Robbed of $1500 by Crusader Forge Knives

[Pellel2]

Pedro, read my comments again. Just to clarify Pellel2 and I are good friends on this forum. Though his views are a lil wacked on this one, he and I will still continue being buds and have already said good morning via email.

Hey Sean, if we lived closer we would be debating this over some eggs and bacon! ! Got mail your way today bud!!

 

[Striderco]

I ve emailed and canceled my order with CF! I don't need anymore headaches! And I think their response was BS!! If you dont take care of a matter such as this what else is the customer left to do?! Why not ask a bunch of knife nuts for suggestions?! I feel CF should have at least given us a brief side of their story!! I think that response was worse than not saying anything at all! Like someone else said their reputation is forever tarnished! And I will never buy one of their products!!

 

[338375]

Where is the OP ?
If someone is going to start a thread like this they need to keep it updated.
This could now be settled for all we know.

Did you send the knife back ?
Was a refund given, or did you decide to keep the knife after they agreed to refund you for the things they added on ?

Please let us know if this has been settled.

I agree Ken. I know sometimes people get busy with life, but he took the time to write the issue originally, and for the amount of money involved, there needs to be updates... Good or bad. Besides, if the situation has been handled privately, he needs to make sure that people know the maker did the right thing. It doesn't change the fact that the original dealing was beyond ridiculous, but the good, if any, needs to be posted as well.

Listen up! This is a rough situation and emotions get involved as people take sides. Lets stick to the topic, as Ken44 just said, lets get an update.

It's one thing to analyze the deal from the buyer and seller viewpoint. It's not a good idea for the commenters to start commenting on each other.

That is the problem with these threads. Once they get a little off track, they seem to really deteriorate, and turn in to nothing more than a place for members to argue.
Until the OP posts again with an update, there really isn't anything positive or negative to be added. Just personal opinions on they would they would deal with the situation, or how they think the OP should deal with it.

 

[magnumb]

In Washington State, I'm fairly certain that a 'victim' can receive up to 3X's the original amount of his loss. This lawful and appropriate calculation of restitution makes perfect sense given the time, effort, duress, frustration that a customer/victim has to endure just to be able to acquire or end up with what he/she had initially intended to acquire.

Time, effort, frustration, having to deal with those not showing any integrity or honesty, prolonging an acquisition promised considerably sooner, being forced to be continually suspicious and watchful of a particular seller/company/business because your dealings with them so far has rightfully placed you in such a state of mind......................all issues out of your control after a transaction has been agreed to and as per the Washington State law, receiving up to 3X's your loss seems both reasonable and extremely justifiable.

I hope that the OP is made whole..........and then some.

 

[Thomas Linton]

In Washington State, I'm fairly certain that a 'victim' can receive up to 3X's the original amount of his loss. This lawful and appropriate calculation of restitution makes perfect sense given the time, effort, duress, frustration that a customer/victim has to endure just to be able to acquire or end up with what he/she had initially intended to acquire.

Time, effort, frustration, having to deal with those not showing any integrity or honesty, prolonging an acquisition promised considerably sooner, being forced to be continually suspicious and watchful of a particular seller/company/business because your dealings with them so far has rightfully placed you in such a state of mind......................all issues out of your control after a transaction has been agreed to and as per the Washington State law, receiving up to 3X's your loss seems both reasonable and extremely justifiable.

I hope that the OP is made whole..........and then some.

Neither the buyer or seller is in Washington.
If the buyer and seller were in Washington, the statute does not apply. Hangman Ridge Training Stables, Inc. v. Safeco Title Insurance Co..

In Yemen, they might cut off a body part.

 

[Lycosa]

fwiw- On the green forum, no one can chime in unless they are directly involved in the matter.
rolf

 

[Boggsy]

Always hate hearing about stuff like this going on, especially with popular knifemakers, especially ones I at one point considered making a purchase from. I had been surprised when I visited Crusader's website and found that I actually could place an order then and there- When most other knife-makers of their standing in the custom world had closed books. Struck me odd, and I decided against the impulse to say "oooh, someone'll make me a knife". Now I'm glad I held back.

