Sebenza Overrated?

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Mr. Reeve's knives holds an edge for me just fine for my fishing adventures, cutting up boxes, cutting up my dinner, making marshmellow sticks for my kids, etc... I have some other super steels, M2, ZDP-189, elmax, etc... and I see no significant advantage in my everyday use. I do love me some CPM-154 though... nice edge taking knife and polishes very good. But even that doesn't hold an edge as long as S30V.
 
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Ankerson said:
It's not just in testing that I am talking about.

I really do use my knives....

S30V just doesn't hold an edge as long as some other steels and it's very noticeable.
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I'm not disagreeing, I'm just saying that it's "good enough" for a lot of users, makers, and manufacturers you know? I would love a Seb in zdp, m390, m4, s90 you name it but for the cost increase that would bring I'd rather go with some Hoss lovin' and an AEB-L damascus blade or something.

Les George I believe still uses 154cm
 
Incahiker said:
Mr. Reeve's holds an edge for me just fine for my fishing adventures, cutting up boxes, cutting up my dinner, making marshmellow sticks for my kids, etc... I have some other super steels, M2, ZDP-189, elmax, etc... and I see no significant advantage in my everyday use. I do love me some CPM-154 though... nice edge taking knife and polishes very good. But even that doesn't hold an edge as long as S30V.
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You think S30V will hold an edge Longer than CPM-154.....

Not from my experiences it won't. ;)
 
Mr. Clean said:
I'm not disagreeing, I'm just saying that it's "good enough" for a lot of users, makers, and manufacturers you know? I would love a Seb in zdp, m390, m4, s90 you name it but for the cost increase that would bring I'd rather go with some Hoss lovin' and an AEB-L damascus blade or something.

Les George I believe still uses 154cm
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I agree, but I doubt the price would go up that much if at all unless he started using S90V or M390.
 
Ankerson said:
You think S30V will hold an edge Longer than CPM-154.....

Not from my experiences it won't. ;)
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Testing side by side with CPM-154 cutting a ton of hickory out in my front porch CPM-154 wore out before S30V... but they are both quite good. I love CPM-154 for the extreme edge it can take. S30V doesn't hold it's extreme edge as long but it holds a normal edge that can push cut paper for a long period of time, at least that is what my test told me. Yes they were both sharpened at the same angles, CPM-154 was heat treated by Bos... blah blah blah.. we are splitting hairs here...
 
Incahiker said:
Testing side by side with CPM-154 cutting a ton of hickory out in my front porch CPM-154 wore out before S30V... but they are both quite good. I love CPM-154 for the extreme edge it can take. S30V doesn't hold it's extreme edge as long but it holds a normal edge that can push cut paper for a long period of time, at least that is what my test told me. Yes they were both sharpened at the same angles, CPM-154 was heat treated by Bos... blah blah blah.. we are splitting hairs here...
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From my data on rope CPM-154 @ 62 RC is right even with ZDP-189 and I am talking almost cut for cut.
 
Well, lets put it this way. One day I got sick of reading everyones tests they did and their results, everyones results were different. So I decided to take all my knives and cut a ton of hickory, cardboard boxes, etc.... and in the end I made my decision that all these different steels are really just splitting hairs. Sure some might hold an edge longer then other, but there is no Phenomenal difference between them all. I mean Bucks 420HC wasn't really that far behind all the supposed super steels that can cut through adamantium bank vault doors, etc.... hell your average guy wouldn't probably care for the difference of bucks 420HC vs any other super steel. I know I still love Buck's 420HC because it too can take a very keen edge and it will hold it for a nice long time, and when it does lose it, it takes no time to put the edge back onto it. Those are great characteristics to have in a knife. There is really not that huge of a difference unless you are sitting there counting the slices you are making in a rope :rolleyes:.... no offense to you, but really, I think that is the only setting where you will know a huge difference. When we use our knives hard we can not controll everything our edge touches and sometimes it with knick a nail, hit some sand, etc... some stuff where none of these super steels edges can possibly keep from rolling, chipping, and dulling.



Ankerson said:
From my data on rope CPM-154 @ 62 RC is right even with ZDP-189 and I am talking almost cut for cut.
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I thought this thread was about the sebenza being overrated not blade steels?
 
Incahiker said:
Well, lets put it this way. One day I got sick of reading everyones tests they did and their results, everyones results were different. So I decided to take all my knives and cut a ton of hickory, cardboard boxes, etc.... and in the end I made my decision that all these different steels are really just splitting hairs. Sure some might hold an edge longer then other, but there is no Phenomenal difference between them all. I mean Bucks 420HC wasn't really that far behind all the supposed super steels that can cut through adamantium bank vault doors, etc.... hell your average guy wouldn't probably care for the difference of bucks 420HC vs any other super steel. I know I still love Buck's 420HC because it too can take a very keen edge and it will hold it for a nice long time, and when it does lose it, it takes no time to put the edge back onto it. Those are great characteristics to have in a knife. There is really not that huge of a difference unless you are sitting there counting the slices you are making in a rope :rolleyes:....
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I haven't posted the data that I am compiling now, waiting to get steels to run before I post it. ;)

It will be alittle while yet before I have enough data to post, 3 or 4 more steels to run. Once I am done those I will post it then add to it as needed.
 
