make the detent super light so as to be imperceptible and the action stiff to keep the blade in the handle
The opposite of what everyone else is doing.
 
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In general a transaction is not complete until both parties are satisfied. At least that used to be the way it is around here. Thie buyer should return the knife at his cost and upon receipt the seller should provide a refund. The buyer should not have to justify it. If there is no problem and the knife is priced properly it should resell. If the buyer has monkeyed with the knife that is another story entirely.
 
Triton said:
In general a transaction is not complete until both parties are satisfied. At least that used to be the way it is around here. Thie buyer should return the knife at his cost and upon receipt the seller should provide a refund. The buyer should not have to justify it. If there is no problem and the knife is priced properly it should resell. If the buyer has monkeyed with the knife that is another story entirely.
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Generally, I agree with you but this seems to have taken place back in Feb. I mean, at some point you have to place a "statute of limitations" on these things. There's no such thing as a 6 week "trial period".
 
ooitzoo said:
Generally, I agree with you but this seems to have taken place back in Feb. I mean, at some point you have to place a "statute of limitations" on these things. There's no such thing as a 6 week "trial period".
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I would have to agree that a buyer should be able to ascertain satisfaction on simple knife purchase within a day or two. Six weeks is ridiculous and unfair to the seller.
 
ooitzoo said:
Generally, I agree with you but this seems to have taken place back in Feb. I mean, at some point you have to place a "statute of limitations" on these things. There's no such thing as a 6 week "trial period".
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I do agree with that also, I was under the impression that the six weeks was spent in wrangling, if that's not the case I would agree that at some point (something like a week at most) the buyer should not be able to ask for a refund out of the blue.
 
^
Might want to check out the date in the email guys.
Within the hour of receiving the knife I emailed him telling him It is not working properly. In the ensuing days, We exchange emails
Back and forth but I can tell from the tone of his first email, he wasn’t
Gonna take it back
I waited until now to post because of work, taxes, etc....I just don’t have time to deal with it.
 
Timeline

paid on 2/16/18 and received the item on 2/24/18. On that same day, I told him the knife is not functioning properly
2/26/18 was the last time I ask for a refund
2/27/18 was his last email
2/28/18 I sent picts of the knife in fully closed and partially open trying to show the detent ball
3/2/18 I sent 2 more emails again with same pict
No response from him
 
And there has to be a reason for the return. So far the OP can't prove that. Tire kickers aren't welcome here. And if he really cared about protecting himself from getting a bad example he would have paid with goods and services.

When honorable members make a mistake in buying a knife they no longer want, they take the loss and resell.
 
Just want to chime in here to corroborate. I've had several positive transactions with Ken over more than a year. He's a great guy to work with (holds knives I'm interested in, negotiable on price/value, etc). I'm not the only one he treats well, as we can see from his feedback. I doubt that Ken would refuse a refund request without valid reason.
 
craytab said:
When honorable members make a mistake in buying a knife they no longer want, they take the loss and resell.
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I did that lol. Explained my situation on the 15 I got from blademan and traded it to ernie:thumbsup: All parties happy.

Other than that, I'm thinkin of changing my account name to StellarHitler or SketchyStrat :D:p;)
 
Just another side note here , I am an international buyer here and Ken was great man to deal with for 3 times , I just felt the need to share it here.
I personally will keep on buying from him in the future.
 
We've yet to see proof of defect. We also haven't seen proof that the seller has seen proof of defect.

I've got to agree with craytab craytab , tire kickers aren't welcome. Based on what's currently posted in the thread, there's no evidence of anyone being scammed.

A buyer isn't happy with a purchase, but can't seem to provide any proof of his defect claims and he screwed himself out of recourse by electing to save a whopping 2% on a $650 knife.
 
Hta_evo8 said:
He ask me to do PP FF and because of his stellar 200+ positive ratings, I didn’t hesitate, a perfect setup.
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Hta_evo8 said:
Is there any chance you'd be willing to go up just a bit to $665 Goods and Services (or $650 Friends and Family) for the Skinwalker.
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We don't have proof of defect. We do however have proof that you lied about the circumstances by which you came to pay F&F instead of G&S.

Is there a sleuthing reward? I like trophies.
 
I feel this is buyer's remorse, just because the action is stiff and detent is very light doesn't mean there is something wrong with the knife, that may just be how this particular model is made to be. I've had a similar situation where the buyer was not happy about something that is very common with this particular knife and was reluctant to do a refund. In the end I agreed to accept the return and made a mental note not to do business with this person anymore. The transaction called into question on this thread is for a much higher dollar amount and can really inconvenience the seller in this situation, assuming this is buyer's remorse I feel the seller shouldn't be obligated to refund the knife.
 
Casinostocks said:
I don't think that it would be considered as "nannying" or diminishing the freedom of choice, if Blade Forums stipulates in its Exchange rules that F&F transaction are prohibited and therefore can be reported with the ads removed and infractions handed down to multiple offenders. I know that this is a huge and heavy burden on the Forum's mods but perhaps one dedicated mod just for the Exchanges to both encounter and combat such shady (no pun) practices?

P.S. not taking the OP's side but we see way too many of these F&F transactions gone wrong. Some new comers just think that it's a normal way of doing business here if they don't bother to read the rules or simply skim over them. Again the fault is on them but there are such frauds taking place on the Exchange.
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I agree but we've been shut down on this issue by the mods. They don't want to babysit the exchange, I guess.

I agree that the buyer should have never paid F&F but I don't know why shadymethods is getting a pass on offering it as an option. They're both ethically in the wrong here from the get-go. I don't buy shady's excuse that he only offered F&F because he was so far off his asking price. If you can't come to an agreement on asking price you shouldn't do the deal. Instead these two decide to cheat PayPal, who may be a huge corporation but at least they are operating in good faith.
 
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SpySmasher said:
I agree but we've been shut down on this issue by the mods. They don't want to babysit the exchange, I guess.

I agree that the buyer should have never paid F&F but I don't know why shadymethods is getting a pass on offering it as an option. They're both ethically in the wrong here from the get-go. I don't buy shady's excuse that he only offered F&F because he was so far off his asking price. If you can't come to an agreement on asking price you shouldn't do the deal. Instead these two decide to cheat PayPal, who may be a huge corporation but at least they are operating in good faith.
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I agree about offering F&F as an option being wrong, but it's not a scam. The OP copied in an email where ShadyMethods ShadyMethods clearly stated that it was $665 G&S or $650 F&F. Fair enough in my book. The OP opted to pay F&F and is now reaping those rewards.

That being said, even with G&S he'd have to prove that there's a fault with the knife. He's yet to do that. He's also failed to prove that he sent ShadyMethods ShadyMethods proof of a defect. He did however provide proof, if you'll see my quotes in a post above, that he flat out lied about the circumstances surrounding the F&F payment.

I think the only fault we can lay on ShadyMethods ShadyMethods at this point is that he accepted an F&F payment which is frowned upon, but hardly uncommon.
 
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