To the OP- I certainly hope you were made whole... To CF, I hope you a)make the OP happy, b)can learn from this and do the right thing (might mean closing your books for the time being, probably) and c) get over your aversion to Forums (or "the public", to paraphrase).

 

[JohnWE]

Always hate hearing about stuff like this going on, especially with popular knifemakers, especially ones I at one point considered making a purchase from. I had been surprised when I visited Crusader's website and found that I actually could place an order then and there- When most other knife-makers of their standing in the custom world had closed books. Struck me odd, and I decided against the impulse to say "oooh, someone'll make me a knife". Now I'm glad I held back.

To the OP- I certainly hope you were made whole... To CF, I hope you a)make the OP happy, b)can learn from this and do the right thing (might mean closing your books for the time being, probably) and c) get over your aversion to Forums (or "the public", to paraphrase).

You've discovered the Catch 22 of the custom knife buying world. The makers who'll take your money and an order are the ones you probably don't wanna do business with in the first place...

Obviously there are exceptions to the rule but a perusal of threads here confirms the theory. Virtually every thread consists of someone paying in advance and then getting shafted by the "artist", all of whom apparently bought the same faulty, hacked, computers and phones and all of them have a small, loud, and persistent group of fans and enablers that will defend their reprehensible acts til the cows come home for a chance to suck up to some clown who calls themself a knifemaker.

 

[Raymond1000]

Where is the OP ?
If someone is going to start a thread like this they need to keep it updated.
This could now be settled for all we know.

Did you send the knife back ?
Was a refund given, or did you decide to keep the knife after they agreed to refund you for the things they added on ?

Please let us know if this has been settled.

smcjoecohen@yahoo Started this post Thursday afternoon. It’s a bit early to accuse him of post-and-run. Especially if nothing has changed at his end.

Given the attitude taken by Crusader Forge, the best he might expect in a scant two days is an email full of promises or protests. If he has, yes he should update.

 

[Alpha Knife Supply]

You've discovered the Catch 22 of the custom knife buying world. The makers who'll take your money and an order are the ones you probably don't wanna do business with in the first place...

That is a very bad generalization.

Chuck

 

[JR88FAN]

You've discovered the Catch 22 of the custom knife buying world. The makers who'll take your money and an order are the ones you probably don't wanna do business with in the first place...

Obviously there are exceptions to the rule but a perusal of threads here confirms the theory. Virtually every thread consists of someone paying in advance and then getting shafted by the "artist", all of whom apparently bought the same faulty, hacked, computers and phones and all of them have a small, loud, and persistent group of fans and enablers that will defend their reprehensible acts til the cows come home for a chance to suck up to some clown who calls themself a knifemaker.

+1

It seems to be the common theme.....

 

[JR88FAN]

Hey my comments regarded crusader willing to deal with the matter privately, regarding the OP issues it shows the poor side of crusaders business. Whatever Crusader has to say about the OP will certainly contradict the OP and it will not help the OP fix the situation. It is better if he doesn't do that and deals with the issue privately. I am sure the OP wouod rather have the issue fixed rather than to prove whose story is right. If that sounds like flattering a thieve sorry.



I would much rather see a post of the OP fixed his issues than crusader trying to prove which side of the story is real.

No disrespect, But the OP has been trying to deal with this privately for some time....
Read page #1....
It did not work, and that's why he is here.

 

[Alpha Knife Supply]

fwiw- On the green forum, no one can chime in unless they are directly involved in the matter.
rolf

I think this would be a great improvement.

Chuck

 

[ooitzoo]

Hey my comments regarded crusader willing to deal with the matter privately, regarding the OP issues it shows the poor side of crusaders business. Whatever Crusader has to say about the OP will certainly contradict the OP and it will not help the OP fix the situation. It is better if he doesn't do that and deals with the issue privately. I am sure the OP wouod rather have the issue fixed rather than to prove whose story is right. If that sounds like flattering a thieve sorry.

I would much rather see a post of the OP fixed his issues than crusader trying to prove which side of the story is real.