MikeC said:
I thought this thread was about the sebenza being overrated not blade steels?
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I do think the blade steels have a part to do with the sebenza since S30V seems to be over rated, making the sebenza over rated :cool:, back on topic :D
 
KennyB said:
First of all, I never expressed an opinion about the quality of the Sebenza except to say that I would not appreciate the level of craftsmanship and the difference in fit and tolerances.
My point is that you are no position to express an opinion based on the fact that you have NEVER SEEN ONE

You claim that I'm "uninformed" in making that decison, but I ask you why I should have to handle the knife to decide that slightly better tolerances than knives I can get for much cheaper is worth the extra money.
I have no answer for that save to say that if you don't know why it is important to see the knife before you are able to express an informed decision.......well good luck

The idea that a person can't possibly make a decision about whether a knife is for them without holding it is pretty silly
This is a $400 knife if you want to give an informed decision on a public forum to others you should at least have had the experience of seeing one

Bottom line though is that I really don't need to hold one to know that it's not worth the money based on my standards of value, because I probably wouldn't even spend $200-$300 on a folder, that's more money than I'm willing to spend on a knife regardless of its quality.
To make another analogy, I would spend a little extra to drive a Lexus instead of a Toyota, but that's all I need; I wouldn't even entertain the idea of spending a couple hundred grand on a Ferrari, because to me the strive for the utmost quality of craftsmanship is not my top priority.
So really what this is about is what you are prepared to spend on a folder rather than a valid informed decision about the knife.
It is to expensive for your needs so therefore it is a poor choice

to insinuate that I can't form an opinion like that without holding it is to suggest that the knife would somehow have some instant quality imperceivable to me until holding it
I am not insinuating it I am actually saying it

At the end of the day though, it's all subjective and opinion
True but most of the people here that are giving their opinion either good or bad HAVE ACTUALLY SEEN A SEBENZA
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By the way your typing skills are impressive!:D
 
The Sebenza is overrated. After owning one for a few months, I came to the conclusion that it is a mediocre knife design that is nicely made.

I think the common mistake is assuming that paying a lot for a sebenza and enjoying it is equivalent to appreciating the (excessive) quality.

What has happened is that people who buy a sebenza and like it now feel aristocratic, as if they have superior taste and abilities to discern quality. Other people get this vibe and the sebenza gains fame as a status symbol rather than a good knife. Now when someone buys a sebenza, there is a subtle pressure to like it; if you dont like it, you are unsophisticated and have undeveloped taste in knives. So, many people rave about the Sebenza as proof that they are sophisticated knife enthusiasts, even if they just like how it looks or feels. And the cycle begins again...

I've never been popular for my ideas though. :p
 
Incahiker said:
I do think the blade steels have a part to do with the sebenza since S30V seems to be over rated, making the sebenza over rated :cool:, back on topic :D
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Yeah it has a lot to do with it really, now that S30V has been out for along time.

If in fact the rumors are true and CRK does switch to S35VN it will be very interesting. :thumbup:
 
Jim, I believe they will end up switching over eventually. They already use S35VN in the Nyala (liked a fixed blade version of the Seb). But S35Vn isn't that different from S30V by all accounts. It's just a little tougher is all.

Ankerson said:
Yeah it has a lot to do with it really, now that S30V has been out for along time.

If in fact the rumors are true and CRK does switch to S35VN it will be very interesting. :thumbup:
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Buffalohump said:
Jim, I believe they will end up switching over eventually. They already use S35VN in the Nyala (liked a fixed blade version of the Seb). But S35Vn isn't that different from S30V by all accounts. It's just a little tougher is all.
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It's improved vers of S30V from what I heard.

I did test S35VN on cardboard awhile back and it did very well.
 
I've owned several sebenzas over the last five years and I ended up selling all of them. They're great, but I was just too nervous to use them hard. I've found that the best knife for me is priced b/w 100 and 150. If they get too far above that, I won't use them easily.
 
So getting back on topic, it appears that people buy Sebenzas for one or more of the following reasons:

Function
Aesthetics
Pride of Ownership

Have I missed anything? If not, here's how I'd rate the Sebenza in these areas:

Function: 9 out of 10. It's hard to argue with the tolerances Chris Reeve achieves on his folders. From what I can gather, the Sebenza really is the standard against which other PRODUCTION Ti framelocks can rightly be judged.

Aesthetics: 7 out of 10. The Sebenza is just OK-looking as far as I'm concerned. The design has been around for a long time and it's pretty stale at this point. I like the look of the Buck Mayo better.

Pride of Ownership: 9 out of 10. The only other PRODUCTION folders I can think of that carry more prestige than a Sebenza are those made by William Henry.
 
Ankerson said:
Yeah it has a lot to do with it really, now that S30V has been out for along time.

If in fact the rumors are true and CRK does switch to S35VN it will be very interesting. :thumbup:
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Let's hope they decide to up the Rockwell, to where the steel is optimized. Not just a compromise that they decided upon, so that it's easier to sharpen in the field.
 
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