Really? I'm not sure how an apology and a refund will offend or contradict the OP.

 

[Thomas Linton]

I think this would be a great improvement.

Chuck

Why?

I can imagine cases where public pressure makes it worse.

I have witnessed public pressure get remedies for the victim.

If there were no moderators, I might see such a rule. As it is . . . . .

 

[Knifenutty]

I used to listen to my dad and his friends talking about their work, and realized that whatever business they were in, the had the same goal. Satisfy the customer.

Mine used to say Remember in business you need customers to continue being a business....Customers however don't need you to continue to be a customer..

 

[JR88FAN]

I think this would be a great improvement.

Chuck

This is a great ideal....

Lets hide this kind of stuff, and essentially take away one of the most important functions of a forum, to help identify and disclose issues in the hobby we are all here to enjoy together.

CF has been invited to make this right, explain their side, and turn this into a huge PR win for their business.
They have decided to take the opportunity and do nothing with it.
That was their choice, and we all live and die by our decisions.

How hard would it have been for Maciej to come on here, appologize to the OP, and make this right?
How hard would it have been for him to come and present a case of why the OP is wrong?

Either one would have led to this all going away, but as it stands, CF's actions against the OP, coupled with their silence, is something we as the ones that keep these guys in business, need to know about...

 

[Alpha Knife Supply]

Why?

Because all the superfluous comments from posters who are not involved would be gone. There is so much garbage in this thread it has become almost worthless.

Let the people involved speak for themselves. This rule works well in other places. It definitely focuses the conversation and eliminates dog piling.

Chuck

 

[CapitalizedLiving]

I am a dealer for Crusader Forge and can confirm that this is how the ordering process with Crusader Forge is.
First of all, I have to say that Kathy and Maciej are wonderful people. I met them for the first time at last year's USN Gathering and they are just extremely nice. I don't believe there is one mean bone in their bodies. Maciej is also a volunteer firefighter and that takes up a lot of his time.

My first order with Crusader Forge was for 3 folders and 3 fixed blades. It took 1 year to get the folders and more than 2 years to get the fixed blades.

The second order from them took about 8 months and the third order took about the same amount of time.

Prior to ordering, I knew that it was going to take a while and we were prepared to put aside some funds and wait. For an end user, that is usually not desirable.

Kathy's default response will always be "2 weeks." She tells that to everyone, including us. There is always a delay. There is always something else going on. That is just how Crusader Forge is if you want to deal directly with them.

I am not sure why Crusader Forge even entertains the idea that they should sell directly to the end consumer; it doesn't make sense for a shop that small to take on thousands of orders from thousands of individuals. It takes custom software just to sort my customers and make sure things run smoothly; and my business partner is a freakin' software engineer.

Based on the way I see things handled in the feedback about them, in my mind I see Kathy using spreadsheet software from MS DOS 6.11
This is unfortunate because I really like their folders and I am not the only one.

I hope that you guys don't treat Kathy and Maciej with any disrespect at the Blade Show despite how orders are being handled. After speaking with them, it does not feel like they are out to make enemies. It seems as though they are overwhelmed with the demand and being a small shop, it is difficult for them to catch up. When Kathy says "two weeks" I feel like she is a die-hard optimist and she truly thinks and wants the knives to be ready by then.

I'd recommend against purchasing a knife directly from them as it is truly a hassle and instead go through a dealer that doesn't jack up the prices.

Dang. Those are terrible excuses. And for inexcusable behavior. Not sure why you bothered.

 

[Esav Benyamin]

fwiw- On the green forum, no one can chime in unless they are directly involved in the matter.
rolf

Unfortunately, it isn't worth much, since each website has its own dynamic. They have other aspects that aren't much help. Yes, we can always learn from each other. But since I tried twice to register there and got no response, for better or worse, they mean nothing to me.

Our system has been notably successful recently. If this comes at the cost of offensive posts by bystanders, I will accept that if the original parties involved come to an agreeable resolution. Those who find the rough and tumble offensive can find other threads to read.